towing camper trailer in sand

Submitted: Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:30
ThreadID: 37609 Views:12471 Replies:12 FollowUps:14
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G'day
/just wondering if l can pick the brains of all you wise heads out there.
I have got a camper trailer which l tow using a Navarra 3L turbo diesel 02 model.
I want to start going to Morton island and places like that, and still only being new to the 4WD world , l am not sure whether l will have the guts in my Navara to tow a camper along the beach. I know the hard sand would be a sinch, but a little worried about heading off the hard sand and over soft sand dunes to camp sites.
We were at straddy at chrissy and we had a drive down the main beach and checked out beach camping sites and we loved the idea of doing it. I liked the idea of being up behind the dunes.
Any advice would be great
Cheers
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Reply By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:35

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:35
All 6 tyres down to 15psi (or so) and you should be okay.
Make sure you've got a good compressor.
Make sure you've got a snatch strap.
Try to go with someone else (so you can pull each other out of trouble if need be).
Have fun.
AnswerID: 193856

Follow Up By: bucky - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 21:02

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 21:02
I agree with Roachie about the Vehicle pressure ,,, but the Camper I would only let down to 20 ,,
Yes I would keep at least 5 psi extra, in the camper wheels at all times
My 03 Navara twin cab Diesel ute, performed flawlessly, with those pressures
you can even go down to 10 psi, on your vehicle, but only to get you out of trouble, then put them back up to 15....
Everything is hard in soft sand, but at these pressures youo should not have any problems
And make sure you have company .
Cheers
Bucky
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Reply By: Member - Doug T (W.A) - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:44

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:44
Freezer
I see Roachie gave you a reply and i have to disagree with him on 1 part of his answer, not 6 down but i would say only the 4 on the car, reason being the trailer wheels are not driving , just rolling along so if they are baggy then that will cause unwanted friction/drag, if they are tight no friction/drag, and thats the method i applied when I towed an off road trailer over the Simpson 1997,worked well
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Follow Up By: Old Nick - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:52

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:52
I'll go with Roachie- sorry been there done that. Towing my boat on beach all the time to launch, the trailer tyres must be down also.
Regards Nick
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Follow Up By: Muddy doe (SA) - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:59

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 19:59
Yes, the weight of the trailer pushing down on the tyre will make it flatten at the bottom just the same as on the car at the lower pressure giving the bigger footprint and allowing the tyre to spread the weight over more sand and not sink as much. This would be more pronounced the softer the sand, maybe not on hard sand.

Even in a 2WD vehicle you would let all 4 tyres down on soft sand I reckon.

Muddy

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Follow Up By: Muddy doe (SA) - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:01

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:01
Best example I can think of is pushing a full wheelbarrow around on sand at a building site. Soft tyre much better than one that is rock hard. Opposite of course on hard surface.
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Follow Up By: Waynepd (NSW) - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:45

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:45
As a member of the yahoo campertrailer group I can say the common thinking amongst the gurus there is to lower the air in all tyres, car and trailer, when on sand. Roachie is spot on.

Hard tyres on the trailer act like a plough and a buildup of sand forms in front of the tyres so you are always trying to pull the trailer over the hump.
Lower pressured and bagging tyres tend to float over the sand hardly disturbing it at all in comparison.

Ideally you would have the same track on the trailer as the car so it follows on sand already compacted by the car.
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Follow Up By: Member - Doug T (W.A) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 04:23

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 04:23
Muddy doe
Can't compare to a blooody wheelbarrow, firstly a wheelbarrow is being pushed,it has a small narrow tyre/wheel, and one would need an icy cold slab close handy,my experience with my trailer was I think for sure it was being towed behind, it had the same wheel track and tyre size as the 4x4,it was not very heavy and it rolled over the sand easy , so every combination would need a different approach , and all combinations require the SLAB
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Follow Up By: Muddy doe (SA) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 19:14

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 19:14
Hah Doug,

Agree totally on the comments on the cold slab!

Just to clarify - I was talking about a proper wheelbarrow with decent inflatable tyre - not one of those Bunning 20 dollar jobs that have a tiny rubber wheel and would not hold more than 3 decent shovel loads of anything.

Yes, also there is a slight difference between being pushed and pulled but even then you notice a great difference with soft tyre in soft sandy conditions and this just goes to illustrate my point that flotation and the size of the footprint of the tyre on the ground is the most important aspect. Driven wheel or not.

As you also point out - drive to the conditions, but I say don't be afraid to experiment until you find the optimum pressures for your rig.

Cheers

Muddy
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Reply By: Willem - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:04

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:04
On sand whether it be beach or desert, 15psi in the GQ tyres and 10psi in the trailer tyres works very well for me. I have taken my trailer weighing up tp 850kgs on various offtrack adventures and have only come to grief once. On that occasion I dropped the trucks' tyre pressures down to 10 as well and drove out of the sand bog unassisted.

