Hydraulic bottle Jack

Submitted: Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 13:46
ThreadID: 14843 Views:9211 Replies:8 FollowUps:10
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Went out and replaced my original Prado120 screw-type bottle jack the other day (a 1.8tonne job with a lift range of 205 - 485mm = 280mm lift)

Have since found that the aftermarket bottle jack i purchased (a 6tonne job from SuperCheapAuto with a 125mm lift) hasn't got sufficient lift for my tyres.

I'm running 265/70/17 tyres & therefore would need a 186mm lift (70% of 265) in the case of the rim touching the ground & needing to jack the wheel high enough to fit a new wheel. Front wheels are actually worse because the official lift point is the chassis rail & therefore you also have to allow for the suspension expansion as well.

Did a search on the internet and the only (reasonable) size jacks anywhere near this lift are approx 12tonne jacks with a 155 or 170mm lift. Then you have the additional complication of the closed height being too great to fit under the car (not to mention that you can't store it away in the original jack storage spot

Yeah sure I could run the flat tyre up on a block of wood; or use both the original and aftermarket jack, or original jack and airbag in tandem to eventually reach the right height etc .. but surely there is a nice squat jack out there with a decent lift capacity & decent lift height

Has anyone discovered one??
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Reply By: Utemad - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 13:52

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 13:52
Why do you want to replace it in the first place?
It's only new.

My Rodeo has the same jack by the sound of it. (Screw type bottle jack) It works fine and I have used it to remove a completely flat tyre on the beach as well as to help out in the garage.

You have to be careful with some hydraulic bottle jacks as they will leak oil if you lay them on their side. Which is the usual position in a standard car spot.

Utemad
AnswerID: 68643

Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 13:54

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 13:54
You should use a "block of wood" anyway.. When your out in the bush, if the ground is soft, and the jack sinks - which it will on sods law, your fubar.

I use a 12x12x3inch block of wood. Works a treat.. Also have a small groove in it to sit the wheelnuts.

YMMV
AnswerID: 68644

Follow Up By: Utemad - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 14:02

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 14:02
The only time I have ever had a flat in the Rodeo as I mentioned above was on the beach at Double Island. Turned right and the front right tyre let all the air out. No hole just low pressure I suppose (20 psi). Anyway I got out my standard jack and went to get my jacking plate piece of wood........ and it wasn't there....Bugger. Found out later it had been mistaken for firewood and been left at the campsite by someone who unpacked the firewood from my ute. It is all wood after all. Anyway I got out my little folding shovel and used that as a base plate.

Poor little shovel never was quite the same again..........

Utemad
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FollowupID: 329167

Follow Up By: Michael - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:09

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:09
I suppose its just another reason to have beam axles, just simply jack under the axle........yuo only need a few mmillimetres lift!!!!
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FollowupID: 329172

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:38

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:38
Trucky,
I think he meant that he could drive his car up onto the block of wood to give him more clearance ......but you're right about needing a base plate too.

Michael,
You're right about only needing a couple of mmm's of lift BUT only if you're trying to change a tyre that isn't flat. If it is flat, you've got the effective height of the tyre side wall to jack through (say about 8"), before you can get the new wheel on.
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FollowupID: 329174

Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:44

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:44
na I want even talkin of drivin onto the wood.. Just meant a plate you can put anywhere in uneven dirt too...
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FollowupID: 329177

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:03

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:03
Trucky,
Yeh mate i realise what you was torkin about, but the initial post bloke (sorry forgotten his name) was torkin about driving the car UP onto a block of wood.
Speaking of jacking plates, I killed 2 birds with one rock......I was forever wearing out the rubber floor mats under my big clod-hoppers. So now, I've got myself a 6mm thick sheet of aluminium tread plate, cut to size to fit into my foot-space. Works a treat and if the heels of my boots wear through it, I'll walk backwards to Bourke!! LOL
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FollowupID: 329181

Follow Up By: Michael - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:10

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:10
Roachie, yep correct but that makes it even worse for independant suspension, anyway they can have it!!!!! I must check the build date regards the crossflow radiator GU!! It was one of the very first Turbo ST, registered 7th july 1999, i will check tonite, Interesting your mates is top and bottom tank and same era 4.2TD. regards Michael
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FollowupID: 329182

Reply By: banjodog - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:36

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 15:36
This any good - http://www.4wdworld.com.au/products/bushrang/exhaust.htm
AnswerID: 68655

Follow Up By: DrewT - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:14

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:14
yeah .. i've got an airbag but don't really want to use it as my only way of changing a tyre!!
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FollowupID: 329184

Follow Up By: Michael - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:18

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 16:18
I've got on also,, been married some time now LOL
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FollowupID: 329185

Reply By: Muddy 'doe (SA) - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 17:28

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 17:28
Drew,

As pointed out above, I would love to hear your reason for changing the jack.

I had cause to remove the front drivers side wheel the other week. Had to remove all the clay from my little adventure that had worked its way into the back of the alloys and was throwing the wheel balance out.

Parked on level concrete I stuck the jack underneath and started winding. There was 10" of free space before the jack touched the bottom of the chassis rail. After reading Roachies comments then this would obviously be a bit different if the tyre was completely flat. When I got to the top of the jack the tyre was still just touching the ground with enough weight that I could not get it off the studs. I let it down again and stuck a 2' block under it. This time it was fine. The Cooper AT's are about 10mm bigger in radius than the originals so that must be the difference.

