2007 Prado CRD Blowing smoke

Submitted: Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 19:20
ThreadID: 104865 Views:7512 Replies:6 FollowUps:10
This Thread has been Archived
Hi guys & gals. I have a 2007 model Toyota Prado Common Rail Diesel. Its only done 120,000 km. Main use is towing my Olympic Tandem axle caravan 21ft internal. No probs doing that. Unfortunately since the start of winter its been a bit rattley and after it heats up quiet as a mouse. But lately when starting cold its been blowing a reasonable amount of smoke. this goes away when its warmed up. then mightn't do it again. But a week or a coupla days later puff. Cant find any oil traces on the concrete drive. or around the engine. Etc. My mechanic said might need some wizz bang work done on the injectors and chip???? He said this would cost about $1,400 total , and this was cheap. A lot cheaper than using toyota replacement injectors @ $1,900.00 each.

First any clue on the symptoms I described to confirm or otherwise need to replace injectors.

Secondly. Is is likely to be a loose pipe or similar squirting on the engine and making smoke

Third. If It is dud injector(s) any clues hints in this area.

Regards

Mick
Back Expand Un-Read 0 Moderator

Reply By: Member - Toyocrusa (NSW) - Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 19:48

Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 19:48
It is fairly common on that range of D4D engines. Your mechanic sounds like he is pretty much on the ball. A local Diesel injector service company charge $1800 so your quote sounds pretty good. Cheers,Bob.
AnswerID: 520346

Follow Up By: Macka MM - Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 20:16

Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 20:16
What about this chip. What do they do and why should they be replaced??


Thanks

Mick
0
FollowupID: 800786

Follow Up By: fisho64 - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 01:38

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 01:38
jeez a mate had all his in his D4D Hilux replaced $4700 by Toyota, so if your bloke wants $1800 per injector there sounds like a bit of a fiddle going on?
You can get Denso genuine injectors new off Ebay for $300-$500
0
FollowupID: 800795

Follow Up By: fisho64 - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 01:42

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 01:42
sorry that should have been on the original post!
0
FollowupID: 800796

Reply By: garrycol - Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 20:28

Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 20:28
Assuming that your engine is basically OK I bet the smoke is actually black meaning it is unburnt fuel. Most likely cause is the a glow plug issue causing not all fuel being burnt when completely cold and as the engine gets a bit of heat into it the fuel burn gets better.

Next option may be injectors with a bit of carbon on them so the spray pattern is not so great causing some fuel not to be burnt on start - again as heat gets into the system the excess fuel is burnt.

Garry
AnswerID: 520349

Follow Up By: Member - bbuzz (NSW) - Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 21:13

Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 21:13
Nope.
Its injector seals. May as well replace the injectors while they're out. Any good injector mechanic will know about this problem and can source the appropriate bits.

Look up Pradopoint.com on this matter - you will find about 90 pages of comments.

If you take your Prado to NZ, they will replace them as part of an extended warranty. Same for the Hilux but not here in Oz.

Apparently we get a better class of vehicle.....

bill
Bill B

Member
My Profile  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 800788

Follow Up By: AlbyNSW - Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 22:49

Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 22:49
I am guessing that you have the smoking problem more so when you park downhill ? as Bill said it is most likely the injector seals ( washers) they are a cheap part at a few dollars each but need to be replaced. You should also get your injectors checkled to see if they are still within spec before forking out any money to replace them. Next oil change have your mechanic look up into the sump at the oil pickup screen to make sure it is not blocked as this has been known to kill a D4D motor through oil starvation.
If you need new injectors there is a company called Baileys Diesel at Wollongong who refurbish injectors and offer a better warranty than Toyota and are much cheaper as well, any reputable diesel workshop can fit them for you.
I would not be onside rung adding a chip until you have standard system running correctly, a chip will only enhance any problems you have not fix them.
0
FollowupID: 800790

Follow Up By: Ross M - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 11:15

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 11:15
It won't be parking down hill, what a misleading thing to say.
It also won't be injector seals as they seal combustion pressure from escaping. So definitely NOT that.

The injectors may be faulty and cause poor atomisation and that will cause black smoke.
Toyota injectors don't seem to have a long life.

If you use good quality diesel oil and change it regularly then there will be NO blocking of the pickup screen in the sump and having it checked is just plain BS. If the oil is good stuff there will be NO sludge EVER inside the engine, even when it is stuffed, worn out and won't go.

There is a lot of guessing in some comments, comments should be to guide and assist the poster, not confuse the hell out of them.
0
FollowupID: 800813

Follow Up By: Member - LeighW - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 11:48

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 11:48
Ignore above post Ross M is wrong, if your getting white smoke on start up it will be faulty injector seals as Alby NSW wrote.

The faulty seals let oil drain down into the piston hence white smoke on start up, also as he wrote, during running the seals let carbon from the combustion process back into the rocker area where it mixes with oil, when it drains back to the sump it clogs together and clogs the pickup screen, can cause oil starvation and motor to seize.

