Nissan Patrol 3.0 Turbo Diesel

Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 19:28

go2mud

Hello all, I am new to this forum as well as 4WDing. Was wondering if I could get some feedback on the new Patrol 3.0 Turbo Diesel ST-S (2006).

I have been taking day trips for the last 12 months and have had fun bogging my 97 Pathfinder down (especially since installing a LPG gas tank in the back, bad choice). My intention is to upgrade to a larger, sturdier 4WD with view towards some outback trips and hopefully a trek into Cape York. Towing and seating is also an issue as often would like to carry more than 5 people.

Also interested to hear opinions on the nissan factory steel winch bar & 9000lb winch, opinions for and against as well as the factory SatNav.

Cheers guys

Dave
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AnswerID: 213073   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 20:04

Truckster (Vic) replied:

Go with the 4.2 you will be happier in the long run, and they hold their value so much more.

Nissan bar is good, but your better off going with something like TJM or ARB, even if its just for the fact of more mounts for ariels, and spotties etc.

Winches are like bums, everyone has had this brand and that brand, and all have failed.

Steer clear of Lucky Fats winches off Ebay, stick with good quality like Warn without doubt the #1 out there, or others like Ironman, etc..

Good luck.
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FollowupID: 473406   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 23:30

goingplatinumcomau posted:

Hi Truckster

I have heard they are making an adaptor plate so they can fit a Perkin's in where the 3 liter 4 Clyinder is now in the nissan's.

I am with you on ths one far to small for the job 4 clyinder i am amazed anyone ever brought one.

Shane
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FollowupID: 473440   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 08:26

Leroy posted:

yeh lots of small comercial trucks have inline 6's.....pull ya head outa the sand. There's so many running around with 4 pots.

Leroy
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AnswerID: 213080   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 21:04

Member - Captain (WA) replied:

Hi Dave,

I have had the 3.0TD for 3 years now and reckon its great. Its re-sale is the same as the 4.2TD (it costs more in the first place but % of new price is the same). The 4.2TD is no longer available (emission laws have killed it) and it never came with an auto. But the 4.2TD has a great reliability history.

If you are only keeping the vehicle for say 3-5 years, then a 3.0TD is the only way to go IMHO. However, if you are going to keep it "forever", then the 4.2TD has a proven track record that may sway you. But saying that, the series III 3.0TD's are now getting over 5 years old and have none of the problems that the series II's had.

If towing, an auto 3.0TD would be hard to go past IMHO. But you will sure get a lot of different opinions on the GU3.0TD

Cheers

Captain
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473368   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 21:26

Truckster (Vic) posted:

mates been shopping in recent weeks for GU Patrols, and the grenades are way cheaper compared to the legend in value. the 3.0's history has killed its resale.
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FollowupID: 473378   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 21:49

Member - Axle posted:

Agree with Truckster, Its hard to find a 4.2 Patrol forsale in a yard. But take your pick with the 3.0L.
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FollowupID: 473382   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 21:58

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

Yeah, of course they are cheaper - the 4.2TD cost ~$7K more in the first place so the 3.0TD should cost $4-$6K less now, depending on the age.

Check out Redbook values for a 2003 ST 5 spd - 3.0TD has 55.5% retained value versus 55.9% for 2003 ST 5 sp 4.2TD. Thats the same in my books. In fact, while the % is the same, you have actually lost LESS dollars with the 3.0TD due to the lower purchase price.

So if you reckon the 3.0TD has no resale value, then the 4.2TD is in the same boat!!!

Cheers

Captain
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473396   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 22:57

Truckster (Vic) posted:

no matter how desperate you get and how hard you try, the grenade is not in the same boat.. Im talkin real world, not redbook.

mates budget is not much, $25kish, and asked why all the 4.2s are over $35-40k compared to late mod grenades which are in his range....
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FollowupID: 473408   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 23:39

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

If you can buy a series III 3.0TD ST with$5K on each one!!!

Me thinks you are trying too hard to justify the 4.2TD over the 3.0TD. Both have their good and bad points and if one is being objective, then one can see that and choose what suits their needs the best.

