Generators

You can always put sugar in the petrol tank while the owners are inside getting cool. Works every time.

Didn't work for the Mythbusters!

Yes, the word is it's no better than sand in the tank. It doesn't dissolve and just clogs the lines and filters.

You might be on to something there Baz. There could well be a correlation between the 80% of considerate campers and campers who don't own a generator.

Cheers, Kevin

Hi Kevin

Perhaps there might be, however to arrive at such a conclusion one would need to be of a view that people who own generators are the sole cause of all noise issues in camp areas or that generators are the only source of all noise problems amongst campers.

Has that been your experience or that of others – the only noise problem encountered in people’s travels was from a generator and that if the noise wasn’t from a generator that it was caused by someone who owns a generator? If the answer is no, than I suspect any such correlation is tenuous at best.

Cheers, Baz

Baz, in the last 10 years we have spent a substantial amount of time on the road. About 90% (an estimate) of nights are spent in caravan parks and the remainder in "free" camps of various kinds. A significant number of those 10% of nights have been impacted to some extent by generators. Enough that I consider them to be an antisocial device. I don't own one and won't, unless we start having regular blackouts in Brisbane. Which ultimately seems likely, unfortunately.

Cheers, Kevin

I wonder what would have happened if they had been a group of 4 wheel drives towing off road caravans?

Cheers, Kevin

Well, being a closed track I think I would've got on the phone and spoken with the Ranger!

I can understand it. They may have thought you wanted privacy, and I know I appreciate it when people respect my privacy.
Do I want to chat around the campfire listening to tall yarns? not necessarily, but sometimes in moderation.
I resent it when people set up close to me when theres lots of room elsewhere.

Paul, agree that some people don't want to chat, however, if they want to respect my privacy (and ensure theirs), the best way is to go to the other end of the flipping campground. I don't see how camping six feet away is respecting my privacy.

Agreed on that.

C'mon Scott. The were probably thinking about what happened to the last "fritz" couple that set up camp there.
Maybe they figured a big brawny Aussie camped close by could come in handy just in case Mick Taylor happened to be in the neighbourhood.

(;-0)

Cheers
Pop

If that happens, you only have to run faster than your neighbour :)

Pop, funny thing .... I was a single bloke in a rather feral looking 40 series.

Sadly it was before the movie came out :-)

Suspect they would've run for the hills afterwards ........ could've put the old hat on, grabbed the machete out of the back of the truck and uttered the immortal words ....

****s ****ed

It seems that many European campers suffer from agoraphobia in our wide open spaces. They only seem comfortable and secure when in close proximity to others - they way they live at home. They don't realise we live with a different sized personal space. They are also often reluctant to converse with us, and this is more than a language barrier. However this does not apply to all, and we have conversed with other young Europeans travellers who have been very happy to chat.

I had one of those once, a bloke by himself in a converted small bus. Pulled up almost on top of me when there was acres of room. I asked him why and his reply was he was nervous and liked to be near people.

We sorted it out ok, but it had me wondering ....

how do you know theyre city people?

Just baiting, this thread HAD to turn south, I mean, "I hate generators"??

yep, and amazing just how far any sound travels at night, especially in the the beatiful quiet of the bush.
Music seems to be among the worst noises to carry (after generators !! :D)

wow,you did that?
I would appreciate a cure for loud laughter late at night if you have one...

Exactly, Ross. Maybe it was my disguise :-)

The poor guy had some issues. A little bit different if you know what I mean. I helped him set up his camp reasonably separated from mine and tried to reassure him that he was in a safe place. He was nervous, but settled in ok.

At least he didn't have a generator!! :-) (And neither did I.)

Cheers

Mark,
all I can say to your comment is, should you ever do something like that to anything of mine, make sure you have mobile service so you can ring triple "O" for an ambulance.

Not only that, I know a lot of intelligent people that own a generator, but not many smart people who makes a comments like you have.

Have a nice day.

"Besides, he said, because the inside of the generator cabinet is so well insulated, we can't hear a thing."

Suspect that's the same mentality of people who put it on the other side of their Caravan. Quieter there .... the fact that it's smack in the middle the neighbours outside area doesn't seem to occur to them.

Had one of those at a campsite up in the Kimberly. Refused to move it to his side until I suggested it would not be functioning in the morning if he left it on my side. He honestly couldn't see what the problem was.......

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Yes Phil, The stench of an idling diesel can be worse than a humming generator.

Mmm! I own a generator but. One night camping at Edith Falls, NT, a large van pulled up. Started his generator and then his AC. I went to the information board and rang the number for the Rangers. They came and told him generators were not permitted. You guessed it; he started his vehicle and ran it all night. What a wanket!

It amuses me when 30 years ago people were able to visit the exact same areas with their new or old kingswood and a tent, esky and a gas lantern. !

Nowadays apparently you require a $ 100,000 Landcruiser and a van with all the goodies including the aircon.to be able to survive.

