RODEO-inverting balljoints???

Submitted: Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 14:04
ThreadID: 15226 Views:6275 Replies:5 FollowUps:13
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I have read a few threads about invertying the ball joints on the torsion bar front end on the Rodeo etc. What is the reasoning for this job, and wots involved in it???
Anyone done it could give me a blow-by-blow description on the project?? Any other modification required to acheive a good wheel alignment??
Thanx in advance.
David
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Reply By: Utemad - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 14:39

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 14:39
Hello

I am in the process of doing this myself.

I am considering using this kit. You don't need the kit but by using the spacer and the smaller bump stop you will get even more downward wheel travel.

Independent4x

Was wondering if anyone else has used it on a 97 Rodeo. Looks like the 4 bolt one will fit.

My understanding is that inverting the ball joints will allow you to wind your torsion bars up further before you go past the point when you cannot get a good wheel alignment. Alternatively you could get the same amount of lift without winding your bars up as much as you would have previously so as your front suspension does not stiffen up as much or lose as much downward front wheel travel.

This link has a very good set of pictures on the flip being performed. The Trooper has a 3 bolt while the Rodeo has a 4 bolt but the procedure is the same.

Isuzu Trooper

A very easy and cost effective enhancement I think.

Does anyone know of an Australian supplier of this sort of gear?

Utemad

AnswerID: 70895

Follow Up By: expeditionswest - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 03:07

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 03:07
Thanks for visiting my site, and checking out my Trooper. The Ball joint flip provides several benefits:

1. Allows for additional extension travel
2. Allows you to "crank in" more torsion bar lift and retain sufficient extension travel
3. Addresses some alignment issues, but still requires a trip to the alignment shop

I also installed lower profile extension bumpstops and spaced my shocks down slightly with all told yielded me an additional 23mm of extension travel.

Currently, I am only running 1" of torsion bar lift in the front, and 1.5" OME springs in the rear. Even with the small lift, the 285/75 tires fit fine, with no rubbing issues and full travel.

You can see some more pictures and video of my truck on my webpage here:1998 Trooper

[ View Image]

I use my Trooper for extended expeditions into the southwestern US and Mexico. I would sure love to drive it in OZ!!! If any of you want to take an adventure in the US, let me know...

I hope the additional information was helpful.

Scott Brady
Expeditions West

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FollowupID: 331220

Follow Up By: Utemad - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 09:46

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 09:46
Scott,

That's a pretty good site you've got there!

Holdens (Isuzus) are an underrated vehicle here. We're Generally overun with Toyota and Nissan vehicles.

Utemad
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FollowupID: 331228

Follow Up By: expeditionswest - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:09

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:09
Thanks for the kind feedback on the site!

The Isuzu Trooper (Jackaroo) is a great value and does not give up capability to a similarly equiped UZJ100. Although the UZJ does have a slight edge in drivetrain strength and potentially durability.

My main travel companion drives a UZJ100 TLC and has had great success. We have driven 10000's of KM's together.

I WISH we could get even a few of the vehicles you have available. I would pay $30,000 US for a diesel hi-lux 4 door or BJ75. What great, simple vehicles. Add some ARB Air lockers and I would be in heaven! :-)

I have a 4 door Tacoma with IFS now, and it is a good vehicle, but a diesel and solid axle would be so great!

I hope at some point in my life to go on an extended expedition in OZ. You have such a wonderfully diverse, beautiful and rugged country.

Some day!

Scott
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FollowupID: 331272

Follow Up By: Utemad - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:35

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:35
Scott,

You might get some of our vehicles one day as we get some of yours :-)

We have two F-250 dual cab 7.3litre automatic turbo intercooled utes for work. They rule on the beach but are too big for a lot of our bush tracks in Oz.

Is the Tacoma the same as the Toyota Hilux??? or is it the Toyota eq
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FollowupID: 331281

Follow Up By: expeditionswest - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:48

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:48
It looks similar to your hi-lux, here is a picture of my 2004 Tacoma Double Cab [ View Image]

I bought this truck to replace my 2001 Land Rover Discovery II, which proved too unreliable for expedition use (in my case). We cannot get the FJ80 Land Cruiser here anymore. 1997 was the last year. I would even be happy with a basic 105 Land Cruiser! A little big for my taste but would make for a great rig. :-)

90% of the US expedition enthusiasts drive Toyota products, and outfit them with TJM or ARB components. All of my vehicles have OME suspension systems. The stuff designed in OZ just works great! I prefer the smaller lifts that OME provides. Many offroaders in the US go with too much lift (and really big tires), which hurts overall performance. The "rock crawling" trails are much more popular here than the extended treks and expeditions.