In a nutshell, the 4.2TD is old school, but proven relibility with a bit of a thirst and a tendency to run hot when worked hard in summer. Its arguably the best off the shelf 4WD around when the going is tough and your in 1st low on a rocky trail.

But the 3.0TD has an auto option, is very good on juice and is a great around town as well as out 4wdriving. It has a poor off idle boost (in manual) and with all the electronics its not something i would like to try and fix in the bush. It is nicer to drive for non-4wd work day to day and makes a better all rounder IMHO.

Unfortunatley most of us have to use our vehicles as daily drivers as well as off-road weekenders or tourers and thus the 3.0TD is a good option.

Anyway, i doubt you will ever see the good side of the 3.0TD but thats your loss, no skin of my nose :)

Cheers

Captain
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473409   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 23:42

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

Opening line should have read;

"If you can buy a series III 3.0TD ST with$5K on each one!!!

Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473410   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 23:44

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

Ahh, it happened again - cannot use sideways "V' in text. Try again for first line;

If you can buy a series III 3.0TD ST with less than 100K on clock for $25K, then send them to WA and make over $5K on each one!!!
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473425   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 05:52

cokeaddict posted:

Hi Captain.....
Sorry to dissapoint you mate, not here to start this silly fude again BUT....u need to be corrected on something u said....
I quote you... "the series III 3.0TD's are now getting over 5 years old and have none of the problems that the series II's had.

Unfortunately, some still have similar problems Not as many though but still do. Nissan, in its wisdom wants ALL dealers to keep it quiet. I wonder why? This i know a fact froma very reliable cousin who works high up in nissan...(high enough to know)

Just adding to what truckster said.... there is no way on this planet, I would consider looking at a second hand 3 ltr, not even if they were around 10 grand. Just not reliable enough for me sorry.

Ange
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FollowupID: 473433   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 08:07

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

Hi Ange,

May seem like I am trying to defend the 3.0TD, but really just trying to get a balanced discussion, honest :)

ALL motors have various problems, some more than others. No denying the series II 3.0TD had more than their fair share of issues, but the series III on are now on par with virtually any diesel. Yep, the 3.0TD has MAF and EGR issues, amongst others, that gives troubles at different times, but no more than other makes and models. Also, the dealers see all the problems and considering the 3.0TD sells like ~10:1 to the 4.2TD then i would expect 10 times more issues with the 3.0TD.

Lets not get started on other make vehicle issues - EVERY vehicle has a weak point and NONE is that far above the crowd that they are immune from problems.

The point being, on various websites the series II (approx 18 months worth of vehicles) has many, many reports of failures, typically from 80,000kms on. On ExploreOz I think we have something like 15+ reported failures and given the relatively small number of readers, this is way too high a percentage. The fact the engine was recalled and replaced in Europe says something about its problems!!!

However, the series III has something like 5+ years of vehicles on the road and I have heard of two blown engines in that time that were the typical series II holed piston issues. There were significant "exceptional" circumstances that were not IMHO what I would consider normal (all engines have a human and mechanical assembly issues). And other series III failureI have heard of include one that was driven without a sump plug!!!

But this is not to say there aren't other problems with the motor. They have MAF, EGR issues etc... and the odd unxplained engine light on - but all in the same order of magnitude as any other high tech electronic diesel motor.

Whilke the GU 4.2TD is very reliable, it is also not without its issues. There have been reports on this website of engine failure, turbo failure and even an engine replacement at ~5,000kms. But the point is this is extrememly rare and you probably have as much chance of winning lotto as a 4.2TD major problem. But there is no denying this engine runs warm compared to others, it has water passage designed 20+ years ago that are now too small IMHO for the power it now makes (this was originally not designed for a turbo). But this does not detract from its reliability, just slow down a tad in very hot weather - simple.

If I was going to spend my time living in the outback, then the 4.2TD is the engine I would want!!! But the reality is I do +90% of my kms in the city (bugger!) and the 3.0TD is a much sweeter engine for day to day driving and is still a fantastic performer offroad when I do my other 10%. Perfect, no, but still damn good.

The vast majority of 4WDrivers are in my boat and I think a balanced discussion is much better than the emotive "its a hand grenade" line that gets tossed around.