Give me Port Douglas, Mission and Airlie beach and a heap of others all along the eastern seaboard with uncurbed streets old style pubs with genuine food ( not a bread plate with a poofy piece of MKR imitation for $25 )

We were extremely fortunate to have been able to see the majority of the east coast before it became in some cases overdeveloped and overcrowded. The tailend of our annual trips to our favourite spot Yuringur Nat Park coincided with the start of the grey nomad boom, For many a year we would be the only ones there ! Towards the end it became common for 3 or 4 vans to rock up and drop anchor 10 mtrs away. In the end we gave up .

I also found the most down to earth people were those travelling light. Those with the new vans and latest and greatest were only interested in... well penis substitution . It was getting like there is a cloning program of Kyle Sanderson going on that the government was not telling me about.

There is another thread going on at the moment on another camping forum about gun laws relating to the U.S.A, of course the Oz aspect has been raised saying they are restrictive here. I for one totally understand the reasoning behind it, after all if I was able to pick up a gun and shoot someone it would either be a camper or a politician . The camper would be in a fit of rage which I would regret later. The politician only if I missed.

Anyways happy camping !

My sentiment precisely.

There are inconsiderate people and intolerant people, when we meet either of these people on the road we move on.

And here is the best thing, I could count on the fingers of one-hand how often this has happened over a life-time of camping. Just proves to me that most people are considerate and tolerant, noting I have come across many people using generator's, considerately...

As for acts of vandalism when it comes to silencing generators - well it speaks for itself and volumes of those suggesting it. Hopefully those suggesting that are doing no more than a bit of key-board chest beating. Personally, I'd like to think that those who choose to associate themselves with the EO community would be above that type of anti-social behaviour.

And to comments about those needing to travel with all the mod-cons these days, and why don't they leave them at home - for many the van they are in and the road they are on is their home. I think we will see more of this in the years ahead, for some it will be a lifestyle choice, for others an economic one...

If only everyone could just walk a mile in someone else's shoes perhaps we wouldn't have inconsiderate people, intolerant people, or vandal's in our camp grounds.

But this thread was always going to be about the detractors, I guess, especially with an opening gambit of "I hate generator's"...

Cheers, Baz

Baz,

It's not quite so easy to move on if some inconsiderate person pulls up close to you and proceeds to run their generator, or for that matter their boom box.
In many cases it takes time to set up one's campsite and to have to pull it down to move on, because of some ignorant person whom doesn't consider others, is not a practical option and therefore aggravation in a multitude of forms, from one party or another, arises.

The biggest problem is that some people just have a negative attitude to the noise impact on other folk sharing a campground, or they are ignorant of acceptable camping etiquette. This noise is not restricted to generators, but they are one of the more common causes.

Tolerance is a difficult thing after you have already set up camp in a nice quiet spot, only to be invaded by others' noise induced existence of any form.
Education, awareness and respect for others are the attributes required.

"Education, awareness and respect for others are the attributes required."

The attributes of awareness & respect for others were instilled in most people early in life Bill, but unfortunately there is a growing number out there who are completely oblivious to how their actions affect others and no amount of education will change the majority of them. They will keep on doing whatever they like with total disregard for others because they were never taught any different.

I do believe that one of the problems is also the way some people approach others. Just reading some of the comments here advocating vandalism and violence shows that conflict resolution was never part of their education.

Dusty

Hi Bill

I understand the point you are making in this instance and the points of view we have exchanged on the same topic previously.

But for us, we move on the next day and save ourselves any angst if the habits of fellow campers are that bad that we can’t tolerate it, so our level of tolerance and patience is only stretched to one night. And as we drive out of the camp site we leave the "bad karma" behind and get on with enjoying ourselves...

It comes down to us assessing whether breaking camp is less onerous than the angst of putting up with fellow campers whose habits are not to our liking, regardless of who was there first.

Mind you as I highlighted, such occasions have been rare in a lifetime of camping.

On occasions when we camp in proximity to others, we accept that our level of patience and tolerance needs to match the popularity and accessibility of where we are camping – a simple fact that we have learnt to accept and an approach that keeps our blood pressure down and hopefully that of our fellow campers.

Others may choose to take a differing approach to us and as some have even highlighted, this might include vandalism of someone else’s property to get a desired outcome – for us, life is way too short and Australia way too big to let that level of angst or person into our lives, and I’m betting I am not Robinson Crusoe on that one, at least I would like to think so…


Cheers, Baz

You only have to observe how people drive now, to see how little they care about others!

G'day Folks
This exchange, as sub text for the main thread, summarizes the issues nicely. We humans are equipped with reason and with feelings and we ignore one of those domains at our peril. Reason can provide all sorts of explanations and justifications for things that upset us. The danger here is invalidating perfectly good and normal feelings that are there for good reasons.

At the other end of the spectrum we have reactive feelings, an overreaction to the situation fueled by rage largely untempered by reason. The danger here is more obvious.

The essence of the issue, imho, is intrusion. Generators intrude on our experience of peace and calm, especially when one of the motivations for camping is to get away from exactly that kind of noise (eg traffic and neighbours.) Camping close when there is no imperative to camp close is also experienced as an intrusion.

