Dilution of engine coolant

Submitted: Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 21:41
ThreadID: 11499 Views:4005 Replies:10 FollowUps:14
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Hi all, I have a 100 series Toyota landcruiser and have had the radiator repaired. When the fella doing the repair added new coolant he diluted the concentrated aniticorosion antifreeze coolant 50/50 with water . Does anyone know if this is ok or should he have refilled it with undiluted coolant.
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Reply By: Member - Eskimo - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 21:46

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 21:46
it all depends on what coolant was used
AnswerID: 51661

Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 21:55

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 21:55
Xactly .... but I always require they use de-mineralised water.
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Reply By: glenno - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:05

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:05
type in www.are.com.au and then go to the heading tech , then scroll down to tech index , then in tech talk click on horror pictures .
AnswerID: 51672

Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:25

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:25
Glenno

Interesting read about the stray current. Checked our's a while back and found 0.25V in the Fender and 0.53V in herself's Pathy.

A simple ground wire is all that's required.
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Follow Up By: Willem - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 23:42

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 23:42
Rosco,

I never find anything straying my way.....:-)
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Follow Up By: Member - Bob - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 08:03

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 08:03
Rosco,
don't do it.
Had this discussion elsewhere and it is normal to have a small voltage between the radiator and the chassis. Just the same as the battery you made as a kid with two dissimilar metals stuck in a lemon. That is why the radiator is isolated from the chassis. When it is shorted or someone connects a ground wire you complete the circuit. Electrons start to flow and the electrolytic destruction of your expensive radiator starts to happen. The aluminium acts as a sacrificial anode.
Disconnect the wire ASAP. How long has it been connected? Apparently severe damage can occur quite quickly. Signs are the presence of a dark coloured aluminium salt in the coolant fluid. The next sign is weeping from the radiator and loss of coolant volume. The last sign is weeping by the owner and a $1000 hole in your bank account (new radiator)
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 08:50

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 08:50
Bob

Now you've got me confused. The site above, to which Glenno refers, suggests stray current is a killer.

I have also spoken to a mob in Mackay who make a low water warning setup for cooling systems and they claim it also addresses the problem of stray current as a side issue by improving the earth.

I also asked the service manager at the stealer who was very interested as, in his words ... "we've had a lot of premature radiator failures which may be attributed to this".

Without the ground wire ....0.25V ... with ground wire 0.0V. Seems to me I've removed the potential difference, the cause for electrolysis ... not added to it.

Confusion reigns supreme
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Follow Up By: Member - Bob - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 12:55

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 12:55
Rosco,
do you have a microammeter. It would be interesting to measure the current flowing through the earthing wire. Those electrons are released when Aluminium atoms in the metal lattice (zero charge) are converted to Aluminium ions (3+ charge).
The same thing could be said for a battery. By shorting the terminals you have zero potential difference but quite a significant chemical reaction occurring inside the battery.
The voltage that we are talking about here is cause by dissimilar metals (iron and aluminium) immersed in an electrolyte solution (just like a battery) and is present even when the car battery is disconnected.
Stray current is another matter and is caused by current flowing through the chassis of the car and is derived from the main car battery. It can be reduced by carefully earthing all equipment on the vehicle with copper wire running parallel to the postive wire that supplies it.
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 13:44

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 13:44
Bob

Thanks for that explanation ... tends to put it all in perspective.
I've taken your advice and already removed the earthing wire.

I have a much better grasp of so called "stray currents".

Cheers
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Follow Up By: Member - Eskimo - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:11

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:11
it wouldnt matter at your age if you did...would it... hehehe
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Follow Up By: Member - Eskimo - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:13

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:13
oops
willem the above was meant for you
"it wouldnt matter at your age if you did...would it... hehehe"
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Follow Up By: Willem - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:29

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:29
Richard......if what you are implying is true then you had better do some 'catch-up' before you get to where I am now.....but you are wrong my friend...hahahahaha
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Reply By: Ralph2 - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:06

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:06
Mark not all coolants are compatable, if he did'nt use the exact same coolant it should be drained and flushed than refilled, if not it can damage your cooling system, a Natrad (RADIATOR REPAIRER) agent went to great lenghts to explain it to me.
AnswerID: 51673