While I reckon the series III+ GU 3.0TD is a great performer, it is highly unlikely I will replace my current vehicle with the same. The reason being I have previously never bought the same vehicle twice. And the fact the Hummer is coming along with the cruiser twin turbo V8 diesel cruiser, well that just wets my appetiete.

Cheers

Captain

PS. I do not think for a moment any of the diehards will ever want a 3.0TD in their driveway, but there are many, many satisfied owners who are proud to have one.

Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473435   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 08:16

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

Hi Ange,

May seem like I am trying to defend the 3.0TD, but really just trying to get a balanced discussion, honest :)

ALL motors have various problems, some more than others. No denying the series II 3.0TD had more than their fair share of issues, but the series III on are now on par with virtually any diesel. Yep, the 3.0TD has MAF and EGR issues, amongst others, that gives troubles at different times, but no more than other makes and models. Also, the dealers see all the problems and considering the 3.0TD sells like ~10:1 to the 4.2TD then i would expect 10 times more issues with the 3.0TD.

Lets not get started on other make vehicle issues - EVERY vehicle has a weak point and NONE is that far above the crowd that they are immune from problems.

The point being, on various websites the series II (approx 18 months worth of vehicles) has many, many reports of failures, typically from 80,000kms on. On ExploreOz I think we have something like 15+ reported failures and given the relatively small number of readers, this is way too high a percentage. The fact the engine was recalled and replaced in Europe says something about its problems!!!

However, the series III has something like 5+ years of vehicles on the road and I have heard of two blown engines in that time that were the typical series II holed piston issues. There were significant "exceptional" circumstances that were not IMHO what I would consider normal (all engines have a human and mechanical assembly issues and one is unrealistic to expect zero failures). Another series III failure I have heard of was one that was driven without a sump plug!!!

But this is not to say there aren't other problems with the motor. They have MAF, EGR issues etc... and the odd unexplained engine light on - but all in the same order of magnitude as any other high tech electronic diesel motor.

While the GU 4.2TD is very reliable, it is also not without its issues. There have been reports on this website of engine failure, turbo failure and even an engine replacement at ~5,000kms. But the point is this is extremely rare and you probably have as much chance of winning lotto as a 4.2TD major problem.

But there is no denying this engine runs warm compared to others, it has water passage designed 20+ years ago that are now too small IMHO for the power it now makes (this was originally not designed for a turbo). But this does not detract from its reliability, just slow down a tad in very hot weather - simple.

If I was going to spend my time living in the outback, then the GU 4.2TD is the engine I would want!!! But the reality is I do +90% of my kms in the city (bugger!) and the 3.0TD is a much sweeter engine for day to day driving and is still a fantastic performer offroad when I do my other 10%. Perfect, no, but still damn good.

The vast majority of 4WDrivers are in my boat and I think a balanced discussion is much better than the emotive "its a hand grenade" line that gets tossed around.

While I reckon the series III+ GU 3.0TD is a great performer, it is highly unlikely I will replace my current vehicle with the same. The reason being I have previously never bought the same vehicle twice. The fact the Hummer is coming along with the cruiser twin turbo V8 diesel cruiser, well that just wets my appetite. And toss in Nissan's woeful support of any warranty issues (not 3.0TD related in this case) its very, very unlikely I would ever buy a Nissan again.

Cheers

Captain

PS. I do not think for a moment that any of the diehards will ever change their mind about the 3.0TD, but at least others can now hear a different viewpoint form a satisfied 3.0TD owner. Besides, why let the facts get in the way of a good discussion ;)

Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473436   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 08:18

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

Bugger, having a lot of double posting and editing issues while replying to this thread arn't I :) Where is the edit/delete button when you need it.
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473474   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 10:44

Truckster (Vic) posted:

I'm trying too hard to justify??
ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!
talk about
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FollowupID: 473528   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 15:07

Member - Roachie (SA) posted:

Hey Trucky,
Tell your mate to give me a call. I'm almost ready to sell my GU. I just have a couple of mods left to swap over and it will be back to almost bog stock (Transfer case and front locker). I've already swapped-out the Denco turbo, Long range tank and PWR radiator plus smaller things like the dashpod, UHF, umpteen gauges etc.
I'm only going to be asking about $28K. It's done 210,000klm (never been off-road of course)