The essence of consideration in these circumstances is to be aware of what might be intrusive to others, It's a sensibility that is both good and practical for a social species to have. There are, however, broad cultural forces working against that awareness, not least the rise of individualism which is mainly code for being greedy and self absorbed. c/f Donald Trump or Clive Palmer for extreme examples.) For a couple of generations, mine included, parenting in general hasn't helped much with learning how to be considerate.

With more people and higher mobility the potential for camping ground intrusions necessarily increases. Add this to increased "individualism" and the incidence of intrusive (thoughtless, inconsiderate etc) behaviour is guaranteed to rise.

Personally. I have a low tolerance/ high sensitivity for intrusion - camping areas included. Realistically, I am the only one who can do something about that. Trying to logic it away is no longer an option. Wherever feasible I camp away from other people. A track off a track off a track is good rule of thumb because it rules out nearly all conventional vehicles, with or without vans or trailers.

The acid test for me is sleep disturbance. When I can't feasibly camp in solitude I have learned that it is best to move as far away as I can from the intrusion as soon I experience it and without spending the night being disturbed by it. If that isn't an option I ask people politely to make less noise so that I can sleep and then move on the next day.

Some people intrude without knowing it, some without caring and some even do it deliberately, like the bogans with loud music and/or circle work in the camp area.

Cheers
Mark

The "I hate generators" is pretty strong wording. Something like "dislike intensely" may have been less provoking?

And I wonder if the "haters" ever refuel at Barkly Homestead, Dunmarra or other remote roadhouses that rely on these hateful generators to run the bowsers, fridges, freezers and aircon?

I LOVE generators!!! All my working life, except since we moved to town, has revolved around generators. 32 & 50v DC generators, up to quite large 225kva Cat powered 3 phase gensets, that can power a large station. Without a generator life grinds to a halt pretty rapidly in remote areas.

Well, that's OT, Bill, but I see your point about invasive tactics by some travellers, and it may, as someone else commented, sadly become more common. But don't hate 'em, those inoffensive, purring little Honda gennies, you can barely hear them over the crackle of the camp fire.

Bob

,

The noise of one little mosquito will keep me awake longer than the consistent hum of a 2kva Honda Generator purring away in the distance.

Cheers

Bazz

I read you posts most days and you come across a nice guy and knowledgeable traveller , but don't you at times feel like getting angry with rude inconsiderate people (,you don't always have to be voice of reason on this forum.)

might make you feel empowered instead of sitting on the fence all the time .


Cheers

Thanks for your note Mark…

You can rest assured I don’t consider myself a fence sitter and I am quite happy to put forward a point of view and argue the merits of it. Informed discussion and debate is one of the best ways one learns from others and it assists one to develop rational thinking, especially if you take the time to listen and be respectful in the process.

And the breadth of knowledge and intellect that is “housed” within the EO community across an almost infinite range of topics is enormous and I look to learn something each time I visit, and to contribute where I think I might add some value.

But on getting angry with rude, inconsiderate people…

There are a lot of things I could get angry about in this world, but I’m not counting a generator, a restless sleeps night, and the need to move on to get some peace and quiet as one of them. But I get it that others might...

Besides, who am I to be the arbiter of other people’s actions, especially if they consider them reasonable? And for sure, there are some general common sense rules that should be observed when camping, both to avoid being inconsiderate, and equally, to avoid being intolerant.

But ultimately, I only get to control my actions, not someone else’s.

I can either waste a lot of time and energy trying to change someone else’s behaviour, possibly to little avail, or take control of the outcome I want - an enjoyable camping experience, without getting all “hot under the collar” even if that means moving on myself...

I consider that empowerment!

Have a good evening and once again, thanks...Baz

Bazz

Well put together again ( bloody annoying that someone can put there point across as well as that ).
I will have a look at my approach to inconsiderate people in the future .

No point getting old if you don't get any smarter .

Cheers

Nothing wrong with a “Dorothy Dix” question especially where it encourages respectful and thoughtful discussion and debate…

To my mind, this thread evolved well beyond the specific premise “I hate generators” – to something more revealing about human behaviour and how individuals interact in the camping environment.

And one of the more thoughtful responses in this thread talked about education, respect, and awareness. In my book, that is not a bad takeaway on camping etiquette for all regardless of the intention of the original poster, whom I'm sure wasn't intending to troll anyone and who contributes regularly to forum discussions...

Cheers, Baz – The Landy

Shaker

I am not a troll. I have contributed several times to this site over the past decade

CJ

I like that one Pop

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You make a very good point Michael. It's all to do with tolerance.
The truck fridge generators are necessary. The Honda for the TV is maybe not.
We can sleep through the truck's gennie. The Honda at the caravan drives us wild.
It is our perception of what is reasonable that determines our tolerance.

Allen, the difference can be a simple as the frequency of the noise source rather than the decibels.

Fridge pan compressor motors are loud compared with a little honda but maybe the noise frequency they run at makes the difference.

No, I think it's the fact that you are lying there stewing about what a mongrel the other guy is that adds to the moment.

Mate I think you summed it up.