Plane and Bus Bogged on Fraser Island

Submitted: Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 09:49
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Bad enough to get your own 4x4 into a bit of soft sand but ...........

"Well boss, it was like this......"

ABC News report here.

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Allan

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Reply By: Les - PK Ranger - Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 11:16

Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 11:16
Yeah poor driver, successfully helped get the plane out, but lost a bus probably worth nearly as much.

As the news article said, very lucky it was relatively calm overnight, the often rough seas there could have easily made the bus sink like in quicksand, and most likely tip like most 4WDs do when they are lost.

It will possibly be a write off, insurance will usually scrap them as salt water will eventually cause an submerged electrics to fail, the body could be flushed / rinsed, but of course could be affected long term in fairly boxed off areas.

I wonder if the plane owner feels some form of compensation is ethical since his plane was saved.
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Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 11:27

Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 11:27
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Dunno Les, the report said....... "the bus tried to tow it out, without any luck. The plane managed to get out, but the bus became stuck."

It says the bus failed but the plane got out..... probably under its own efforts.
The bus driver may have been eager but not capable.

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Allan

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Follow Up By: Les - PK Ranger - Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 11:41

Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 11:41
True, very often planes can create enough airflow over the wings to get lift, maybe enough to get it out.
STOL planes are a joy to watch land / take off.

Still the bus got into trouble, and although the company is likely insured, and probably get some decent publicity as well, it will likley still be a hit to the pocket in some ways.

Fraser beaches are so unpredictable, won't be the last vehicle lost over there.
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Reply By: Ron N - Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 22:10

Thursday, Jul 26, 2018 at 22:10
From what I recall of driving around Fraser Island, caution is the order of the day as the whole island has regular, treacherous soft spots - let alone driving down to the waters edge, towards a bogged plane.
The fact the plane was bogged should have been enough warning.

But the simple fact remains, people get caught like this every few days. A little lowering of the caution level and you're in up to the makers name, and the suction in wet beach sand is enormous.

The bus will most certainly be a write-off. The Damaged Vehicle Assessment Criteria for Statutory Written-Off Vehicles, has the following to say about vehicle immersion;

"Where the internal cabin of a vehicle is inundated with any water (fresh, salt and/or brackish water) such that the internal cabin water level rises above the level of the inner door sill for any period, the vehicle is to be classified as a SWO."

I hate to think what the bus companies insurance premium renewal will be, next time around.
My insurance broker told me one time, the start point for the negotiation of renewal premiums, is the total insurance payout figure for the company, for the previous insured year.

Cheers, Ron.
AnswerID: 620351

Reply By: Candace S. - Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 00:07

Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 00:07
For years now, I've been seeing these bits about vehicles in trouble on Oz beaches. I guess I'm not sure why they are driving (or landing?!) on them in the first place? Especially given the unpredictable sand conditions.

If you're driving, and want to visit the water's edge, why not just park on safer ground and walk the short distance? What am I missing here? Maybe driving on beaches is a magical experience I'm missing out on, LOL.
AnswerID: 620371

Follow Up By: Michael H9 - Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 04:52

Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 04:52
The beach is the main road on Fraser. The inland tracks are slow, narrow and bumpy. Cruising along the beach at Fraser on a nice day is very nice indeed.
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Follow Up By: Les - PK Ranger - Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 06:54

Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 06:54
Generally you can drive them fairly safely, washouts and shelves are probably the main natural risk that people "run into" on Frasers eastern beach.
Especially so when the weather is windy.

Also a lot of people don't pay attention to tides and creek crossing depths, and after spending some considerable $ getting there, ferry over, bookings etc, take a risk instead of waiting.

Planes regularly land on Fraser, this one might have hit a quicksand patch, they are supposed to be reasonably common there (wet patch people don't see before hitting it).
I've not ever met one of these, but am always wary and stay as reasonably high as I can on most beaches in QLD, NSW, SA, so far.
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Follow Up By: Banjo (WA) - Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 07:48

Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 07:48
The reason people drive on the sand closer to the water is that the wet sand is firmer.

The hard packed sand is easier to drive on and gives less stress to the vehicle compared to the soft sand higher up.

Anther reason for staying low is that birds (Plovers) sometimes have their nest in the soft stuff.

Is beach driving is magical? Yes.

