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Solar Panels???

Submitted: Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 14:45

BartWawa

Article Overview - Solar Power
This article is aimed towards the motorhome/caravan traveller, but is equally relevant to anyone trying to make use of solar energy to power devices whilst on-the-road. View Full Article...
G’day peoples,

I am looking at getting solar panels to run the 80ltr fridge, A couple of lights and a radio while we are camping but have no idea what set up would be best.

The situation is we are heading to Cape Arid in January and will be parked up for approx. 10 days as mentioned before I would like to be able to keep the above running for the duration.

I have seen some setups on EBay but they seem to be a hell of a lot cheaper than the ones I have seen in the shops. Does anyone have any experiences with EBay bought solar set ups particularly (LINKS) All Solar or Luxury Home Products.



Any advice appreciated

Bart
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ThreadID: 73614 Replies: 5
Views: 786 FollowUps: 16
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AnswerID: 390492   Submitted: Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 17:28

Mandrake's Solar Power replied:

Not sure about those 2 particular suppliers but there are a couple of advertisers on this website who sell solar generation sets for camping - I am not one of them my panels are normally for permanent mounting on vehicles or caravans - Check the directory tag and click on accessories . You may find what you seek .

Rgds

Mandrake
Mandrake's Solar Power Mandrake's Solar Power
Business Member: My Profile
Reply 1 of 5
AnswerID: 390509   Submitted: Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 19:15

robertbruce replied:

if your stationary camping for ten days the roof-mounted-panels will keep the batteries fresh while every other day or two youll ned to run the car or generator to recharge the batteries....

the consumption of most fridges far outweighs the ability of most panels and budgets to kee stuff charged, unless you've got a coaster-bus roof full of them...
Reply 2 of 5
FollowupID: 658336   Submitted: Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 22:55

Dennis Ellery posted:

Rubbish - On sunny days a good 125 watt panel and PWM regulator will run a 40 litre fridge, a TV plus a couple of lights like flouros or LEDS and top up the deepcycle battery for night running.
FollowUp 1 of 14
FollowupID: 658338   Submitted: Sunday, Nov 08, 2009 at 23:04

Lex M (Brisbane) posted:

Agree with the 125watt for a 40 litre but if you're running an 80 litre fridge/freezer you'll probably have to go to about 200 or larger.
Cheers

Lex M
FollowUp 2 of 14
FollowupID: 658430   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 19:59

robertbruce posted:

so yo0u guys are claiming that solar panels alone will keep this bloke fridge plus the other stuff running for ten days... your drunk!!!!!!!!!!
FollowUp 3 of 14
FollowupID: 658442   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 20:28

Maîneÿ . . . posted:

My ~200 Watt system runs 24/7 for months at a time in the bush, with-out registering under 12 Volts @ the AGM's, so yes, I will emphatically say a solar system will run everything on a permanent basis when camped in the bush with no assistance from any external devices, when *correctly specified* for those devices it is expected to run.

Maîneÿ . . .
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FollowUp 4 of 14
FollowupID: 658445   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 20:38

robertbruce posted:

so you've got 200 watts of panel on your camper's roof running 12v through a commonly available regulator installed by a commonly trained sparky??? i doubt it....

the only way this bloke is goig to get something "correctly specified" if he learns the trade and does it himself, else he will get ripped-off, like so many others that have passed these pages.....

btw, your fridge is 40litrs, his is 80... so in your own words..."The easy way to tell you what "is best" for you"

he would need 400watts and a coaster-bus-roof area to keep his running......

FollowUp 5 of 14
FollowupID: 658449   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 20:57

Maîneÿ . . . posted:

robertbruce,
Please get your facts correct.

Yes, I've got ~200 watts of panel laying horizontal on my roof 24/7
Yes, it’s running 12v through a commonly available regulator (Steca)
BUT… "installed by a commonly trained sparky" … No bloody way!!!

I installed the entire power system, I'm not "commonly trained" it was bloody time consuming and expensive, there was nothing "common" about it at all.

