Led light Bars??

Submitted: Friday, Sep 02, 2016 at 22:24
ThreadID: 133368 Views:4665 Replies:3 FollowUps:23
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So just whats the legal aspect of these things??


They are a brilliant light, BUT!!...Copped one full on the other night,in a area that I would think that high beam would be enough!!!!!!!!. ..I can see the advantage on country roads,..I think the idea of just anyone just being able to
purchase one, mount it anywhere and off we go idea, is not is not so bright!!..lol/

Cheers Axle.






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Reply By: Member - ACD 1 - Friday, Sep 02, 2016 at 23:11

Friday, Sep 02, 2016 at 23:11
I dare say that they are considered the same as spotlights and in fact high beam.

You can only use them when they don't cause interference or daze other drivers (not just oncoming traffic).

Cheers

Anthony
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Follow Up By: pop2jocem - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 06:47

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 06:47
As Anthony has said, no different to the use of high beam or any other type of spot light. Also fog lights, although I must say I find the legislation regarding their use a little confusing. Correctly mounted and aligned fog lights are designed to illuminate the area low to the ground.

Cheers
Pop
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Reply By: Member - Paul B (WA) - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 08:49

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 08:49
Whoa! Stop right there. Aren't there enough rules in this world? Can't we just once stop looking for extra things to lessen our freedoms?
Paul B Kalgoorlie

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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 09:17

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 09:17
what about the freedom of other drivers to see and not die.
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Follow Up By: Member - Rod N (QLD) - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 09:19

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 09:19
I don't think any one is suggesting extra rules. AFAIK LED driving lights are treated the same as other types of driving lights. If people followed the rules and used common sense there would be no need for more rules.
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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 10:44

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 10:44
but they don't
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Follow Up By: oetkb - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 12:16

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 12:16
Settle down bantam! There's always going to be a small minority that, regardless of rules and laws are going to act like idiots.
I'm pretty sure we've all copped some high beams in our face on a blind corner or similar and I don't see vast numbers of people dying from it.
Its that exact kind of response that helps turn our country into a bigger nanny state.
Have you yourself never accidently high beamed someone?
How about you look at it from the perspective that having those light bars and spotties has enabled thousands of people to avoid having high speed collisions with wandering stock, kangaroos and Wombats, not to mention the odd non lighted cyclist at night. How many lives has increased lighting saved? probably more than have died by being dazzled.
But lets just stick with your idea because you have the "freedom to drive, see and not die. It's all about you mate.
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 12:49

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 12:49
My personal observation is the following light VS owner, equation ...

"The arrogance and aggressiveness of the 4WD owner is directly related to the number of lights he's got mounted on his roof."

If I see a bloke shoving his massive bullbar nearly through my back window, wanting me go 15kmh over the limit - can't wait for even 10 seconds to get in front of a couple of slower vehicles - drives within 50mm of those bloody nuisance cyclists - then I can pretty well guarantee this bloke has at least 4 lights, and up to 8, mounted on his roof!

This same bloke is all too happy to "blast the eyeballs" out any oncoming driver who is 2 seconds slow on dipping his lights, with a good dose of high beam and 8 spotties - generally done with a big chuckle, too, I guess.

I mean to say, I can see around 800M down the road with a couple of good spotties or a decent front-mounted, medium size LED bar - so I think these blokes with enough lighting that makes WW2 searchlights look like candles, must either have some serious eyesight problems - or serious ego problems!

Or perhaps they need that 2km lit-up area in front, because they're going so fast, they need that distance to stop! LOL

Not enough lighting! LOL

Cheers, Ron.
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Follow Up By: Malcom M - Monday, Sep 05, 2016 at 08:09

Monday, Sep 05, 2016 at 08:09
I have a 2002 100 series which has factory candles for high beams. Thats despite a full wiring and HIR bulb upgrade. 100's simply have crap lighting.
I don't have a LED bar on the roof but do have some 400 watts of LED spots on the bullbar.

I use these all the time on country roads at night so I can see wombats and roos before impact. I couldn't care less about whats a kilometer or more in front.
Yup, its a bitch to be hit in the eyes by that much firepower but its only for the second it takes to drop into low beam.

