Forward motion camera

Submitted: Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 16:48
ThreadID: 134046 Views:3096 Replies:12 FollowUps:20
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Does anyone have a definitive answer to this question.

"Is it legal to have a "forward motion" function on your reversing camera". Perhaps there are different laws in different states.

Can't seem to find anything on the net which gives a clear answer.

There is discussion about it being illegal to have a tv screen in the vehicle cabin, however, comments are made that a SatNav would be deemed to be a TV screen?

I'm confused.
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Reply By: bobsabobsa - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 16:59

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 16:59
Latest Toyota Sahara has forward and side cameras standard using the in dash gps screen ,very handy when on rutted tracks , so I guess it must be OK
bob
AnswerID: 607220

Follow Up By: TomH - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:32

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:32
So does the top model Prado. Saw one with at least 4 cameras on the outside
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Reply By: Bobjl - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:24

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:24
I have seen vehicles with built in TV/Video screens in the cabin - rear seats for kids to watch and doubt that would be of any concern to anyone. I have a Dash Camera [accident/event] recording camera in my vehicle which is a forward looking screen. Such technology is becoming almost "must have" for many motorists. The very fact that Dash Cams are sold by the thousands in Australia every year, I wonder why there would be a problem with an automated Dash Cam system and it's screen. Whilst anything that distracts a driver from watching the road and surrounds ought be eliminated where reasonable to do so. In the case of GPS - many systems prevent you from making changes when mobile and that makes good sense to me. I understand that Motorcyclists are not allowed to mount a Go Pro or similar Camera on their helmets nowadays, I dont understand the reasons though.
Have you seen anything that suggests it is illegal to have a forward looking screen in a Vehicle?
Bob.
AnswerID: 607223

Follow Up By: TomH - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:30

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:30
Every vehicle has a large forward looking screen Mostly called windscreens. Why would you want a tiny little camera screen. As far as I am aware the dashcam screens are supposed to be turned off and are uneccessary anyway.. Havent seen anywhere that prevents Gopro or action cams banned from being mounted anywhere.
My post is a link to the regs on screens
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Follow Up By: Bunny - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:32

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:32
I found this comment, which I was trying to clarify:

Doesn't the law state that "no screen" tv, gps, etc. should be visible to distract the driver when a vehicle is in forward motion, or "words to that effect".

Now I'm unsure which law they would be referring to.

For the life of me I can't understand the thinking that using a reversing camera in forward motion would be a distraction. It is simply replacing the rear vision one would normally have, when driving a vehicle with no caravan, i.e. an aid to seeing what is behind you while towing.

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Follow Up By: Bunny - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:35

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:35
My question may have been misleading.

We are installing a reversing camera on the caravan, and want to also use it in "forward motion" so we can see what is behind us while travelling.

Hope that clarifies it a bit more.
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Follow Up By: TomH - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:45

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 18:45
Makes a difference when you say what you really mean clearly
You want your REARVIEW camera on when travelling.
Yes you can but as I said it doesnt remove the need for wide towing mirrors.
Also the cameras arent really as good as they are cracked up to be. They give a false idea of distance for one thing and I found with correctly set mirrors and the occasional wave of the tail I could see behind quite well. They are OK for tailgaters and thats about all.
You will need to adapt the power to have it on all the time I built a little circuit to do that with a couple of wires two diodes and a switch.
If doing it again I would spend the big bucks and buy a pair of the Clearview mirrors

The rules on screens in vehicles are here

http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/sa/consol_reg/arr210/s299.html
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FollowupID: 876937

Follow Up By: Kazza055 - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 19:02

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 19:02
Rear view camera screens and GPS are considered as driving aids and are allowed.

Watching a DVD play while driving is considered a distraction, much like texting on the phone.
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Follow Up By: Bunny - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 19:04

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 19:04
Apologies....I did ask "Is it legal to have a "forward motion" function on your reversing camera", but I wasn't clear enough.

Appreciate your link....will read with interest.

We do have the wide mirrors, but often, on straight stretches, have no idea what/who is behind us.

We are having a professional install the cameras for us, so I'm expecting him to know how to do it correctly.



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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 20:27

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 20:27
We have a Maxima with a TV in the dash. It goes into a "audio only" mode as soon as you select a forward gear. It was illegal to have the TV or DV or any video running when we got it in 2000. Now? Don't know. But I would not assume it is legal for our car if a later model car appeared with such a function in it.

Interesting point: The old camera had a drop down screen that was visible at all times when turned on. About a 50mm screen so not "in your face".

Phil

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Follow Up By: TomH - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 21:20

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 21:20
My Passat plays DVD's and is supposed not to be able to play them when moving. However it does. Have only done it once to prove it did. Have used it to play the audio on a concert DVD by changing the screen to map.