My fridge is actually a 7O Lt Fridge / Freezer, drawing more Amps than a 80 Lt Waeco.

My system has been installed since 1997 and I know how & why it works or I would have used an extra battery or an extra few Watts in the Solar system.

As I say please get at least some of your facts correct, he needs less than I use

Maîneÿ . . .
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FollowUp 6 of 14
FollowupID: 658466   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 21:48

robertbruce posted:

Mainey...

I did not mean you as common, i was refferring to the common-rip-off mechant.....

but your quote, which i agree with totally, says it all...

"I installed the entire power system, I'm not "commonly trained" it was bloody time consuming and expensive, there was nothing "common" about it at all."

so what hope have we common folk got of getting it right.....

I've bought two fridge and power solutions in the last thirty years.
The salesman says..."Yeah mate, youll get tens days out of it", the first one got away with it but the second one didn't....

won't happen to me eh!
FollowUp 7 of 14
FollowupID: 658470   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 22:11

Dennis Ellery posted:

Me and a mate just spent a couple of weeks in the bush.
He had a 125w panel and 40Litre Wacoe – I had a 40litre Engle with 130w panel.
We both had power to spare from our panels.
Of course with an 80litre fridge you would need to up the panel size a bit - 200 watts should be ample.
You have to be sensible.
Use a LCD TV – the smaller the screen the better.
Limit the use of Tungsten and Halogen lamps – use LEDs and Flouros if you can.
Don’t use inverters, only gas, for cooking and heating .
Don’t leave the Fridges in a 50 Deg enclosed vehicle.
Open the 4WD doors in the heat of the day or take the fridge out and put it in the shade.
Etc etc etc etc.
FollowUp 8 of 14
FollowupID: 658471   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 22:16

Dennis Ellery posted:

I should have mentioned, there is nothing wrong with a well maintained flooded lead acid battery - we have both have a flooded lead acid deep cycle batteries - mine is 105 amp hour.
FollowUp 9 of 14
FollowupID: 658478   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 23:14

Maîneÿ . . . posted:

Dennis,
Efficient AGM *Deep Cycle* batteries charge faster than wetcell *Deep Cycle* batteries, that's an importand point because time is the essence with solar as it's restricted to not that many hours per day.

Maîneÿ . . .
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FollowUp 10 of 14
FollowupID: 658536   Submitted: Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:02

Dennis Ellery posted:

Mainey that’s a simplistic view and only true for some conditions.
A flooded cell will accept a greater fast charge than a Gel or AGM battery.
Gels and AGMs are damaged by overcharging whereas an overcharge (under control) is beneficial to a flooded cell (it’s called Equalization).
Flooded cells, if correctly sized and maintained, are a better value for money.
FollowUp 11 of 14
FollowupID: 658537   Submitted: Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 11:33

robertbruce posted:

OK, so now the pro's are correcting each other...

if you can aford 4k+ for the right set-up and then 1k per 2yrs year maintaing failed batteries and stuff, go for it

Just dont tell us commoners it's easy... i sued the second company for thier bs...
FollowUp 12 of 14
FollowupID: 658588   Submitted: Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 15:58

Dennis Ellery posted:

Hi RobertBruce
Mate; I’m sorry to hear that you’ve paid 4K for a system that didn’t work.
It’s not the fault of Solar Panel technology - its either yours or your suppliers fault.
I’m sure Mainey’s system works well, as does mine and you could have had a good system yourself for half the price that you paid and next to nothing to maintain it - had you purchased wisely and installed it yourself.
A good supplier would have sized everything for you and with a few simple connections you would have been a happy chappy.
As for me favouring a wet cell and Mainey favouring an AGM it’s a matter of personal choice.
FollowUp 13 of 14
FollowupID: 658630   Submitted: Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 21:13

robertbruce posted:

i didnt pay 4k for the system the judge's gavel refunded... it was about half of that...

the only way for me to have purchased wisely was to have had the skills and learning of an electrician

from what i uderstand aboutt agm's they are not twice the price of a wetcell but are almost twice the battery...
FollowUp 14 of 14
AnswerID: 390567   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 08:21

Maîneÿ . . . replied:



Bart,
First things first, you will need a decent battery system capable of charging fast and holding the power generated by the solar panel/s, I would suggest a 'quality' AGM Deep Cycle battery system, only because of my experience with them.

