MQ (2016)Triton towing Jayco Starcraft outback

Submitted: Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 11:16
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Hello every one,
I hope you are all well.

I have been given an opportunity to use my nephews 2016 MQ Triton (GLX) dual cab to evaluate if it will suite my needs towing my 2017 Jayco Starcraft outback van. (17.58-3).

ATM 2470kg, GTM2303kg, empty ball mass 167kg.

I need to fit a brake controller to the vehicle, one question I have is it a straight forward wire up or is there some trick I have to do because of the electrics on this vehicle.

The other question I have, is any one using this vehicle to tow a similar sized van and how does it do?

Thanks in advance,
William
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Reply By: RMD - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 12:29

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 12:29
William
Apart from the normal wiring and trailer plug which the controller will show a circuit diagram of, the hardest part will be to identify the +ve output wire which operates the stop lights. Most brake switches have two sections integrated into one switch with 4 wires, usually. One section is for the ECU to detect things and the other is the stop light section. Make sure you don't connect to the ECU related wires. Best to find out which is which! Tracing wires from the lights to the switch will reveal the brake wire/colour. Someone may know and tell you here. I don't know.
While simply running along a made road is might be ok, many do, if using the OFFroad capability of the van, the shocks on the vehicle probably will not keep up with inertia loads and emergency braking forces etc. New Tritons empty, wag their tail up and down indicating less than desirable shocker control at the best of times. Add a van, load, and rough roads, or even in emergency situations on made roads it may struggle and not be a positive experience for you. Be aware of that.
Only by pushing it in capability will all be revealed, just like it is when the the pear shaped situations arise.
PS. most vehicles require replacing the shock absorbers with items which have more capability than the, standard shocks fitted for smooth road comfort. They are not made or matched for vans as part of the OE suspension setup. Just because it can simply tow the van along a road means very little. After all, you are talking about MORE than the vehicle weight dragging along behind. Most people look at the situation of towing a van as normal, but towing more than a loaded Triton behind you as not normal.
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Follow Up By: Member - William B - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 14:38

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 14:38
Hi RMD,
Thanks for the reply.
We are hoping to get to Lake Mungo early next year which should be a good test to see how it performs and
how well we like it.
William
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Follow Up By: RMD - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 15:46

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 15:46
William
Something I didn't mention earlier is the Triton, rear axle to tow ball distance, is/appears to be a large amount in proportion to other similar vehicles, possibly you haven't considered this. That allows the tail to wag the dog with more leverage being in the design. The dog should always be in charge of the tail. All ok if things don't get out of whack.
If using a van and also leveling devices, the Triton has more chassis bending/fracture forces applied to it by that overhang amount. Just because it drives ok doesn't prevent issues in some circumstances later in it's use.

Although extreme loading with Campers on cab chassis, APOLLO had many many Tritons break their backs. General use ok though. I see some newer tradie ones around me and they appear to have bent chassis. Weight too far aft on overhang. Tray points down on a few. Just my viewpoint, simply stating the way it is.
The Triton has a wheelbase of
Triton 3000mm and more axle to ball than all.
Dmax 3125
Ranger 3220
The Dmax and Ranger have more inherent directional stability, if similar overhang to ball. The Triton has less stability and more overhang. Two factors less capable! This is with equally performing shocks. tyres and springing and drivetrain/power. The Triton will Wallow/Porpoise more than the others too.
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Reply By: OzzieCruiser - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 15:33

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 15:33
I just use one of THESE as I do not want to do a permanent installation.

Works well - just make sure that the plug you take the power from has an appropriate sized fuse as some are for low power - my car was fine.
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Follow Up By: RMD - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 15:50

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 15:50
You would want to securely tape the ciggy plug into the socket I would think, especially if in rough work.
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Follow Up By: Member - Bigfish - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 16:11

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 16:11
I know 2 people who use these types of controller. Both on big vans and both owners very happy with the simple install and the use of them.
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:06

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:06
I would not be using one of those controllers for any length of time or making any long trips using them. They are the older synchroniser style controllers. Tekonsha stopped marketing those style on Australia many years ago, they now only market the proportional style controllers. The graphic below explains the difference and the advantage of using a proportional style controller. (Click on it to expand it.)

William, when you get a controller fitted to your eventual tug, I suggest you get one of the proportional types.




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Follow Up By: OzzieCruiser - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:40

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:40
The one I have is fully proportional and senses deceleration - hence in the instructions it is quite clear on how the master unit is to be mounted with respect to angles so it fully senses deceleration. Eg it cannot just sit horizontally on the centre console.