IT IS illegal to have a DVD or TV running anywhere that the driver can see it. Read the rules in the link I provided. It is also illegal to have a dashcam screen visible to the driver. Why you would when you are already looking at what it is recording I wouldnt know but some do Was your Maxima an Aus or Jap model.
Japanese TV and radio is different to Aus and needs adapters to make it work properly
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FollowupID: 876943

Follow Up By: vk1dx - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 22:38

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 22:38
Hi Tom
FYI the "old camera" has gone and replaced with one that does not have a screen and is way up right behind the mirror. Besides I can't stand crap on the windscreen or anywhere in my field of view. No navigation or mobile phone mounts etc etc etc.

Japanese or Aus beats me. Who cares. The fact is that you can't watch any video while in gear. You can tune to a TV station or play a DVD but all you get is the audio.

Catchya

Phil
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FollowupID: 876947

Follow Up By: Keir & Marg - Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:17

Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:17
We have a rearview camera (bluetooth) mounted on a roofrack at the back of the camper-trailer. The bluetooth wouldn't work when the camera was mounted on the back, but up high on the roofrack it works perfectly, and is a great aid when travelling. I take the power for it off the lighting circuit of the van as I usually travel with at least the sidelights on, but turning off the lights altogether then turns the camera off. No need for any additional switches, diodes or anything else.
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FollowupID: 876969

Follow Up By: Keir & Marg - Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:20

Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:20
Re motorbike helmets:- By law, you are not allowed to make any modification whatsoever to a motorbike helmet except for changing AS visors. No paint, no stickers, no attachments. In fact, if you remove the AS sticker from the helmet, it is then deemed not to be legal.
The Gopro/dashcam mounting is a no brainer, as Schumacher found out with his skiing helmet.
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Reply By: TomH - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 19:06

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 19:06
I rarely used the van one and as I also had one on the rear of the Cruiser I used that one to monitor the towbar and the hitch when travelling. Was also good for reversing onto the van when hooking up. Also had a switch on which camera feed I could use to the 4" screen I had on the dash,
AnswerID: 607225

Reply By: Billion Star Camper - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 20:07

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 20:07
O I understand what you want now. I have a switch on mine so that I can turn it on any time. Handy for checking a load on a trailer etc. Don't see a problem as long as you only use it when safe to do so. Usually mine is a bit too bright for use of more than a few seconds at night.
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AnswerID: 607227

Reply By: Athol W1 - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 21:28

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 21:28
Bunny
It is against the law to have ANY VDU (Visual Display Unit) screen within sight of the driver of the vehicle UNLESS such VDU is a Drivers Aid.
As GPS units are a drivers aid, then they are allowed provided that the fitment of such does not encroach on the driver normal view of the road and surrounds. This also applies for some vehicles fitted with electronic, or Cathode Ray or LED, type instrument panels, and in Queensland at least has been ruled as applying to such things as the dispatch systems used in Taxis.
As mobile phones are not generally associated with GPS or advising the driver of vehicle functions then the screen on such constitutes an illegal VDU if it can be seen by the driver.
In answer to your specific question if you can argue that it is a 'drivers aid' then the answer would be yes, however I do not like your chances of winning that argument unless it was only operational for parking type assistance.
Hope this helps.
Athol


Just read the entire thread. It is not against the law to use a camera system to see what is following your van so long as you also have the required external mirrors that are capable of showing both rear corners of the van at the same time. I have such a camera system installed and such a system can only be described as , and meets every definition of, a Drivers Aid.

Enjoy your travels
AnswerID: 607231

Follow Up By: TomH - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 22:34

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 22:34
It is legal to use a mobile phone for handsfree use provided it is in a cradle attached to the vehicle.
One use is Google maps on a smartphone and the rules I posted allow for that. The full rules are there in black and white
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Follow Up By: Athol W1 - Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 09:10

Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 09:10
Tom H
I stand by my statement "As mobile phones are not generally associated with GPS or advising the driver of vehicle functions then the screen on such constitutes an illegal VDU if it can be seen by the driver." and my reason is exactly what you have argued in the attachment to your previous post of The Australian Road Rules section 2 (bb) and I quote;

2 (bb) the visual display unit is part of a mobile phone that is being used as a driver's aid as permitted by rule 300(1)(ab)

This only allows for the screen (or VDU) to be visible to the driver when such unit is being used as a Drivers Aid (ie GPS function), and does not include the normal phone type screen. Once the phone receives an outside call then it is OK to answer that call provided the phone is being used in a hands free function, that is the driver does NOT handle the phone in any way. The phone does not necessarily have to be in a dedicated cradle but it must not be subject to any physical driver contact.

Regards
Athol
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FollowupID: 876954

Follow Up By: TomH - Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 11:45

Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 11:45
http://www.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/sinodisp/au/legis/sa/consol_reg/arr210/s300.html?stem=0&synonyms=0&query=300

For full description
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FollowupID: 876955

Reply By: Member - Dave63 - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 21:29

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 21:29
Hi,
I have a switch on the dash that has ignition power that goes to the trigger wire of the reversing camera so I can check it anytime I like. Reverse cameras are normally wired to pick up power from your reversing light.
I have also wired a switch up that allows me to go between the camera on the car and the camera on the caravan which is all linked to the stereo screen.
Where it is very handy is that when hitching up and if you move forward a little you dont have the picture drop out because you selected first gear and then wait for it to come back on when you pick up reverse again and have to wait for the camera to come back on.