Have you not noticed how much lighting firepower the road trains have? Bit more that a light bar.
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Reply By: The Bantam - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 10:26

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 10:26
There are some issues that need to be addressed in new revisions to the ADRs and state legeslation.
.
In the past it was reasonable that driving lights where limited in number and pretty much unlimited in brightness, pattern and wattage.
That was at a time when there where practical limits to how bright and powerfull a spotlights could be on a motor vehicle.
The practical limit was 400 watts of halogen, which equates to about 80 to 100 watts of LED ... for most mortals 200 watts of halogen was enough
.
Now we have a situation where brightness is more or less unlimited due to LED and HID technology ...... this IS a problem.
.
In the past ( not currently) headlights and driving lights of road vehicles where restricted by a specification that said they have to be above a certain height and below another height ( from memory between 600 and 900mm off the road).
That no longer applies to driving lights.
.
High mounted driving lights have been legal under ADRs for quite some time.
One of the problems with roof mounted driving lights is, that they are above the driver's eye line and this can be seen by on-comming traffic before the driver can see the lights of the on-comming car.
.
There are some quite sensible rules that have been abandoned or become obsolete.
.
Now here are another couple of issues.
.
Low beam blindness
If your high beam is excessivly bright, your eyes will adjust and all this brightness will be of little benifit.
Then when you dip to low beam your eyes will not adjust fast enough and you will be pretty much blind for several seconds.
.
Go onto pretty much any 4wd forum and you will find people wanting headlight upgrades and brighter low beams ..... which they pretty much can't have legally.
.
Reflector blindness
Seems in recent years ( I don't remember it being such a problem in the 80's and 90s) the road authorities have been fitting and using more a brighter reflective signs and road markings.
Very bright lighting hits these signs and markings making the driver pretty much blind or dramatically compromising the vision ..... the brighter the lights the worse the problem.
.
I have recently switched 2 of my vehicles over to LED driving lights and done some experiments doing it.
Bear in mind I drive what would be considered country roads that require driving lights 2 or 3 nights a week.
.
My tests indicate any more than about 70 to 80 watts of LED lighting is excessive and unhelpful.
.
Another problem is that with my fairly modest 80 watts of LED driving light, I no longer see the on-coming lights coming over crests or around corners anywhere near as well as I did with 200 watts of halogen in 10 inch reflectors.
.
the desire for rediculously bright lights is nothing new, what is new is the ease of achieving truly rediculous and unhelpful brightness.
.
I know a lot of people don't want to hear it ...... but no matter how much light you throw at it you will never achieve night time vision even close to daylight.
.
People need to train their vision, improve their looking and moderate their driving instead of looking to more and brighter light as the solution.

cheers
AnswerID: 604069

Follow Up By: Gronk - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 13:40

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 13:40
In the past ( not currently) headlights and driving lights of road vehicles where restricted by a specification that said they have to be above a certain height and below another height ( from memory between 600 and 900mm off the road).
That no longer applies to driving lights.


Depends on which state you're in ? Same as roof mounted lights.....allowed in some states and not others ! Light bars allowed above the bullbar in some states and not others !!
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Follow Up By: Michaeljp - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 13:57

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 13:57
The problem here is not everyone's eyes see well at night. Not enough light will fatigue you quicker than a lot of light. So some need more lights than others. I have 2x 35w HID spread beam spot ties on my 4WD. They are only just adequate for the purpose. Now that the ADR rules have changed last year I'm going to put a LED light bar on top of the bull bar to light up the down the road and angle the spotties to the sides of the road where most of the animals come from.
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Follow Up By: TomH - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 16:00

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 16:00
Just be aware there is still an ADR rule regarding vision from the drivers seat and basically it prevents any intrusion above the bonnet line. Saw a 100 ser Cruiser an hour ago with one on top of the factory bullbar and it was above the bonnet which in QLD I believe is still illegal.
From WA rules
Driver’s view is not to be obscured by the fitment of driving
lamps.
When sitting in the driver’s seat with the seat located at its rearmost position, it shall be
possible to see either the surface of the road, 11 metres in front of the driver’s eye or the front
edge of the original body when looking across the top of the driving lamps
From Queensland
The placement of driving lamps and associated
brackets must not increase the risk of injury to pedestrians. Driving lamps must not be fitted to
the top of a bull bar above the forward bonnet
line, or protruding forward of the bumper bar or bull bar in a way which would adversely change
the profile of the impact zone.
From NSW
the lamps must not obstruct the driver’s view of the road.


Also be aware that lights of 4300K to 5000K actually produce more light than ones of 6000k So bluer and whiter is not better.
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Follow Up By: oetkb - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 17:08

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 17:08
Im just gunna leave this here.
http://chambers.vic.edu.au/24-weird-rules-australia/
You will love 18.
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Follow Up By: Member - Trouper (NSW) - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 18:46

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 18:46
Those who have the ability to defect vehicles with the incorrect lighting including cars that have retro fitted HID etc dont give a 'toss', and as a result it will just go on and on
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 19:47

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 19:47
oetkb - The site you linked to is typical of the useless, incorrect trash that fills the internet.
About 18 of the 24 statements about "weird" Australian laws, are completely wrong.
A large proportion of those laws (where there actually was a law) have been repealed - and the rest are merely hearsay and "urban legend".

Here's the rebuttal just to No. 9 ... the law is the complete OPPOSITE of what is stated on that site - you MUST NOT state that "No questions will be asked" in advertising rewards for the return of stolen items.

Crimes Act 1958 - Section 89

As regards needing an electrician to change a light globe - wrong again.