Paul
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Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 07:56

Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 07:56
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Yes Candace, driving along Fraser Beach can be a "magical experience".
When we visit, Roz takes the wheel, winds down the window and heads up the beach with the wind blowing her hair.... Wheeeeee!
I only get the wheel when it's hard going.

But, as said, there are precautions to be taken. The sand is most firm where it is still moist, but not wet. Close to the water has risks, obviously. Sightseeing planes operate using the beach as a landing strip. They need a smooth firm surface but this one must have misjudged. It is the first I have known to get bogged.

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Allan

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Follow Up By: Member - McLaren3030 - Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 10:31

Saturday, Jul 28, 2018 at 10:31
Hi Candace, no offence, but it is obvious you have never been to Fraser Island. The only way to travel up the east coast of Fraser Island is on the beach. There are no roads that run the length of Fraser Island from South to North & vice versa. Most of the internal tracks on Fraser Island cross from east to west, or wind between certain locations. The eastern beach as well as being a gazetted highway, is also the gazetted landing strip.

Macca.
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Follow Up By: Candace S. - Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 10:33

Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 10:33
Indeed, I haven't been there! As far as I know, none of the companies that hire 4WD's allow their vehicles on Fraser Island. :)
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Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 10:46

Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 10:46
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Yes Candace, there are 4WD hire companies dedicated to Fraser Island.
Here is just one, and there are others. Google "Fraser Island 4WD hire".

Mind you, it ain't cheap!

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Allan

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Follow Up By: Les - PK Ranger - Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 10:50

Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 10:50
I think there are a few specialised companies that hire for Fraser, and certainly many years ago I hired a troopy at Kingfisher Bay, after a trip over from Urangan on private boat, we swam / waded ashore :)

Had a great days driving covering a lot of the highlights, but have always wanted to go back for a good 4 - 5 days, mid week, and avoid the SE QLD weekend idiots.
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Follow Up By: Michael H9 - Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 18:04

Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 18:04
It's not what it was. Today it's over populated by tourists, over regulated and over commercialized. It has to be that way now unfortunately. Another 20 years will probably see a tar road up the middle and driving on the beach banned.
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Follow Up By: rumpig - Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 19:11

Monday, Jul 30, 2018 at 19:11
Whilst it's certainly busier now then 20 years ago, if you visit in Winter the place is practically a ghost town. We were there last year during the July school holiday period, I was amazed how dead the place was, can only imagine how it would have been when what few people were there went back to work and thier kid's to school the following week. Have heard from people that were there this year for the same period, they reckon it was pretty quiet again also. Got to say i preferred it back in the day when we could have fires at our camps on the beach, sadly though the idiots wrecked that... the last several years fires were allowed, every time we were there a scrub fire was burning on the island somewhere. The island was looking old though on our last visit, it looked like no infrastructure maintenance had been done in a pretty long time.
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Follow Up By: 9900Eagle - Tuesday, Jul 31, 2018 at 05:12

Tuesday, Jul 31, 2018 at 05:12
We were there in early February through the week with traffic being very light. That time of year swimming was really comfortable temperature wise and there was only only a handful of people at Lake Mckenzie.

There are a huge amount of hire vehicles in Rainbow Beach to choose from.

Well worth a visit.


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Follow Up By: Les - PK Ranger - Tuesday, Jul 31, 2018 at 10:16

Tuesday, Jul 31, 2018 at 10:16
Mid week, not schools holidays, avoid the crowds and doof doof culture.
I won't be going back to Teewah, Rainbow, or Inskip for weekenders again, after the last couple of trips done when up there, makes you too disappointed in people.
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Follow Up By: Candace S. - Wednesday, Aug 01, 2018 at 01:34

Wednesday, Aug 01, 2018 at 01:34
To clarify, I meant the companies (e.g. Britz, Apollo) who hire 4WDs on the "mainland" don't allow the vehicles to be taken over.

I prefer vehicles I can sleep inside, so that limits the options available to me. ;)
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 20:57

Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 20:57
You don't hire vehicles on Fraser - you hire them on the mainland and take them over.
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Follow Up By: Allan B (Sunshine Coast) - Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 21:44

Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 21:44
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Aussie Trax 4X4 Rental have an office and vehicle depot on Fraser Island at Kingfisher Bay Resort.

Vehicles can be hired from 1/2 day upwards.

