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Diesel/Gas Conversion

Submitted: Saturday, Sep 02, 2006 at 09:53

John R (SA)

There was recently some talk of a diesel/gas system, and I'd like to know some more about the conversion (in the previous case it was a hilux; I've posted on the old thread and pm'd the the author, but with no luck).

I understand the gas is injected to the air intake, so the engine is consuming both fuels at the same time.
There is meant to be a power/performance increase of up to 30%, and also an increase in fuel economy.

What I'd like to know, is what sort of fuel economy is being achieved? ie how many litres each of diesel & gas per 100km? Compared to lt/100km of diesel previously?

Cheers,
John
ThreadID: 37335 Replies: 8
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AnswerID: 192310   Submitted: Saturday, Sep 02, 2006 at 12:54

UPDARE replied:

4wd monthly did a test on the exact thing try looking it up on the forum there.
Reply 1 of 8
FollowupID: 450165   Submitted: Saturday, Sep 02, 2006 at 13:26

Tim HJ61 (WA) posted:

Or even that thing called Google will produce surprisingly useful responses to a query on "Diesel gas convervion"

Funny that

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FollowUp 1 of 1
AnswerID: 192315   Submitted: Saturday, Sep 02, 2006 at 13:18

PK Eildon (VIC) replied:

John

I have a 2003 patrol 4.2 turbo i/c Cab Chassis and have posted previously.

To answer your questions

Yes. Injected into air intake in front of turbo. Gas not required for motor to operate, you just loose benefits if no gas.

My assessments only (not scientifically backed)

HP 20%+ increase
Torque 20%+ increase
Torque 500-600rpm lower
20-25% less diesel use
Quieter motor & turbo (sounds like diesel at idle or low speed, but sounds and performs more like petrol at 100kph)
Oil stays cleaner
No smoke under load (just the diesel puff at startup, there is no gas at idle, but increases with acceleration)

As for fuel economy, it is cheaper, but my impression is you are replacing 20-25% of diesel with gas which is 1/3 the price. On a recent 6000k trip which included Simpson Desert & surrounds achieved 17/100. I tend to use the vehicle to full potential and sat on 110kph where I could (there were fairly severe head winds for part of it and this drank the juice. Also I could not get gas for about 1/3 of trip. Best I can say is gas does not increase overall consumption. I'm sure if a 'grandpa' driver did the trip he could have achieved far better results. I did not get the system for fuel saving and not particularly interested in that aspect.

There are a few minor installer problems with mine, but working through them. As far as the system; more than happy.

PK


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Reply 2 of 8
AnswerID: 192329   Submitted: Saturday, Sep 02, 2006 at 16:04

lewjack1 replied:

john,
i posted an enquiery about diesel/gas conversions, if you wish to try the web site
www.dieselgas.com.au it may have some answers for your question on the
subject. me personally am going for the conversion . $4,0000 fitted less $2,000
gov rebate leaves $2,000 left which can be paid off over 2yrs interest free
lewjack1
Reply 3 of 8
FollowupID: 450189   Submitted: Saturday, Sep 02, 2006 at 17:09

Member - andrew B (Kununurra) posted:

Gday Lewjack

I'm in the same boat - trying to get in at Xmas. In WA, the State give you $1000 as well, so it makes it only about $1000.00!

Cheers Andrew
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AnswerID: 192355   Submitted: Saturday, Sep 02, 2006 at 18:32

lewjack1 replied:

andrew b
thanks for the reply , any chance of staying at your place for 6 months to qualify for the w.a. disc. (only joking ) all the best with it

lewjack1
Reply 4 of 8
FollowupID: 451099   Submitted: Thursday, Sep 07, 2006 at 01:53

Dieseljuice posted:

Hey AndrewB...I live in Perth Wa and am trying to find a diesel/gas installer somewhere here. Where are you gettin gyourconversion done?With the $3000 rebate we get it should only cost about $1000 huh?Have you had it done yet?What are your thoughts?
Regards
DieselJuice
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AnswerID: 192490   Submitted: Sunday, Sep 03, 2006 at 14:28