I think that you may have to experiment with your Navara to find the right combination of tyre pressures for it and the trailer. In general, tyres that bag with less pressure in them, leave a bigger footprint and more floatation on sand.

Cheers
AnswerID: 193865

Follow Up By: Member - Pesty (SA) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 19:31

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 19:31
Im sorta with Roachie on this, but agree with Willem, and trailer down to 10, as its lighter and needs less pressure to bag out properly.
Doug can tow a light trailer without letting them down, no problem, but if the going is at the point of stopping you and you need all the help you can get, the trailer let right down is the go.

Cheers Pesty
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Reply By: Member - Ozdyssey (QLD) - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:31

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 20:31
Been to Fraser, Morton and Straddie with the camper (1.2t with water) and haven't come unstuck and that was with the Disco - The Nissan should do it no probs.

ALWAYS had the tryes down to 16-18psi, trailer to 22-23.

One thing I was told on here once was to turn off your trailer brakes (if applic), you won't need them and they would be a hinderance if anything. Worked for me.

You'll be more confident with someone else but if you've got the right recov equip there is always someone to help.

Great spots, go for it.
John
AnswerID: 193876

Follow Up By: age - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 06:44

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 06:44
Hi all

Agree with what Ozdyssey is saying here as just returned from Fraser towing 1.5t boat. Truck tyres down to 18 for the soft stuff and boat tyres down to 25 as they bag out heaps at this pressure and any lower may be too much (Light truck radials on boat). I always turn trailer brakes off as the sand undulations/creek crossings etc are a pain with the brakes engaged and pull/push the truck at the wrong time. Had no troubles this trip. Was first trip in V8 Landcruiser 100 series auto (use to have 80 series diesel). Would never go back now - what a difference. Heaps of power and for the towing, the fuel economy worked out the same. IFS was a little limiting over blow at Nkgala rocks compared to the 80, but as said would never go back to manual or diesel (slug non turbo) again.

Cheers

Age
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Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 21:55

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 21:55
Its years since I used to tow a trailer in the desert, but I'd let air out until the tyres are well bagged out - whatever that pressure may be. Can't roll a tyre off a trailer rim - lets face it its not steering and its not driving, so going down to very low pressures in sand wouldn't bother me.
AnswerID: 193893

Reply By: Member - Karl - Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 22:01

Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 at 22:01
Freezer - I agree with what Roachie and the others said make sure you let down the pressure in all tyres. You didn't say what type of campertrailer you have - a piece of advice I was given many years ago as a young bloke in the Army was to make sure that your trailer has the same rims/tyre set up as your vehicle and that they have the same track width, which is important when towing in sandy conditions as it means your trailer tyres follow in your vehicles tracks which helps in keeping up momentum when on the go.

Hope this helps and best of luck with your camping.

Karl
AnswerID: 193894

Reply By: bigcol - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 08:03

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 08:03
First time my 04 Navara STR went FWdriving was to Double Islnd Point.
It was 3 weeks old and we towed a Jayco Swan Camper that was not an offroad jobby and was on 165/78/14 trailer tyres.
We let the tyres down to 18 psi on the STR and 20 psi on the camper. We towed it up behind the dunes through the soft sand without a problem. Nearly got stuck trying to get back off the beach as the wheel tracks by this stage where quite deep and the draw bar was like the bow of a boat with the amount of sand it was moving . You let air out of tyres to increase the size of the footprint. Do it to all of them.

The only problem you will have anywhere is when you're in the soft stuff and you let it get off the boost
AnswerID: 193928

Reply By: Member - Andrew W (SA) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 08:55

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 08:55
As with tyre inflation under any conditions, it is important to factor in the load being carried. If the trailer is 2000kg on a single axle more inflation will be required than a 500kg trailer.

Principally you want the trailer tyres bagged to "the necessary extent" to reduce the depth of depression it makes in the sand and thus reduce the height of ramp it needs to be pulled up by the vehicle thus reducing it's drag.

Similarly for tyre pressures - when loading up your vehicle from unladen with recommended tyre pressures (for normal black top running), the extent you should inflate your tyres is the extent necessary so that the tyres adopt the same shape as when unladen at the recommended pressures.
AnswerID: 193935

Reply By: Neil & Lynne - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 09:33

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 09:33
Forget about what type car, or trailer you are using. Forget about what brand tyres tyres, width of rims etc. Forget about how much weight in the car, or trailer or how much water is in the washer bottle.

Determine the optimum tyre pressure for YOUR vehicle in your CURRENT configuration on a particular stretch of sand like this.......Drive the car/trailer at something like a fast jogging speed, engage the clutch (or toss the auto into neutral) if the vehicle comes instantly to a dead stop then the tyres have dug in, air some out. repeat this process til the car rolls to a gentle stop which indicates adequate floatation for that vehicle configuration on that sand. With trial & error you will soon develop a good knowledge of what pressures for differing conditions.