The jack was pretty slow though. A slightly faster one would be good. If there was a 3 stage version that was the same size it would be perfect I reckon. Let me know if you find one.

Cheers

Steven
AnswerID: 68682

Follow Up By: DrewT - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 18:31

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 18:31
Reason for changing the jack was specifically to get one rated for a heavier load. The original Prado jack is rated for 1.8tonne. A heavily loaded car with perhaps an additional towbar load (camper?) would I hope still not exceed 1.8tonne on one wheel, but it sure adds a heap of extra load onto what appears to be a small screw type jack. I really have no evidence that the original jack can't do the job but was going with popular opinion that you are better off with a heavy duty jack, and preferably a hydraulic rather than screw or scissor type.

Looks like i'll be going back to the original Prado one with additional packing underneath until i find a hydraulic one with enough lift!!
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FollowupID: 329213

Reply By: Peter 2 - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 20:06

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 20:06
Toyota has been making that type of jack for nearly 30 years, never seen one break yet. Would never rely on a hydraulic jack alone, the original jack with a larger base would be nearly as solid as a stand. The comment on laying hydraulic jacks on their side is valid too, any decent ones will have an arrow on the side to keep uppermost when using them sideways, cheap ones won't.
I'd keep the original and carry the hydraulic one as an additional spare, two jacks might get you out of trouble one day.
Peter
1996 Oka Motorhome

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AnswerID: 68711

Reply By: Member - Rick (S.A.) - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 22:50

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 22:50
Drew T

I agree with Peter 2 that 2 jacks are better than one. And I feel for your position - I did a similar thing a few years ago with my Patrol. The mechanical screw jacks are Blood&*^$#%^!! hopeless, especially if there is a serious weight to lift. And on a new 4 x 4 a highlift jack is (unfortunately) useless, so that is not a realistic option...........

Anyhow, what I now do is carry the bull bag/power jack/exhaust jack, and use it in sand/bogs etc if stuck. If necessary I will use it to change a wheel or assist with a lift prior to using the bottle jack.

But for changing a wheel in road or track circumstances, I use a 6 t bottle jack. I have a 30 cm extension arm for the pumping handle so I am nort risking things by lying under the vehicle while jacking. I find this set up at least halves the time to swap a tyre over & I get less frustrated. I also carry a strong (read : not Super Cheap $ 6.00) wheel brace, with the correct socket end distinguished by a bit of paint sprayed on the arm & nut housing. And I carry two x HARDWOOD 3 " blocks of timber.

So here's how:
1) acknowledge that if the tyre is dead flat or v low, you may have to take 2 bites at the cherry. Jack as best possible, or use the exhaust jack; Use the blocks of timber to rest the vehicle on. MAKE SURE IT IS STABLE: DO NOT GET UNDERNEATH, prior to your second elevation/bite of the cherry.
2 ) NORMAL SCENARIO: get your base plate out, put the block of HARDWOOD on the base plate; put bottle jack on top of that - position it under the chassis/axle - screw the extension out as far as possible before utilising the hydraulics, & go for it.

Use a hidey-hole in the rear compartment/under a seat/ etc to store base plate & the block(s) of Hardwood. Store it out of the way 'cos although it has to be accessible, the main criteria is convenience of utilisation of space, not the ability to change tyres. By that i mean if you acess rear for fridge/camping /cooking/personal/food etc items, you will do this 100 times for every time you need the jack. So they are numer uno. not a lousy jack.

Hope this helps
AnswerID: 68743

Reply By: Member - glenno (QLD) - Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 23:42

Tuesday, Jul 20, 2004 at 23:42
I just bought a bottle jack from thompsons spare parts(brisbane)for the troopy . Trade quality and they have all the spare parts . 5000kgs swl for $60 .
AnswerID: 68747

Reply By: lule - Saturday, Jul 24, 2004 at 13:59

Saturday, Jul 24, 2004 at 13:59
Drew,

Sounds to me like you need a 2-stage jack. I have a MASADA HPD4NG. Made in Japan, not China, and has a two-year warranty. 150mm down and jacks up to 340mm. 2000kg rated. Was 4000kg rated, but under revised AS standards the second stage of a 2-stage jack has to be halved in rating. A touch expensive, at $135, but you get what you pay for. Works fine for the Cruiser, but I keep my standard jack in its hidey-hole as well.
Lyle
AnswerID: 69402

Follow Up By: lule - Sunday, Jul 25, 2004 at 16:23

Sunday, Jul 25, 2004 at 16:23
Drew,

Re my last. Re-read your query, properly this time, and I see I'm a bit off-line. I bought my second jack for situations when I can't get the issue jack under the axle. Has happened a few times. If you have IFS, and a jacking point on the chassis etc the lift of the MASADA won't be high enough, but will lift the veh far enough for you to get the issue jack under the spot. Re the 1800kg rating, remember you are only lifting one wheel, or with the IFS jacking point, maybe one and a bit. The other wheels will be taking much of load. I've had a Prado, Pajero and a Cruiser and have never had a problem with the load capacity of the standard jacks, even when chock-a-block full. Hope that clarifies it for you.
Lyle
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FollowupID: 329836

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