IFS Stir Up.

Submitted: Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 11:38
ThreadID: 14201 Views:1488 Replies:8 FollowUps:12
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Just when we all thought the argument was over! LOL
My 7 year olds birthday yesterday, I was putting together a "hulk" truck that he had got from his best mate. As I was asseblying this truck I noticed it was a hummer. I looked at the packaging and noticed that their was hummer logo's all over the packaging.
I also noticed that it had a double wishbone suspension on the front.
After a quick search this morning on google it has become apparant to me that arguably "The King of 4WD's" has independant front suspension.
So this being the case, why can't people accept that with the correct deisgn of an IFS system, it will be able to compete with any Live axel model.
Not all IFS systems are configured/designed the same are they. Look at the Prado vs the LC100. Totally different. Maybe people need to look at how it performs in real life situations rather than writing it off just because of the three letters "IFS".
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Reply By: Mrs Diamond - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 12:19

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 12:19
your not saying the hummer is a good 4by are you lol
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 14:26

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 14:26
I have it on reasonably good authority that Landies were known as Hummer Recovery Vehicles in Bosnia. Apparently a bit of mud was sufficient for the hulking great beasts to come undone.
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Follow Up By: GO_OFFROAD - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 16:26

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 16:26
Be interesting to put the same weight in the landies and see if the roles reverse ;-)

At least with the hummer elbow pads arent needed to stop them banging on the window when turning the wheel ;-)

Interesting though that 3 major US rock crawling dudes are building IS setups for new buggies, I dont think it will be long before ridgid axles go the way of the horse and cart, where they belonged......
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Follow Up By: Rosco - Bris. - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:09

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:09
Exactly my point. They would better be classed as a LTV, as in limited terrain vehicle.

As for the ubiquitous terminology ... "dudes", I personally have no aspirations to become a bloody yank and find its use somewhat offputting.
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Follow Up By: GO_OFFROAD - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:39

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:39
Oh well rosco dude, Im sure you will build a bridge, and get over it.....
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Follow Up By: Schevchenko - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:41

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:41
Rosco - "As for the ubiquitous terminology ... "dudes", I personally have no aspirations to become a bloody yank and find its use somewhat offputting."
HERE HERE!!
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Reply By: Member - Roachie SA- Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 12:21

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 12:21
Jeff,
I think Hummer also has rear independant suspension. However, they still lift wheels off the ground earlier than rigid axled vehicles.
I agree they are very capable off road trucks; probably better than the ususal jap stuff most of us drive.
Cheers mate
AnswerID: 65491

Reply By: Member - Captain (WA) - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 12:58

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 12:58
Hi Jeff,

You have hit the nail on the head when saying "...the correct design of an IFS system...". IFS in itself is not a problem, its the final design on the individual vehicle. The Hummer has nearly 1m wishbones that mean the CV joint angle change is minimal, even with large wheel travel.

IMHO an IFS system has the potential to be a far better system than a live axle. But by the time it ends up on the average mass produced vehicle, it has been compromised to such a degree that typically the old live axle works better off-road in extreme conditions.

Cheers

Captain
Its not what you drive, but how you drive it!
LC 200 + AOR Quantum

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AnswerID: 65496

Reply By: Member - Peter (York) - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 14:54

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 14:54
Jeff Did you give him back his toy or are You still playing with it ?LOL
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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 16:20

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 16:20
No, of course I gave it to him Peter, what are you getting at?

(Maybe I did spend a little more time playing with it than he did, but hey! What can I say, we all dream...) LOL

FYI I also played in the forts at the fun station too! :-P

... Oh yeah, those magnet things were cool too, and and and, the skateboard... (I put one footd and a small amount of weight on it and it started to make a cracking sound, so I left that one alone!)
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Reply By: Wil - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 15:55

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 15:55
Hi Jeff M & all

Look closely at 2 legendary trucks: Unimog & Hummer. They both have reduction gearbox in the hub hence an offset input drive shaft setup. This enable much better diff ground clearance. On the Unimog, live axle setup whereas the Hummer is IFS but still CV is well up away from harm's way.
Toyo's IFS all have the CV at wheel centre height, which is totally exposed to the element. Hence OK for tip toeing through the country but not ideal for serious bush bashing...No comparison really...

No IFS for me thank you. :)

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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 16:16

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 16:16
Are you in Perth, come out with me and the fellas for a day mate, Tip toe my ass!
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Reply By: Member - Nick K (VIC) - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 20:22

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 20:22
The hummer has indipendant suspention all round . Also you will notice that the axle runs into the top part of the drum with internal gears in each wheel . Also it is desighned so every corner on the vehicle is interchangable EG. left to right / front to back. This was done so spares can be sorced off wrecks in the field . The also run secondry assisted brakes which stop working if you blow a powersteering hose ... So much for Yanki technologi
AnswerID: 65574

Reply By: Richard - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:00

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:00
Its how the driver drives the vehicle not how the vehicle drives the driver.
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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 10:47

Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 10:47
Good on you Peter, it wasn't supposed to be a serious post, but it's not very often you get details of a Hummer first hand!
(I'll just go back to playing with the toy one, it's about as close as I'll ever get!) LOL
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Reply By: Peter 2 - Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:22

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:22
The Humvee/Hummer has independant suspension on all four corners.
Yes the A arms are interchangeable to the diagonally opposite corner (LF to RR and RF to LR). The A arms are also quite long, shocks are inside the coils and there are no bump stops. The halfshafts enter the top of the drop hub so raising the protection level as the CV boots are well up out of the way.
Brakes are inboard on the diff output flanges and they are hydro boosted by the power steering circuit. They do still work without assistance just the same as a normal vacuum boost, you just have to push harder.
As the brakes are before the drop hubs they are effectively twice the diameter due to the 1.92:1 ratio change in the hubs, they can also get very hot so run silicone fluid in the hydraulics.
It does occasionally lift a wheel off road but this is as much a factor of the long 130" wheelbase and wide track as it is the independant suspension. It has little effect on forward progress though due to Ziekel-Torsen centres in both diffs.
FWIW the registered (weighbridge for rego) weight of my Humvee is 2.7t, with 1/2 tank of fuel, all fluids etc, probably less than a lot of fully kitted Tojo's and Patrols. It is also one of the heaviest military variants with armour and a turret (which is still fitted). The main body is aluminium with the doors and bonnet made of kevlar reinforced composite.
Peter
Peter
1996 Oka Motorhome

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Follow Up By: Member - Bradley- Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:57

Monday, Jun 28, 2004 at 21:57
Geez mate you really do have an 'urban assault vehicle'. Better watch out, a current affair / today tonight will be after you....... lololololol
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Follow Up By: Peter 2 - Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 08:36

Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 08:36
Don't get much argument in traffic! Don't usually drive it much around town as it is used for travelling and weekends away mostly.
Treat it just like my Troopies, never leave it parked anywhere except in the scrub when away. Too many light fingered people around.
Peter
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Follow Up By: floyd - Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 19:55

Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 19:55
I Have a family of 5 and a dog. Will a Hummer suit me for my family. I want one for touring. What amount of storage space do they have? Milage too???

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Follow Up By: Peter 2 - Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 21:58

Tuesday, Jun 29, 2004 at 21:58
The Humvee only seats four although if you have a small kid some of the civilian Hummers have a dicky seat suitable for two little kids between the two rear ones but it doesn't have much headroom.
A wagon model has about the same floor space in the back as a troopy in a six seat version but not as high internally.
There is a 7 seater high roof model for sale at www.facom.au.com in the for sale section. It is located in WA.
Peter
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