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Reply By: Batt's - Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 09:16

Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 09:16
Something I've never tried on a beach is to recover a vehicle backwards. Turn around where possible tow forwards it's easier to get out if you get bogged most of the time and better for the cut of your diff gears, steering etc same in the bush unless they only require a small amount of weight to help them out.
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Follow Up By: Shaker - Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 09:40

Saturday, Aug 04, 2018 at 09:40
I would have thought that if you have just driven off firm sand into quicksand then it would be better to pull it back on to known good ground than to to pull it further into the bog.
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Sunday, Aug 05, 2018 at 18:38

Sunday, Aug 05, 2018 at 18:38
Diff gears are quite capable of withstanding serious power in reverse. How many gear sets do you hear of being busted, simply by reversing under power whilst bogged? Very, very few.

All automotive diff gears are hypoid (helical spiral bevel), where the pinion shaft is offset, well below the centreline of the axles.
This results in a helical gear tooth which actually slides along its mating tooth on the other gear, to a certain degree.

The hypoid diff gearset has the advantage of being stronger than a regular spiral bevel gear set (where the pinion shaft is in line with the axle centreline) - because the teeth are curved, and therefore provide more inherent strength than a straight tooth, as in a regular spiral bevel gear set.

The hypoid gearset also offers advantages in vehicle design, because it reduces the diff "hump" profile, due to the ability to utilise a smaller diameter bevel (ring) gear.

As far as getting out of bogs (and I've been bogged aplenty), you are nearly always better off going straight out backwards, rather than trying to turn around, and go out forwards.

The reasons being - going out backwards, you're travelling back over tracks you've already made (instead of trying to make new ones).
Going forward usually only means you're going further into more unstable or softer ground - and trying to make new tracks, whilst doing so.

There are a few cases where you keep going forwards - when the ground behind you is softer or more unstable than the ground in front - or when someone else is bogged behind you!

Cheers, Ron.
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Follow Up By: Batt's - Sunday, Aug 05, 2018 at 21:38

Sunday, Aug 05, 2018 at 21:38
Ron I did say Recovering a vehicle in reverse I didn't say reversing yourself out of a bog there's a massive difference. And yes you do drive backwards if you can't proceed forward that's just standard beach driving technic rock n roll within reason till you get out nothing new about that.

I not sure where you got the idea of turning around in a forward direction when bogged if that was aimed at me I didn't say that.

Also something I maybe should have mentioned but some one with your knowledge would already know this that If something should fail in the tow line or towing point should break then it would be safer for the driver to be out of the firing line within reason. I would prefer something hit the rear of my vehicle than come through the front window but that's just my opinion.
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Follow Up By: Shaker - Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 13:17

Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 13:17
Another good reason to pull it out backwards!

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Follow Up By: 9900Eagle - Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 16:17

Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 16:17
Ron, 100 series were notorious for breaking front diff in reverse especially trying o pull someone out in reverse.
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Follow Up By: rumpig - Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 16:58

Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 16:58
They are notorious for breaking front diffs full stop....it's not just a reverse thing, plenty break going forward also, and not necessarily whilst doing anything strenuous on the vehicle.
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 21:10

Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 21:10
I believe that was because some dumb Toyota designers decided to utilise a Hilux-sized diff in the front of the 100 series, though?

Toyota did a lot of dumb things from about 2000 to 2010. One of them was ignoring build quality in favour of total build numbers, so they could beat GM to the crown of the auto manufacturer that produced the largest number of vehicles in the world.

The second thing was not hiring enough engineers - and the third thing was letting a lot of experienced engineers retire early, because they were burnt out.

Then they now brag about how they've brought back all these retired engineers on a part-time basis, to help the new generation of their engineers, learn how to build things properly!


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Follow Up By: rumpig - Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 22:11

Monday, Aug 06, 2018 at 22:11
I was of the belief it has to do with the crush spacer they use (hence why people put solid pinion spacers in), over time it allows excessive movement in the crown wheel and pinion, then bang crunch equals missing teeth. I was driving forwards up a gentle slope when mine went bang...no spinning wheels, no lifting wheels, just a small slope that any 4wd should negotiate with ease.
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Reply By: Peter_n_Margaret - Sunday, Aug 05, 2018 at 20:34

Sunday, Aug 05, 2018 at 20:34
Fabulous Fraser.....

Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome
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