Cheers

Roachie
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AnswerID: 213088   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 21:29

poppy2 replied:

Hello Dave , I think by reading the forums one would be able to make up their mind.Looks like the 3.0 ltr have their fair share of costly problems.
After reading the forums I now know why they spell Ni$$an this way.My son has a 2000 model and has been shelling out big buck for a while now.Diesel pump, O2 sensors etc.Then the forum is saying they have a crook gearbox. Sorry.
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AnswerID: 213122   Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 03, 2007 at 23:24

Voxson (Adelaide) replied:

factory nissan bar is not a good option....
if you buy an arb steel winchbar,,, then the world is your oyster with winch choice....
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FollowupID: 473453   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 09:11

Leroy posted:

That's it? Nothing to say about the engine? I surprised since I saw your new vehicle in the trader section the other day. An over reaction to a bad days driving?
Just thought you would have a little more to add to the discussion than just the bar comment.

Leroy
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FollowupID: 473465   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 09:44

Voxson (Adelaide) posted:

I have sold the vehicle to somebody on this forum and i dont really hve anything other than the bar to comment on....
The vehicle was quite a nice touring unit...
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FollowupID: 473467   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 09:47

Leroy posted:

very diplomatic :-))

Leroy
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FollowupID: 473469   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 10:06

Voxson (Adelaide) posted:

Why thank you Leroy....
But the vehicle i have just bought is an absolute WEAPON....
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FollowupID: 473473   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 10:41

Leroy posted:

4.2l auto???? Please explain?

Leroy

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FollowupID: 473481   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 11:07

Voxson (Adelaide) posted:

Yep.. Cant say much at the moment,,, but it is factory fitted...
Even in the owners book it states "AUTO"....
Some sort of Govt vehicle...
Front and rear air lockers, twin wheel carriers,, etc etc...
Same set up as my white one...but with all ARB gear...
Pretty cool huh?
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FollowupID: 473524   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 14:50

Leroy posted:

It sounds pretty cool. And an auto? So it's not in your possesion as yet I gather?

Leroy
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FollowupID: 473544   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 16:23

Voxson (Adelaide) posted:

Yes it is in my possession...
I just dont know much about the car..
Got a couple of good clouts on the door though,, but i couldnt resist it...
Hey,, i was almost going to buy a 100 series so i could get the 4.2 auto..
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AnswerID: 213148   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 07:36

Member - Teabag (Queanbeyan) replied:

Dave,

Mate, you are going to hear many horror stories about the 3lt Patrol and yes, some are true but it all must be put in perspective. I would be interested to know whether the people bagging them have actually owned are 3lt Patrol and are giving an informed appraisal or they have heard from a mate or a mates mate that they are crap? It begs the question? Every vehicle has it's issues and the 3lt isn't on it's own in that respect. Not bagging the Toyota but it has several issues wrt front diff and the independent front suspension breaking. The 3ltr Patrol is a great truck that many owners have had a great run out of and they are very good on fuel. I chose the 4.2TDi because I am towing a rather heavy load and the 4.2 is a better option for this.
Nissan Steel bar is fine (think it is made by ARB anyway) and the factory winch is a 9000lb Warn so you won't go wrong. I don't have the Factory Satnav but I have heard from others on the Patrol forum that it isn't worth the money, how true that is I don't know........

Good luck with what ever truck you chose but the 3ltr is a fine tourer......
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FollowupID: 473437   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 08:21

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

What, a balanced post from a 4.2TD owner!!! Watch out before they lynch you for such disrespect ;)

Cheers

Captain
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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FollowupID: 473446   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 08:38

Member - Teabag (Queanbeyan) posted:

Captain,

Unfortunately there are many one eyed supporters of particular vehicles on both the Nissan and Toyota side. For me both are great vehicles not without there certain particular issues......I've had several 4wd's (2 Toyota's, 1 Jackaroo and 2 Patrols) and I mainly went the new Patrol for value for money. The 4.2TDi Cruiser was $16000 more, now that's a lot of extras....In the bush they are very comparable.........Though many would think differently?
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FollowupID: 473447   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 08:44

Member - Captain (WA) posted:

Can't deny any of that!