But yes something to check but proportional portable units are available.
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Follow Up By: OzzieCruiser - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:42

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:42
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Reply By: outlaw40 - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 16:19

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 16:19
consult an auto electrician as to the brake controller wiring . i had the mn triton ie the model before the one you are considering and i am sure you had to pick up the brake light trigger at the brake light not the brake pedal for some reason . as for towing when i had mine i had a van with an atm of 2t and the triton struggled so hopefully the new one is better .
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 16:49

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 16:49
How old was your Triton? I have friends in our caravan club using them without any problems towing larger vans.
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Reply By: outlaw40 - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:21

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 17:21
It was a 2013 MN , when I say it struggled I guess what I mean is 2t was about its limit , we upgraded our van and with an ATM of 2750 the Triton just couldn't handle it . that's if you could even get it off the mark with the rubbish clutch in them . But op is talking about the next model a MQ so it may be a totally different kettle of fish .
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Follow Up By: RMD - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 19:49

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 19:49
While a manufacturer may state the towing capacity at 3 or 3.5 tonne for the sales advantage, anyone towing more than 2/3 the MAX rating is a bit silly. The rating is what it can comfortably/achieve without undue stress, on a flat road with no other situations affecting the towing, like wind, hills, mountains, rough roads and HOT conditions. It is no wonder a 2700 kg van behind one with a clutch will make it struggle to get going and downright dangerous. An auto will allow it to at least move it off the line. Shocker and spring upgrade an absolute essential for personal safety at least.
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Follow Up By: outlaw40 - Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 08:18

Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 08:18
Which is why we got ride of the triton BEFORE we took delivery of the updated van ,because i knew it wasn't going to cut it .
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Reply By: Erad - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 21:04

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 21:04
Regarding the brake controller, I have a Pajero of slightly older vintage, and there is a wiring setup built into the harness, where you have to install a relay box at the rear end of the car, and a small mod under the bonnet. I imagine that the Triton would have similar features. An auto Electrician should be able to tell you. Apparently if you tap into the brake lights etc a la old school, it can upset the Canbus system in my Pajero and probably your Triton. Check with an auto electrician first.

Regarding the towing ability of the Triton, it should have plenty of power, but as already said, the chassis overhang is rather long. Tritons can bend the chassis immediately behind the cabin, but Tritons are not the only utes which do this - virtually any of them will bend their chassis. It all happens when you are flogging along an outback track and come to a 'whoopsie' - a hump or more likely a washout. As the ute goes over a hump, it has passed the obstacle, but the caravan is still coming to it. The ute goes down from the hump as the van starts to go up the hump. Result - excessive downloading on the towball, and the chassis rails behind the cabin are the weakest point. The chassis bends. Driven sensibly, the Triton will comfortably tow loads such as this, so on outback roads, simply don't flog along at high speeds.

As said above, the chassis bending is not limited to Tritons - most of the utes suffer the same problem.
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Follow Up By: RMD - Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 22:05

Tuesday, Dec 28, 2021 at 22:05
I also think it will tow it ok but to look at the see the Swiss cheese chassis sides on a Triton is alarming to see. All the overhang/overloaded Apollo vehicles which broke fractured through at the Swiss area. Just doesn't engender confidence after seeing them.
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Follow Up By: axle - Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 09:38

Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 09:38
Hi RMD,

Next time your out and about have a look at the back end of the rodeos, same swiss cheese example also!

Actually the two rails protruding at the rear remind me of the tomato stakes in my back yard.

I'm interested to have a peep at the early D Maxes to see if they have followed on with the same design.

The overhang on the mits dual cab is ridiculous, WHY wont they change it??, my single cab is ok, but careful loading is key.

Cheers Axle...HNY.
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Follow Up By: RMD - Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 19:49

Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 19:49
G'day Axle.
I own a 2011 Dmax and it's chassis is nothing like the Swiss features of the Triton chassis. It is double thickness top and bottom in high stress areas and seemingly thicker side walls. Some may have broken but nothing like Tritons. They all have some failures though. Some early Dmax have been know to develop cracks around front cross member/ suspension areas. Not many but a few. Heard nothing more after '09.
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Reply By: Erad - Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 21:45

Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 21:45
One point to note with any leaf sprung vehicle is NOT to use air bags as a supplement for the rear springs. You may get away with it, nut equally you may not. With leaf springs, the load from the springs is transferred to the chassis at 2 places - where the springs connect to the chassis. If you put an air bag in the middle, depending on how much force it transmits, it is a point load, not a more distributed load as with the leaf springs.

This still doesn't stop the chassis from bending if you go over a hump at high speed - the car will be going down as the van is coming up, resulting in very high download forces on the towbar. This applies to any ute, not just tritons. Others may be stronger, but the bending moments are still present if you hit a hump or a dip at speed.
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Follow Up By: RMD - Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 22:49

Wednesday, Dec 29, 2021 at 22:49
Erad.
From my perspective when a vehicle sort of bottoms in a dip situation, hump similar in effect, the vehicle is near or at bottom, suspension compressed and the van weight suddenly added to it, often resulting in a bent chassis with a down rear end. Airbags probably also help the bend which may be between the spring mounts as well, as a result of the forces. I am yet to see any airbag which gives more travel. Good shocks, springs and travel distance are the best insurance.
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Thursday, Dec 30, 2021 at 08:23

Thursday, Dec 30, 2021 at 08:23
It's about time to trot this one out again - What causes a ute chassis to bend?



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Reply By: Member - William B - Thursday, Jan 06, 2022 at 10:27

Thursday, Jan 06, 2022 at 10:27
Thanks everyone for your advise and suggestions. I will use the Triton for our Mungo NP trip and see how it goes.
William
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