Dave
AnswerID: 607232

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie - Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 17:12

Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 17:12
Dave, I'm with you.

My Chevy Silverado was already fitted with a rear view camera, mounted directly above the towball and pointing straight back (as do 99% of all such cameras). It is connected to the VMS in-dash, all-in-one unit and only comes on when I'm in reverse.

Then, 12 months later in January 2016, we bought a 2013 model Bushtracker which came with a camera on the back but I couldn't be bothered trying to work out if I could somehow wire it into the VMS.

So, instead of that, I bought a 7" monitor of ebay. It has 2 separate channels, so I decided to get a bit "fancy".

I've fitted another camera to the back of the Chevy....this one is mounted on the driver's side, under the tail light cluster, and faces towards the tow hitch. Now, I can see both directions of alignment when I back up to the caravan...IE: normal alignment in the VMS screen AND also see where I am as far as how much further I need to reverse to get the van in EXACTLY the right spot to drop it onto the Hitch Ezy.

The other channel is for the caravan camera.

This new 7" screen can be switched on/off manually, so I can see what's going on in either camera at the push of a button.
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FollowupID: 876960

Follow Up By: Kazza055 - Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 17:34

Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 17:34
Sound similar to my rig, have a camera mounted in the handle of the tailgate and is connected to the head unit.
Installed a second camera on the numberplate plus one on the back of the van. The monitor sits over the internal mirror, this is the natural place to look.
I have also blanked out all the windows on the canopy so there is nothing to see in the internal mirror.

One problem with trying to use the head unit, you then loose the music/GPS functions so much better having a separate screen.
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FollowupID: 876961

Reply By: Jackolux - Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 22:39

Wednesday, Jan 04, 2017 at 22:39
I don't know why anyone bothers to wire a camera to only come on in reverse , my cameras can be on anytime I want ,
AnswerID: 607235

Reply By: 9900Eagle - Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 05:59

Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 05:59
This is the type of thing authorities don't want. Any screen in front of the driver that is used for entertainment or television station transmissions.

Her is an example of what they don't want, it is just a tad in the extreme though.

Retard behind the wheel
AnswerID: 607237

Reply By: Motherhen - Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 23:30

Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 23:30
Bunny, posters have mentioned using a Rear View camera - a wonderful aid to seeing what is approaching in the distance and travelling behind you, quite legal, and as said you still require towing width mirrors. It is of some benefit when reversing - you will see the tree or close obstacle behind you.

A Reversing Camera has a much closer focus, and is usually pointed more towards the ground at the rear, to aid in reversing. The focus is not suitable for seeing traffic in the distance. Traffic will only come visibility when they are about to overtake you.

Finding somewhere suitable for the monitor on an already full dash can be an issue. One that substitutes for the rear vision mirror is one option, and after all what you would be using to see behind you if not towing a caravan.
Motherhen

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AnswerID: 607253

Follow Up By: TomH - Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:28

Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:28
Before you buy a rearview mirror screen try it out. I tried every screen available at the time and the rear view mirror one was pretty hopeless. It is after all a mirror still and I found the video part was not bright enough to overcome the mirror images.

Even tried a matt overlay and it was still no good. I binned it and bought a Polaris system that allowed 2 cameras with a 4in screen..
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FollowupID: 876972

Follow Up By: Kazza055 - Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 09:21

Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 09:21
Have to agree with TomH, the mirror screens are useless. I ended up buying another 7" monitor and hacked the mirror screen apart using the clamping arrangement and adding it to the rear of the replacement.

Now the 7" screen just clamps over the existing mirror ;=))
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FollowupID: 876975

Reply By: Member - Charlie M (SA) - Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 23:40

Thursday, Jan 05, 2017 at 23:40
Drove a school bus that had cameras that monitored the driver and passengers. Showed 2 pictures on the one screen.
Had to drive with the screen turned off as was classed as driving with a DVD going and would be classed as inattentive driving in the event of a accident.
It did not really matter as it was saved to hard disc anyway.
Cheers
Charlie
AnswerID: 607254

Reply By: Malcom M - Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 07:17

Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 07:17
Something else to consider.
You can be nailed when playing a DVD only to the kids rear seat monitors.
Those monitors are visible to other vehicles around you and technically you are responsible. That from a cop.
Makes you wonder how they get away with flashing road signs etc.
AnswerID: 607261

Follow Up By: TomH - Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:24

Friday, Jan 06, 2017 at 08:24
Cop is wrong Nothing in the rules about that and the viewing angle is hardly wide enough for drivers in another lane to see the screen anyway.
Other drivers should be looking where they are going anyway.
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FollowupID: 876971

Reply By: The Bantam - Monday, Jan 09, 2017 at 00:14

Monday, Jan 09, 2017 at 00:14
It is perfectly legal to have a rear vision camera and screen operating all the time ..... mine does.

The ADRs and the state legeslations provide for this because, many of the Supercars have no internal rearvision appart from the video screen.

Cheers
AnswerID: 607377

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