Member - DOZER replied:

Make sure you study up.....ive heard some bad stories about the gas consuming all the oxygen and the motors smoking because of unburnt diesel.....and also direct injection turbo works better than indirect injected turbo, but in the end, i would demand written guarantees of what you are being told you are going to get.....
That way, you get what you pay for.....
Andrew

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Reply 5 of 8
FollowupID: 450443   Submitted: Monday, Sep 04, 2006 at 07:49

Dunedigger posted:



That is a story just that ! Fact is there is less smoke as more of the diesel is burnt. Up from 85% to 95%+.

Fact 2 The gas mixes with the o2 to form a more explosive mix.

DieselGas works well, I have had mine done 4 months ago. I do have some concerns about the conversion as it creates so much more power ! It is probably the easiest and most economical way to get 25% more power !

DuneDigger
FollowUp 1 of 3
FollowupID: 450460   Submitted: Monday, Sep 04, 2006 at 10:10

PhilZD30Patrol posted:

Basic combustion theory learnt a high school a very long time ago;

for combustion to occur you need
1. oxygen
2. fuel
3. heat (to ignite the oxygen and fuel)

If any one of these three is absent, no combustion.

So I presume that if the engine is starved of oxygen, the performance will rapidly drop off and eventually stop. I guess it would be like trying to continue to drive an old petrol car with the choke out when the engine is hot (remember the choke?)

The idea is to have the correct amount of LPG injected into the air inlet manifold so that the engine runs most efficiently and is a true dual fuel operation.

Regards
Phil
FollowUp 2 of 3
FollowupID: 450479   Submitted: Monday, Sep 04, 2006 at 12:02

Member - DOZER posted:

Guys, story or not, fact is there are some people that are real happy with their conversion because they got what they paid for and there are also those who are not happy because (For whatever reason) they were promised more than they got, or it wasnt installed properly...and i dont ewant anyone to end up in that boat.....now i know you are real happy with yours Dunedigger,however, there was a thread on outerlimits where a guy didnt get the improvement in power, and the exhaust was smokey at mid revs...and a diesel mechanic explained to him that his indirect injected diesel fires its diesel in a swirl chamber as opposed to the direct injected motor firing into a central chamber in the piston or head, which mixes the two fuels alot better and allows a better explosion. Because gas has replaced the space where oxygen used to be, more air is ultimately needed to give the right ratio of fuel to air for proper burning....with a turbo, it is easier to do this than without....
Food for thought and further study
Andrew

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FollowUp 3 of 3
AnswerID: 192584   Submitted: Monday, Sep 04, 2006 at 00:20

Chris & Shazza replied:

G'day John,
If you drop into your local newsagency you can pick up a copy of 4x4 Australia's 'complete towing guide'.....issue 1. I bought a copy 2 days ago. They run a detailed story on DieselGas technologies--- power and economy gains with gas-diesel injection. An interesting read.....cheers

Reply 6 of 8
AnswerID: 192602   Submitted: Monday, Sep 04, 2006 at 09:06

John R (SA) replied:

Great, Thanks everyone.

On my conservative sums, at present prices, it would take around 108800 km to pay off ($2k to convert, after rebates, 20% economy on diesel) without taking in to account additional power etc.
Mind you, putting in a diesel saving of 30% brings it down to 72500km to pay off.

Cheers,
John
Reply 7 of 8
AnswerID: 193283   Submitted: Thursday, Sep 07, 2006 at 12:25

Dieseljuice replied:

Hey guys i madea reply post furtehr down but wasnt sure if it would get noticed. I live in Perth and ned to know if there are any diesel/gas conversion specialists here. Andrew yo said you were gettin it done in WA. Where did you get it done and how much did it cost?Also whathave you to report about the benefits?
Regards Dieseljuice
Reply 8 of 8