Follow Up By: glenno - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:11

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:11
type in the website above.
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Follow Up By: Member - Eskimo - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:16

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 19:16
Yep been here and seen mine stuffed up all beacause they didnt flush the system properly when they changed from standard toyota coolant
cost a bit over $1400 to fix
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Reply By: Steve - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:24

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:24
I.M.H.O.... drain the system, flush, and replace the coolant...use Toyota brand as without this your warranty may be voided...and sleep in peace !!!..sorry, but been there, done that, and the alternative is very expensive !!!
AnswerID: 51680

Follow Up By: Member - Fay D Away (Vic) - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:36

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:36
What do you recomend if you havent got a warranty to worry about?
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Reply By: Steve - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:54

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 22:54
Sorry .. but my advice doesn't differ .... its all about maintenance....if you want to save a handful of dollars .... dont ask for advice ....buy some other cheap stuff ....
AnswerID: 51687

Reply By: Member - Robert (WA) - Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 23:41

Tuesday, Mar 23, 2004 at 23:41
you should change your coolant every 2 years or 40000 km which ever comes first if you can stick to the toyota coolant as it is a good coolant i removed a head of a hiace van the other day and it had 240000 km on the clock and the guy had used toyota coolant in it from new and there was no corosion at all on the head

Robert
AnswerID: 51701

Reply By: fozzy - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 07:52

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 07:52
toyota now sell a long life coolant called something like (super long life) which is all ready diluted to 50/50 mixture
check your local toyota dealer to confirm 100%
AnswerID: 51724

Reply By: The Banjo - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 09:16

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 09:16
Far as I know its all to do with the concentration of ethylene glycol - the various brands all have prices that seem to reflect how much EG there is in there - Tectaloy 4 year has about 50% - the cheaper ones much less. Holden's coolant concentrate is designed to be mixed 50/50 with water - that would end up at about 23% in the donk I think. Seems safe to say that the higher concentrations are best, but they cost. Suppose there is a limit.....guess we need some water seeing that it probably cools better than the EG. Have heard that it is bad news to mix brands - flush and refill is the go........Re Tectaloy.......took the head off a previous vehicle I had at about 180K - not the slightest sign of corrosion anywhere - 10 years service.
AnswerID: 51730

Reply By: Davoe - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 10:52

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 10:52
Undiluted coolant contains about 960grams per litre of ethylene glycol which is the active ingrediant. It is recomended that the undiluted coolant be diluted to a maximum of 33% and a minimum of 50% to be effective. To get the full details of what the difference in concentration does to the boiling point of your coolant go to your auto parts shop and look on the back of concentrated valvoline coolant which contains the details. Sounds like a good mechanic coz a lot will overdilute the coolant and fill it up with tap water.Although in fairness the run of the mill customer would baulk at the price of filling a radiator up with 50% quality coolant and demin water
AnswerID: 51737

Reply By: cokeaddict - Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 15:32

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 15:32
Ok so how much water does the cooling system hold on a GQ 4.2 Diesel?
Im about to remove my radiator to give it a good flush externally after some mud fun. I was thinking of getting someone to give it a flush internally after re fitment of radiator, but sounds to me like it cant be done at home without too many dramas.
Im thinking.... If i run the radiator hose throught it for a few minutes to clean out what ever is in there, that sounds like it will do the trick. Am i right or not? Also should i flush out the bottle as well? Im assuming i should.

Opinions would be great here.
Regards Angelo
AnswerID: 51776

Follow Up By: Member - Ed. C.- Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 23:34

Wednesday, Mar 24, 2004 at 23:34
Angelo,
Gregorys manual states 13.6 L inthe GQ 4.2 incl. heater & reservoir tank.. which brings me to my next point....

When flushing your cooling system... Don't forget the heater core!!!!!
It's as simple as turning the heater control to "hot", thus opening the
in-line "flapper" valve...
Many people neglect this, not good if using a differend brand of coolant than previously used...

Regards, Ed. C.
Confucius say.....
"He who lie underneath automobile with tool in hand,
....Not necessarily mechanic!!"

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