With solar panels you need to know how efficient they are in *LOW LIGHT* conditions, which is not relevant to their claimed Wattage or Amperage numbers, because you will spend at least some time when it’s not perfect solar conditions, also who will honour the warranty if you need to make a claim.


The easy way to tell you what "is best" for you is to tell you what I use, then you can make the decision that it's either too big or small, based on what will be posted about it, telling you why it’s no good :)

# 203 Watt capacity solar system
# 200 ah AGM Deep Cycle battery system
# 70 Lt Fridge/Freezer - draws ~8 Amps ( 2.8 ah)
# various efficient lights
# Laptop running from inverter
# Coffee maker

I've never seen the AGM's showing below 12v - even first thing in the morning

Maîneÿ . . .
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Reply 3 of 5
FollowupID: 658468   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 22:02

S&N posted:

we are looking at solar panels, we run a 60l engel fridge/freezer, looking at getting some of those lights in your profile pics (12v hand held units with efficient globes. did you make them?) wont be using too much more. was looking at the kyocera panels, possibly 2 x 135w panels. is this overkill? is there a better suited panel? if you want you can email me. geckoplumbing@optusnet.com.au
thanks
shannon
FollowUp 1 of 2
FollowupID: 658477   Submitted: Monday, Nov 09, 2009 at 22:58

Maîneÿ . . . posted:

shannon,
the (original) light was from Bunnings ( $29 ?? ) the globe's an energy saver 'daylight' 12 volt, 12 watt ( 60 Watt equivalent? )
I removed the 240v plug and connected a Low Voltage 12v plug.

Kyocera 'black' panels are good in *lower light* conditions too.
Because of the 'green' world we are now living in, the big solar companies are now focusing on panels more suitable for that market, making a quillon $$ instead of the very low consumption tourist 12v market, can't blame them as green $$ make the companies rich, we don't.

I sometimes wonder where the unbranded panels are made and the solar technology used in the manufacturer comes from?

I think it would be a great experiment to actually TEST some against the proven products on the market so the actual results are known, I have never denigrated those I have not used, because I don't know their capabilities.

Maîneÿ . . .
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FollowUp 2 of 2
AnswerID: 390754   Submitted: Tuesday, Nov 10, 2009 at 13:57

Rolly replied:

May I recommend reading Collyn Rivers' books on the subject.

He's a "been there, done that" sort of bloke who has a lifetime of experience and expertise in all things "camping".

http://www.caravanandmotorhomebooks.com/

I've never met the man, but read his stuff in print and on various forums.
Reply 4 of 5
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AnswerID: 390844   Submitted: Wednesday, Nov 11, 2009 at 08:49

Maîneÿ . . . replied:

I think something most people forget, or don't understand, is the AGM battery, when used in a solar system, will never get below 12v at any time, if the system is *specified and set up* correctly.

The lowest voltage the battery will get down to, will be seen early in the morning, before the sun has hit on the panel, the battery voltage at this time will be close to 12v (probably ~12.2v) so the battery will almost never need huge amounts of Amps to get it back to 12.7v or thereabouts, and will then be maintained at a charging voltage of ~13.6v all day, while the solar system is also running the devices attached to the battery, obviously this will depend on the type of solar regulator used.

For optimum performance the solar system should be specified so it can run all devices and also maintain the battery system during the day in full sun.
Using the correct solar regulator will allow for battery equalization in wet cell batteries, something not required in AGM’s.
(this post is not in reply to, or in any way relevant to any previous post)

Maîneÿ . . .
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Reply 5 of 5

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