Member - bushfix posted:

some may say in the middle, that would probably be safe practice if you only had one "air brake". I would use two, one at each end. Don't be scared of shackles unless they are unrated, underrated, damaged, suss, or being suggested to link straps. A good condition, suitably rated shackle on a hitch receiver for example, is a strong anchor point, done up correctly :)

Eric from Cape York Connections posted:

It couldn't be the monthly one there first rule would be have 2 cartons of xxxx then see who could do the recovery.

All the best
Eric

gramps posted:

Eric,

That's so you'd have one carton at each end while they started on the third :))

Member - Jack posted:

And that is the exact reason why I am not renewing my subscription. Funny at first but it becomes very tedious after a couple of issues. I can only imagine what impressiion it gives those folks glancing through the magazine in places like doctor's surgeries etc..etc ... "These 4WD guys can't take breath without opening a can" ......

So very booooooring ....

Jack

Member - bushfix posted:

you use the loops within each other and a separator.

first link i could find;

here y'are

you can use various thinks in the join but the aim is to stop them binding together. i recommend some training or familiarisation from those who have been trained, if you have this kit.
If the bag is a decent size, perhaps filling it with sand would help, the weight would keep it lower to the ground, away from head height. The only people near a snatch strap in a recovery should be the drivers of the vehicles. Everyone else should (hopefully) be at least 1.5 times the lenght of the strap away.

Vince NSW posted:

Thanks for that site Bushfix. I have joined via the loops but it took 30 min to undo. Had also been told that you could use rolled up paper & from the photos I can now see how this would work.
My oldes son has just arrived home from 2 years in england and has discovered the winch on the 4by. Now wants to go out and use it this weekend so we may get a chance to use some of the knowledge from the SA 4x site. Thanks
Vince

Member - bushfix posted:

no wucks Vince, first site i came across when looking for pics, hard to describe it in words. plenty of info on the web but i encourage you to join a club and try it first under supervision, winching and snatching is serious business, be careful mate.
30 mins? did you not put a separator in?

Kiwi Kia posted:

The forces involved make me suspect that the 'parachute' is of doubtful benefit on a winch cable. However, I may be wrong, it cant do any harm and it certainly shows people where the winch rope is. I have seen someone drive into a long winch cable between vehicles - ouch!!.

Try not to use any shackels. Put strops onto rated recovery hooks that have been securely mounted with rated bolts. Spend more time and money on getting really good hooks fitted and you will not have stray bits of metal flying through the air.

Member - Roachie (SA) posted:

G'day mate,
This is the DVD that I spoke about in another post within the past week or so. I don't have a copy of it but will see if I can round one up.
The thing to remember about "air-brakes" on snatch straps is that the idea of putting the bag the strap came in or any other light-weight item (like a towel, tarp etc) over the strap, is virtually useless. If a strap breaks, the broken end has been shown to just pull straight through such light-weight items and they are absolutely useless.

That type of air-brake is more helpful over a winch cable which has more of a whip-lash effect if/when it breaks.

The lengths of chain that our DTU blokes found to be the very best and only totally effective of putting the brakes on a snatch-strap, are to be located at 1/3rd intevals along the strap......that way, it covers all the bases if the strap happens to break at ANY point of the exercise, including if the recovery point breaks off the vehicle.

Des Lexic posted:

Roachie is spot on with the use of chain and the location of securing the chain. The DVD is produced by the SA4WDAA for driver training and is only available for DTU use.
The use of shackles to join straps together is a no-no in the highest degree. The use of a snatch because of their inherint danger should be a last resort not a first resort.

geocacher (djcache) posted:

Hi Des,

I would have to disagree on the last point above.

IF a snatch strap which is in good condition, used correctly, and is attached WITHOUT shackles to a hitch receiver or to a proper rated recovery hook it is far safer than a tensioned winch cable.

If you have the option between a proper snatch recovery and winching out I'd say the snatch is the safer of the two.

It must be noted though that the risks associated with snatching are far greater, like anything, when they are improperly used or connected.

