Wear particles in rear diff oil

Submitted: Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 17:48

ThreadID: 134401 Views:3670 Replies:12 FollowUps:3

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Keith B2

I have posted this on LCOOL so I apologise if your read it before. But this forum seems to have all the wise old heads and I do value the advice.

I put my 2008 200 series in today with my regular mechanic for a 190,00km service and asked him to change the brake fluid plus diff and transfer case oils. I bought it second hand at 136,00 km and wasn't sure if this work had ever been done. ARB air lockers are fitted front and rear.

Anyhow when I picked it up he pointed out some wear particles that came from the rear diff oil. Most were very small. But there was one about 10mm long x 3mm x 1mm. Neither of us had any idea whether it had come from a gear tooth or a bearing cage or somewhere else. The diff has no noise coming out of it nor any excessive backlash.

Maybe the wear stuff came from a previous owner (the army) misusing the diff lock? I am looking at two options:
1. Get ARB to tear it down, inspect and repair and live with the bill.
2. Run for 20,000 km then have the oil tested for wear metals.

If the diff is trouble free for the next 20,000 kim Option Two will have been a good idea. If it destroys itself, it won't have been a good idea at all.

So I'd appreciate any advice.

Keith

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Reply By: Gronk - Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 17:57

Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 17:57

Unfortunately it's something to worry about, but I'd be inclined to wait and watch.
Have you fully tested the diff lock ?
Was most of the particles on the plug ?
Depending on the "expertise" of the ARB blokes, it may not cost a lot more to rebuild the diff IF it does crap itself !

AnswerID: 609098

Follow Up By: Keith B2 - Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 19:58

Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 19:58

It was all on the plug. Have not tested the locker.

FollowupID: 878866

Reply By: RMD - Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 18:44

Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 18:44

If it is running ok and you decide not to look inside, I would add around half a tube of Nulon G90 to the diff oil, it will assist with making it run for longer. The PTFE will cushion and lube/slip quite well.
No good in a LSD though, ARB locker OK.

AnswerID: 609099

Reply By: mick78 - Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 22:07

Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 22:07

Hello,

If it's not noisey and the locker works ok. I would run it for a couple thousand and drop the oil and check again on the plug and the condition of the oil.

A drain and refil is cheap!

AnswerID: 609102

Reply By: Member - Bongo (NT) - Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 23:18

Thursday, Mar 02, 2017 at 23:18

Diff oil change

This was the metalic soup found in my 2014 Troopy rear diff at the 40000 oil change. No noise. My mechanic said to go to Toyota as a potential warrantee issue. Toyota said all was good!!

AnswerID: 609104

Reply By: Malcom M - Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 07:16

Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 07:16

Bit of a 'no brainer' to me.
Chunks of metal in a gear assembly means strip it down quick before you do more damage.
10mm long x 3mm x 1mm sounds like its snapped off the side of a gear tooth.
Also look at fitting magnetic drain plugs. You really don't want chunks of metal that size floating around.

The crown gear in a 100 series is north of $900, can't remember the pinion price. If they are not stuffed yet then you don't want to be the cause of them becoming stuffed.
Not worth dicking around. You have an expensive truck so look after it.

AnswerID: 609105

Reply By: Athol W1 - Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 08:37

Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 08:37

Keith
It is nothing unusual to find fine metal particles, almost like a slurry, on the magnetic diff (or manual transmission) drain plugs. It is the finding of something that is sizeable that can be of some concern.

It is my opinion that the piece of metal that was found has come from some part of the locking arrangement. If it was from a bearing you would be getting noises already, and also if it was from the Crown and Pinion set you would be getting some regular pulse type noise.

In the absence of any noises I would be running it for a mid service type term of about 20k and drain the oil again to see if there are any further sizeable metal particles, and work from there. However I would not hesitate to delve further into it should any unusual noises develop.

Hope this helps.
Regards
Athol (Retired motor mechanic)

AnswerID: 609107

Follow Up By: Malcom M - Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:41

Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:41

You are forgetting there appears to be a magnetic plug that would hold the big chunk in place.

FollowupID: 878893

Reply By: Member - Odog - Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 08:41

Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 08:41

G'day Keith
My son in Perth, just got front n rear arb air lockers fitted to his 76. He was instructed to do a 1000km and return it to have the oil changed, as the wear in can leave a few particles in the housing.. maybe this is all it is? And the early oil change was never done? Don't know if possible to get a camera in there to have a bit of a squiz.. hope it works out for you, guess it would always be in the back of your mind though, especially if doing a big trip away.. another thing also, don't know if supposed to use specific oil to suit lockers, think lsd need to use oil to suit.. cheers Odog

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AnswerID: 609108

Follow Up By: Malcom M - Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:42

Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:42

"But there was one about 10mm long x 3mm x 1mm."
Pretty radical wear that.

FollowupID: 878894

Reply By: Gundarooster - Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:22

Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:22

Keith,

I would get it drained, opened and inspected by a diff specialist ASAP given that one of the particles was quite large. I wouldn't go anywhere near ARB as their advice will be to replace it. It's worth getting it fixed before it totally fails and takes out otherwise good parts.
Gazza.

AnswerID: 609112

Reply By: Hoyks - Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:34

Friday, Mar 03, 2017 at 10:34

I'd just refill and drive it. I dropped the oil out of my old Nissan and found a similar chunk of metal to what you described, 20mm x 5mm x .1mm. It looked to me like the face of a gear tooth, but as thin as shim stock.

It was making no noises and I didn't have the time or money to strip it then and there, so I refilled it and kept driving.

I sold the wagon with 320000km on the clock and I'm told it ticked over 450000 (I know the owner) and the diff is still fine.

AnswerID: 609113

Reply By: Member - Trouper (NSW) - Saturday, Mar 04, 2017 at 14:25

Saturday, Mar 04, 2017 at 14:25

Keith, I wouldn't go anywhere near ARB as they are not specialists in these matters. If you are so inclined I'd take it to a Gear and Diff specialist. They whip it out in no time or they could give you some specialist advise. Or leave it and see if things 'develope'.

Jeff

AnswerID: 609135

Reply By: The Bantam - Sunday, Mar 05, 2017 at 11:44

Sunday, Mar 05, 2017 at 11:44

Lets be realistic ....... some people are sloppy when they work ..... how many people do you know that would wipe a diff housing clean, before they put it back together.

How little do you recon it would take to pick up a piece of trash off the less than sergically clean bench when putting a diff centre back in the housing ..... that is if it wasn't put on the floor.

If the diff is working perfectly and not making any noises, I would fill her up and see how it went ..... check for particles after a few thou .......you could be spending a lot of money for nuthing.

Worst ...... pull the diff and give it a visual inspection ...... but if you are paying someone to do this ..... that will cost you a few hundred on its own.

cheers

AnswerID: 609168