If you have the old seals, and most likely you have if they have failed you probably have the old type injectors that have been known to fail and also cause catastrophic engine fail I would suggest you replace them with the newer type when you get the seals repalced.
Also0 as mentioned there are about 130 packages on prado point about this issue, it is a well known problem with the D4 though Toyota is preferring to ignore it. See PP 120 section,Diesel engine, injector rattle.

Leigh

Lifetime Member
My Profile  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 800814

Follow Up By: AlbyNSW - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 13:04

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 13:04
Thanks Lee, you saved me a lot of typing LOL
Ross this issue has been researched and discussed extensively on the Prado and Hilux forums and the problem acknowledged by Toyota in other parts of the world but not Austalia
I respect that you may be experienced in mechanical issues but in this case you are incorrect
There is much information on the subject if you would like to research it
0
FollowupID: 800817

Follow Up By: Ross M - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 19:15

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 19:15
The OP didn't mention white smoke at all, just more smoke on startup which can as mentioned, be faulty glowplugs.

Having changed injector copper seals on Rangers they blow out a fair amount of gas and the blow by would be quite noticeable. Also compression would be less too. On a Mazda/Ranger you can easily hear the squeak of the sonic gasses as they depart the combustion chamber.

If Toyota D4D engines are bad enough to leak and it is into the cam area then the oil will turn black quickly and if it continues for long the gas will erode the head sealing surface.

If it has bogged up the oil and caused an engine failure, then I think the service person wasn't very observant and repeatedly didn't notice the oil condition was far worse than it should be.

Do D4D engine, blow injector washers because they never get their valve clearances checked and therefore never have the cam cover off to check injector tightness either.
There has to be a glaring omission or fault which is going unnoticed or not cared about if the inj washers are failing.
0
FollowupID: 800832

Follow Up By: Member - LeighW - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 21:17

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 21:17
The valve clearance should be check at X kilometers but the dealers in Australia have not been doing it, they just listen and if it's quite it's ok!

If they had of done the valve clearance check as specified which requires removal of the injectors then the injector seals or sheets whichever you choose to call them would have been swapped out and most of the problems avoided.

Yes your correct about the erosion, if left for long enough it will errode the head. Can't comment on the condition of the oil as haven't seen an affected engine.

On the D4D there doesn't appear to be any indication of the seal failure in early stages apart from the smoke, ie no noise but then it may be masked by the noisy injectors but then that's another story.

If the smoke is not noticed at start up even with regular oil changes, and some have been doing 5000KM changes the pickup screen will eventually clog and starve the engine of oil.

There have been quite a few instances of engines seizing and I believe several court cases underway or pending against Toyota.

Leigh

Lifetime Member
My Profile  Send Message

0
FollowupID: 800840

Reply By: Member Bushy 04(VIC) - Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 22:59

Friday, Oct 25, 2013 at 22:59
Hey mick get your glow plugs checked as it sound exactly like my ford with a winter start, changed the glow plugs and smoke vanished.
2 plugs had failed , cheap fix.
Hope this helps
Bushy.
AnswerID: 520355

Reply By: Member - Rosco from way back - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 01:33

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 01:33
Mick

All the above is sound advice, but someone's having a serious loan if they told you injectors are $1900 apiece.
AnswerID: 520359

Reply By: Member - LeighW - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 11:51

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 11:51
Ignore above post Ross M is wrong, if your getting white smoke on start up it will be faulty injector seals as Alby NSW wrote.

The faulty seals let oil drain down into the piston hence white smoke on start up, also as he wrote, during running the seals let carbon from the combustion process back into the rocker area where it mixes with oil, when it drains back to the sump it clogs together and clogs the pickup screen, can cause oil starvation and motor to seize.

If you have the old seals, and most likely you have if they have failed you probably have the old type injectors that have been known to fail and also cause catastrophic engine fail I would suggest you replace them with the newer type when you get the seals repalced.
Also0 as mentioned there are about 130 packages on prado point about this issue, it is a well known problem with the D4 though Toyota is preferring to ignore it. See PP 120 section,Diesel engine, injector rattle.

Leigh

Lifetime Member
My Profile  Send Message

AnswerID: 520367

Reply By: olcoolone - Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 18:46

Saturday, Oct 26, 2013 at 18:46
First thing you need to do is take it to someone with a good quality scan tool who can read the feedback from the injector to see if they are running within parameter.

If out of parameters they will need replacing and as other have said the seals could be causing it but no use doing the seals if the injectors are out of range.

Toyota Europe has had a recall for 2004-2007 models.

Here is a link to the European recall.
http://www.toyota-tech.eu/toms_cabs/EN/1KET-015.pdf
AnswerID: 520390

Sponsored Links

Popular Products (13)