Bad shimmy in steering HZJ75
Submitted: Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 12:40
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rb30e
Have been experiencing a real bad shimmy in the front steering of our troopy, usually around 80-90kph. Its especially bad when towing and up hills, figured maybe coz less weight on front?
Have had the wheels balanced but no difference.
Today I decided to check the king pin bearings. So I disconnected both drag links and felt the smoothness of the movement in the hubs. They were very notchy.
After stripping the hub to investigate I found both the king pin bearings and the CV joints were very notchy.
I'm really hoping that if I fix this this will be the route of the shimmy in the steering. Any ideas?
Also I rebuilt the hubs about 40k ago with new bearings, seals and CV joints.
We shipped this car and travelled around the world. On the road we had an issue with the spindle needle bearing, it disintegrated and sent metal through the hub. We had it apart on the side of the road many times trying to sort the issue I'm guessing this has caused the premature failure of the CV and King pin bearings. Particularly because cleaning out the hub and relubricating everything properly was a challenge whilst on the road. We were in the middle of the Pamir mountain range in Tajikistan when it happened!
Reply By: Member - ACD 1 - Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 12:50
Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 12:50
Look so like you've considered most of the obvious...
...have you thought about replacing the steering damper. This is where the wobble came from in mine. Once replaced - wobble gone. (If you do end up replacing it, consider an RTC).
Cheers
Anthony
AnswerID:
599697
Follow Up By: fisho64 - Monday, May 09, 2016 at 09:29
Monday, May 09, 2016 at 09:29
Hate to say it but Id
hazard a guess that replacing the steering damper has just covered up the source of the wobble.
A steering damper is really intended to stop the wheel being ripped out of your hands when say you hit a pothole etc.
Given that when driving along the road it does absolutely nothing, I cant see how it could actually CAUSE a wobble?
FollowupID:
869000
Follow Up By: Member - ACD 1 - Monday, May 09, 2016 at 14:33
Monday, May 09, 2016 at 14:33
Sorry Fisho
Your guess would be wrong.
Like rb30e, I went through the process of having each part of the steering checked and then I went on and had each part replaced. I also had
suspension, wheels and tyres looked at. This did nothing to remove the wobble. A lot of time and money for nothing.
It was only when the steering damper was replaced that the problem ceased. As I said in the post above - "This is where the wobble came from in mine". I am not suggesting that it is the cause of rb30e's wobble but shouldnt be discredited.
At the time - 90% of my driving was on gravel roads. Not driving around on bitumen.
Cheers
Anthony
FollowupID:
869014
Reply By: Bob Y. - Qld - Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 14:24
Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 14:24
The rollers in the kingpin cones wear into
the cups, in the straight ahead position, causing the rollers to jump in & out of the grooves, which in turn causes a vagueness while driving along straight roads. Feel this is only part of you shimmy problem..........
That shimmy, from my experience, is more likely to be the (drag link)tie rod ends, that is the adjustable, repairable joints. Worthwhile replacing these anyway, after your OS trip. They're only about $20 each. Don't know what would have caused the needle rollers to collapse, unless they were lacking in lubrication, or some other stress factor. Would the axle housing be bent at all? Might be worth checking it?
We've never had any more king pin dramas after we started pumping grease into the hub, through that small threaded plug hole, about 20 strokes every 10K kms. However, it's sensible maintenance to replace king pin brgs every 100K, if used regularly in rough or severe conditions.
As Alan suggested a new damper won't go astray.
Good luck,
Bob.
AnswerID:
599703
Reply By: Member - mechpete - Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 16:53
Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 16:53
my experience with shimmy in steering at 80-90kph
has been lack of preload on the king pin bearings on my patrol
tightened them ,that fixed it , I fitted a return to centre steering
damper also that made it steer very nice as well
cheers mechpete
AnswerID:
599709
Follow Up By: rb30e - Monday, May 09, 2016 at 12:41
Monday, May 09, 2016 at 12:41
Thanks for the reply.
This is an issue I'm a little concerned about. I have a feeling I have to much preload on my bearings which have caused them to fail prematurely.
They did about 40K and have a very defined notch when pointing straight forward.
I relubed the entire hub assembly at about 20K also.
I read the workshop manual regarding setting up the preload on these bearings but lack the special
tools or knowledge to get this right. When I rebuilt it prior to this I just used the old shims in the same position as where they were. Now I'm thinking I need to get a bunch of these shims and the spring gauge to get this right.
Is that the only way its done because its a bitch getting the king pins on and off the bearings. Its kinda like you only get one shot at it then you have to muck around pretty hard to take it all apart, risk damaging the bearings and try again with different shims.
FollowupID:
869005
Reply By: Member - mechpete - Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 17:14
Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 17:14
when I had to buy a spindel a couple of weeks ago the new part had the needle roller bearing in it , I was told it is the upgraded version now used
on the 100 series LC
cheers mechpete
AnswerID:
599712
Reply By: Member - ross s - Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 19:51
Sunday, May 08, 2016 at 19:51
On my troopy, I have had issues with a steering shimmy that could have been solved from fixing a variety of items. First thing that made the situation better was castor correction wedges after a 2inch lift ( was actually more like 3..) Swivel hub rebuild ( bearings,seals ect). Made a difference. Replaced tyres.. better. Got rid of cheap sunrasier rims for "better" set. Changed
suspension bushes from neoprene back to rubber. Now all good. Drives very well now. Not sure what actually made it good but all these things have been done. On occasion when a small shake has appeared it has been a re torque of the hub retaining nut that has sorted it. In have also replaced the drag link/ tie rod ends and steering dampener. I have had both standard and rtc steering dampeners, with 33inch tyres, and haven't felt very different. Good luck.
AnswerID:
599714
Reply By: 2517. - Monday, May 09, 2016 at 15:59
Monday, May 09, 2016 at 15:59
Had a similar problem turn out Kumo tyres were out of round ,a new set fixed the problem.
AnswerID:
599757
Reply By: P K - Friday, May 13, 2016 at 21:52
Friday, May 13, 2016 at 21:52
Hi rb30e
Had the same problem with mine, took me awhile to find the culprit, steering damper had dead spot in it when driving straight ahead, put a new one on it fixed, after i replaced other items which didn't fix it.
Cheers Paul.
AnswerID:
600009