"Life" jail sentences can, and often do, exceed 25 years.

Walking on the RHS of the road, is NOT illegal - it is MANDATORY, where there is no footpath. Walkers on roads must face the oncoming traffic.

I could go on - but this link to a news site puts you straight, on all the rubbishy website BS, and straight-out lies.

Urban legend? - or legislation?

Find a useful, accurate website to link to, next time, please!

Cheers, Ron.
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Follow Up By: oetkb - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 20:48

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 20:48
Feel better now Ron? Feel like you've told the world you're right and someone else is wrong?
Now is probably the time to open up that old box that you stuffed way up the back of the shed in 2003, take it inside and open it, hopefully it hasn't died but in fact you're sense of humour is alive, now pull it out, dust it off and give it a good hold. perhaps even find a way of reattaching it.
All I said was that I would leave it here so others could have a look.
I never said it was or wasn't a law.
I lurk here quite often and have done so for many years but you may notice I very rarely post anything and that is because most responses end up in this legalistic rubbish that you felt the need to post.
Yes it's the law, I understand that, but we all understand the law isnt always too logical and its sometimes good to have a bit of a laugh about it all.
Anyway cheers to you to Ron and I hope you don't fall over in the back of the shed.
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Follow Up By: Gronk - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 21:28

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 21:28
oetkb........ha ha, I like it !! lol


I'm waiting............for the reply !!
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 21:33

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 21:33
Ron - you really do need to take a Bex and have a good lie down.
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Follow Up By: Michaeljp - Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 21:48

Saturday, Sep 03, 2016 at 21:48
I found this bit of info, TomH, i cant see here, but i do remember some time ago the bit you mentioned about "not being above the bonet height" maybe something has changed, maybe not. This issue in NSW at least is so ambiguous that its getting ridiculous. https://www.legislation.gov.au/Details/F2009C00579
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Follow Up By: Member - Bigfish - Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 07:36

Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 07:36
Highway cops have been booking people travelling on the Bruce Hwy (Qld) for leaving the tow tongue in the vehicle. They are also booking people for having light bars or fishing rod holders(empty) on the toip of bull bars. These extras alter the top characteristics of the bar...ie...Imagine a child getting hit in a suburban street and the angled fishing rod holder hits them. Lightbar may also do a lot more injury due to sharp edges and glass/perspex screen. The fishing rod holders are ok on the top IF they are at the rear of the bar and not at front( weird, but thats the law. Wont be too long and steel/alloy bars will be outlawed anyway. ALL driving lights must be below the top rail of bullbar.

cheers
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Follow Up By: Alloy c/t - Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 18:02

Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 18:02
Now now now , tis damn fine that the Forums old bush lawyer [Ron N] spends all his time researching all the rules and laws [some outdated and repealed] so he can give us all good laugh and a perspective of how sad it must be to be a true know it all "grumpy old man " , not just one who bought the 'Teeshirt' ….
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 21:05

Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 21:05
All I can say is, thank the Good Lord oetkb rarely posts anything - because the only time he does post a link to anything, it's puerile clickbait crap.

I wonder if he ever thought of posting something useful and very informative?

Nah, couldn't do that - too much work for those few remaining, working, brain cells.

Far better to just link to some crap website that just wastes everyones time, and then spend the rest of his time, being a troll.
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Follow Up By: oetkb - Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 21:41

Sunday, Sep 04, 2016 at 21:41
Hahah Ron me old mate, It appears you just couldn't find that dusty old box up the back of the shed could you?. I must congratulate you though because I assume you've spent the last 30 hrs since I posted looking for it and not sitting behind your keyboard trying to come up with that pathetically lame attempt at a comeback. I also hope that it only took you 10, maybe 15 minutes to come up with that because I come up with much better than that with my "few remaining brain cells" in half that time.
Or perhaps you spent that 30 hrs looking for your "grumpy old man" tee shirt that someone stated they believe you owned, having a nice hot cup of Bex and a lay down?
Who knows what you do with your time and to be honest who really cares.
It seems you have your own reputation here Ron and It's certainly not one that I would like to be the owner of. Yes I know I'm now The "click bait guy" apparently in your little world and I'm happy with that, Id rather be known as a joker than a grumpy old irrelevant man who's best years are behind him and needs to prove to the internet world how mighty and powerful he is by correcting peoples jokes.
Now Ron I'm happy to continue this discussion with you but you just need to move a bit quicker with your reply's.
Or we can put this down now, walk away and let this thread die a natural death, choice is yours old mate.
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Follow Up By: axle - Friday, Sep 09, 2016 at 16:57

Friday, Sep 09, 2016 at 16:57
Wow!!, I thought the good old days on this forum where gone!



Looks like there back!


Hahahahahaha!.
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Follow Up By: Member - Bigfish - Friday, Sep 09, 2016 at 17:25

Friday, Sep 09, 2016 at 17:25
Thought I was reading the Friday Funnies....
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