Cheers

Captain

PS. Don't let that cold one go off!!!
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum
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AnswerID: 213177   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 10:10

banjodog replied:

I wonder how the LandCruiser would have performed against the Patrol if Toyota fitted it with the 3.0L Hilux/Prado diesel?

Then we would have seen debates between the two 3.0L engines and not just between the 4.2L and the 3.0L.

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AnswerID: 213224   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 15:24

Dave Thomson replied:

Yes I have had both and the Patrol was the best towing vehicle by a mile {3Lt T/D} but that was'nt the reason I sold it , it was Nissans refusal to do anything but walk away from me {the customer. you remember him dont you ?} but how can we ever win when you've got your own team telling you its your own stupid fault for buying a 3Lt {thanks for that Truckster} have to wonder if it happened to a 4.2 would that be your stupid fault or would you expect some kind of back up ? no the Patrol is a great car that suffers from a lack of back up from its parent company, add to that insane prices like 5 GRAND for a fuel pump and its not hard to see why I wont go back there ,as for me I'll stick with the Toyo, it may not get me there as fast as the Patrol but at least it will get me there...................
best regards and good luck,
Dave
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FollowupID: 473535   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 15:36

Member - Teabag (Queanbeyan) posted:

Dave,

Freedom of choice is a wonderful thing..........After sales service, ah there are many companies out there that are very lacking in this area.........
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AnswerID: 213252   Submitted: Thursday, Jan 04, 2007 at 17:57

go2mud replied:

OK, thanks for all your opinions, gives me something to chew over. I appreciate the responses that look at both sides of the discussion, for and against. Will hopefully have made up my mind by the end of March, am doing a tag along tour of Vic Highlands, so that will hopefully show me a few more things I need to keep in mind when replacing my vehicle.

Cheers guys

Regards

Dave
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AnswerID: 213452   Submitted: Friday, Jan 05, 2007 at 16:00

Outbacktourer replied:

go2mud,

Just catching up on threads here and see you have opened the perennial can of worms again. The GU 3.0Di seems to polarise opinions. I have a 2002 ST 3.0Di Auto with around 90K on it and I can assure you it is a great allrounder and super tuff. I hear about the problems with earlier models but from my perspective it's one of the most reliable and economical to run vehicles I have ever had. I was looking around the market recently (wanted a dual cab ute) and the 4WD dealers said that the 3.0's were easier to shift than others and at times were "hard to get". Mine was valued at around the $25K mark as a trade and I was told it would retail at $32K. I have instead decided to keep the GU and invest $16K into it for a chassis stretch and alloy trayback because I could not find anything that would come close for the same money ($25K+$16K=$41K) particularly considering I'd need to start again with mods.

The 3.0Di is a relatively high tech engine so it will punish any lack of attention to issues that may occur. The MAF sensor is the cause of many earlier problems because if it becomes faulty it will affect boost (the turbo is variable vane controlled by the ecu) and fuelling. I understand they have improved the MAF but I would not own one of these without fitting a Turbo boost gauge to keep any eye on any strange behavior and carry a spare MAF Sensor (about $250). Always run the OEM air filter. I have a dTronic chip fitted and it made a noticeable difference, even lowered EGT's slightly, contrary to popular opinion (I also have a EGT gauge). Being high tech also means you only have one belt to change, no tappets, chain driven timing (no belt change) and 10k oil intervals and great fuel economy. They are the cheapest full size wagon to run by some margin.

I have now also have a 100 Series 4.2 TD for general duties and seat of the pants says 3.0Di with dTronic has about the same poke as the Tojo 4.2 in standard form, albeit not fully run in.

Mine has been all over the joint and I hear what others say but also look at what they drive and trust my own experience and never by the first of a series of a vehicle from any maker. BTW I have had a mate with a 2000 ex Police DX that blew due to early piston problems and he was well treated by Nissan, no problems since. Also had a mate with the 80 series 4.2TD years ago that ran it's bearings, and it's the same engine as I just bought in the 100!

Just my 2 bits

OT

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