Winches using steel cables rather than plasma rope are something to be treated with the utmost caution.

A broken snatch strap without a metal projectile attached will not cause as much damage as a recoiling wire rope which is capable of amputating anything it comes in contact with.

It amazes me however how often you see either a snatch or a winch recovery undertaken with the vehicle being recovered bogged to the axles and no shovel work done first to lessen the angle of ascent out of the mess. Like wise I have seen many recoveries undertaken when no attempt has been made to drop tyre pressures to get out without assistance. Having a winch on my vehicle I am loath to use it and often find letting out an additional 5 or even 10 lb below what I off road drive on makes a huge difference. There's no problem running 13-15 pounds just to get out of a spot as long as you aren't cornering which may roll a tyre off the rim, and you attach the compressor afterwards to put back what you took out.

In fact how many of you have ever suggested or asked if the bogged/stuck vehicle has dropped some pounds in the tyres only to be met with a dumb look and matching "Huh? What for?"

I'd be interested to see the thing with the drag chain used as a strap brake. Makes sense from a physics point of view.

Dave

Des Lexic posted:

G'day Dave,
The point I was trying to make(Not vey well lol) that people get their vehicle stuck and immediately grab the snatch strap. A lot of bogged situations can be gotten out of by letting the tyre pressure down, clear the sand away with a shovel and get your mates to give a push and attempt to drive out of the bog. Failing that, I would then try a tow recovery and then the snatch strap. Problem with snatch straps is that to many people don't know how to use them safely.
Using chain as a safety brake, you need about 9kg of chain at each point and tied to the strap using a Prussian Knot. I won't even try to explain here how to tie one but they allow the chain to be moved along the strap if needed and a little bit of give in the initial inertia and the ability to undo the knot afterwards.
Off the subject, You have inspired me to get one of our local geocaching enthusiasts to come along to our local 4wd club Feb meeting and explain to the members what Geocaching is about etc.

Member - Roachie (SA) posted:

G'day Craig,
I don't think there has been anyone ever suggest that a shackle might break (unless it is a cheap hardware/unrated type of course). You are dead right that they have a much higher breaking point than that which is stamped on them.

The nub of your point is (quote)......"If hooked up to a secure tow point on the car (not a tie down) then the use of a bow shackell in a recovery should not be an issue". And this is where it can get ugly.....very ugly!!

There are a LOT of blokes who just attach a strap with a shackle to places like those tie-downs on the front of 80 series cruisers ("they're made of steel, so they must be strong" type mentality)......also those cute little lugs on the bottom/front of some older-style ARB bullbars etc. These types of points are seen by these "LOT of blokes" as logical recovery points and because they are enclosed circles, they have to use the 3.2T or 4.7T shackle. It is when the recovery point fails (as opposed to the shackle), that the shackle then becomes (literally) a "MISSILE".

Thankfully, you are right........it doesn't happen very often. But by cripes, when it does, the operator on the receiving end doesn't even get a chance to kiss his @rse goodbye!!!!

Cheers mate

Roachie

flappa posted:

Its not normally the shackle that breaks , but either the snatch strap , with shackle still attached , or the recovery point with shackle attached that does the damage.

I'm yet to hear of a shackle breaking , but heard numerous stories of a strap or recovery point breaking with shackle attached.

Member - Roachie (SA) posted:

Sorry, also meant to add that even if you volunteer to assist another bloke out of a situation, using his snatch strap, AND you've checked to see that he is using rated recovery hook/s on the front of his truck; you still have a couple of things you need to concern yourself with:
1). Has he REALLY pulled out his snatch strap? (It's not unknown for someone to try to use a winch extension strap, causing much damage to either/both vehicles)
2). Is the rated recovery point REALLY strong? Has the hook been attached using high tenmsile bolts of the correct diameter? Has the rated hook been attached properly to the chassis?

Even though the right gear might have been used, if the recovery hook pulls out of the chassis, that hook and bit of chassis then becomes the projectile!!! CHIT, now I'm starting to feel paranoid!!!!