As an aside, when driving on beach sand, this is common knowledge to most experienced beach drivers but new ones are coming in all the time so is worth repeating - driving at correct speed is vital. Too slow encorages digging in, too fast is dangerous both for other beach users and for you maybe rolling a tyre off the rim. The idea is to travel just fast enough to create a 'bow wave' of sand in front of the front tyres. The tyres ride this wave much as a surfer rides his wet wave staying up out of trouble. In my 80 series 30 - 35kmh seems to work ok.

Hope this helps someone.

Regards

Neil
AnswerID: 193939

Follow Up By: Alloy c/t - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:01

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:01
Now I have heard everything ,,"The idea is to travel just fast enough to create a "bow wave" of sand in front of the front tires .the tires ride this wave much as a surfer rides his wet wave "" biggest load of codswallop ever put on this forum ,[apart from futch] ,,,, your theory means you are driving up a small hill costantly ,exactly what you dont want on sand.
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Follow Up By: Neil & Lynne - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:32

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:32
Not quite..... if you engaged your brain & thought about it before letting your fingers run off at your mouth you would see that the 'bow wave' is there to be compressed to a flatter surface to drive on rather than starting with a flat surface which can only go down further leading to more driving power requirements or even to digging in.

I would suggest you go for a drive on the beach and try it before mouthing off.
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FollowupID: 451866

Follow Up By: Alloy c/t - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:38

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:38
Mouthing off ?? you give advise contrary to every other reply on this thread ,,lol ,funny that I average 1 week in 4 on the beach at either Moreton / Fraser / Bribie / ,, suggest you learn sand technique ,,
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Follow Up By: Max - Sydney - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 16:51

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 16:51
Neil

I like this one. I have always been keen on setting road pressures by the "4 psi rule", as it works for all conditions and does not require complex calculations. This is the equivalent for on sand - best I heard before was "Make the flat bit about a foot long" which is a bit iffy. The "rolling to a stop" test is simple, and I will give it a go next time.

I always like a simple use anywhere rule like this. I am sure that Alloy c/t is simply so experienced that he can set pressures by feel but for occasional sand drivers like me, and in a different place every time, it will be useful. Thanks

Max

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FollowupID: 451889

Reply By: Member - Norm C (QLD) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 09:43

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 09:43
Freezer, the most important thing is to get the pressure on the driven wheels down. I reduce the CT pressure by the same amount, but given the variety of responses here, that is probably less important.

I generally go to around 18 lb, but if the going is tough, go lower. If you get stuck, don't be afraid to go to 10lb to help get out.

You are probably thinking of a bit more than tyre pressure though. When towing in dry sand, momentum is important. If your vehicle is manual, select the right gear before you hit it, and don't try to change gear while crossing. I drive a 3 lt TD Hilux (manual) and my CT weighs 1,500 KG if fully loaded with water, fuel etc.

When crossing the dry sand to get to the beach at Inskip Pt, Fraser, Indian Head (Fraser) etc, where the dry sand run can be quite long and deep, I generally go to 2nd or 3rd low range, get the revs up to around 3,000 before I hit the dry stuff, and don't let off until I'm through. This varies with conditions, and you will quickly learn the right gear, speed, and revs required.

Don't confuse momentum with speed. You don't need to go fast, just get the right speed and revs and maintain it.

It shouldn't happen, but if you do get stuck, don't stress. As soon as you come to a stop, get off the gas or you will dig in. Let a bit more air out, clear the sand away from the front of the tyres and you should be able to work your way out. But make sure you have good recovery points, snatch strap etc before you go. Others will help if necessary.

A couple of years ago, I hadn't towed through dry sand either and had similar concerns. What I have posted is the advice I got (including on this forum) and it has worked fine. Been to Fraser a number of times and going again in early Oct.

You will have a ball.
AnswerID: 193941

Reply By: Member - Beatit (QLD) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:27

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:27
G'day Freezer,

I'm not wise but I have done this a couiple of times. What the others have said is true, just get your tyre pressure down to around 18 and don't be afraid to go a little lower in need. Recovery gear is also useful as is the ability to use it. Get a decent compressor then letting your tyres down stops being a hurdle. Remember you're there to have fun so don't stress or kick the dog.

Do all of this before you get on the soft stuff and remember to engage 4WD (lock hubs if they are manual). You should have no problems with the car but remember to select the right gear before you attempt driving over a rise - you'll know which one that is when you've tried it a couple of times, the engine should rev comfortably and operate in its power zone. As a rule most people will say 2 low.

Kind regards
AnswerID: 193974

Follow Up By: Member - Beatit (QLD) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:35

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 14:35
PS This could be you.


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Reply By: Member - Lance S (VIC) - Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 16:12

Monday, Sep 11, 2006 at 16:12
!MPG:13! Hi freezer, i have a 2004 navara and tambo c.t and towed in the simpson and didn't have a problem. I had the tyre pressures at 16 and 18 on the trailer. We also went with another 4wd.
cheers Lance
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