Scott
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Follow Up By: Utemad - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:49

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 14:49
HEY website...let me finish!!!

Is the Tacoma the same as the Toyota Hilux or is it the bigger one like F-150 size??

The current Aussie Hilux has an IFS front end too. Although we do get the 3 litre turbo diesel. About to be replaced with a cleaner 3 litre apparently.

We get the 6litre diesel in the F-250 in the next model release in about 12 months. We have the XLT models already. Oz only gets the XL and XLT ranges

Some other yank tanks are coming our way soon too. Not sure which ones though but read something about it somewhere. The big utes seem to do very well here as we have a lot of imported Chevs, Dodges and Fords. The big wagons never took off here though. Holden imported the Suburban but it flopped here and the imports of wagons are few and far between. Our carparks are not designed for anything bigger than a Landcruiser so undercover carparks are usually out of bounds.

See you around in Oz sometime.

Utemad
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FollowupID: 331292

Reply By: Savvas - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 16:08

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 16:08
Signman,

Inverting the ball joint is simply moving the top ball joint from the top side of the upper control arm, to the underside of the control arm. On Jackaroos (Troopers) it is said to improve the wheel alignment adjustments over standard.

Best step-by-step I have seen this one ... PlanetIsuzoo.

AnswerID: 70916

Follow Up By: Savvas - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 16:56

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 16:56
Just looked at the Isuzu Trooper link supplied by Utemad in his post, above.

That one is much better than the one I supplied previously.
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FollowupID: 331174

Follow Up By: Baz (NSW) - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 17:17

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 17:17
Hey Savvas are you coming to Bendethra 14,15/8 if you are 4.30 am under Moorebank overpass M5.

Baz.
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FollowupID: 331176

Follow Up By: Savvas - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 19:26

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 19:26
Hi Baz .. I left a follow up on of the other threads somewhere, or I thought I did.

We already committed on the 15th so will be unable to make this one. Maybe next time.
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FollowupID: 331194

Reply By: Member - Peter D M - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 21:44

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 21:44
signman,
i have done this, rang matt at independant 4x and arranged purchase of spacers and bump stops 7 days and about $140 later in they went.
the process is easier to understand as follows. the ball joint is repositioned from on top of the control arm to underneath, you do not need the spacer but it maximises the lift. after this has been done your wheels are pushed out at the top and as you wind up the torsion bars it brings the wheels back into alignment. my mechanic was sceptical but the wheel alignment was almost spot on and required only minor adjustment. i have a set of 265 x75 x16 tyres with 1 inch offset rims which increases ground clearance. i dont think 285's would work. doing this needs work on rear and also puts extra strain on cv's as the angle increases. not meant to scare but the insurance and legality of this change is doubtfull and the tyres are illegal.
regards peter
AnswerID: 70975

Follow Up By: signman - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 11:17

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 11:17
Hi all,
How high is high??? We have a 2000 dual cab ute TF??? with the oversize torsion bars/31x10.5/15 tyres, ARB bar with Warn winch hangin off the front.
From the centre of the hub to the mudguard lip measures 545mm (from ground to mudguard lip measures 905mm).
What are other vehicles measurrements???
Thanx
David
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FollowupID: 331235

Reply By: Member - Peter D M - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 22:01

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 22:01
signman,
trying a link to a photo.
[ View Image]

[ View Image]
AnswerID: 70980

Reply By: Leroy - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 23:25

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 23:25
Do a search and make sure you click on 'both' before you start. Search for ball joint flip, rodeo lift, etc. I have made a couple of replies from my experiences but crank too high and expect to change CV's on a regular basis. Just don't get too heigh greedy as I did.

Leroy
AnswerID: 70990

Follow Up By: Mad Dog (Victoria) - Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 23:50

Monday, Aug 02, 2004 at 23:50
How high did you go and what sort of conditions do you drive Leroy?
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FollowupID: 331217

Follow Up By: Utemad - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 09:16

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 09:16
Depending on how high you go and how often you lock your hubs in. I saw one Rodeo work vehicle at Fourby's (Discount Tyre Service) in Brisbane. It was cranked so high, whatever it is inside the cv boot was crushing the boot on the outer of the housing. Needless to say the boots were knackered.

Utemad
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FollowupID: 331225

Follow Up By: Leroy - Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 13:34

Tuesday, Aug 03, 2004 at 13:34
Ray,

I had the front cranked up about 3" at one stage with cut bump stops, ball joint flip and spacer so to keep the front in alignment but you will hear your CV's binding as the front end articulates when getting close to full lock. In the end I took the spacer out, kept the flip and wound her back down to a bit less than 2". Most driving in the Vic high country to wheels always articulating and lots of tight turns at the same time. Didn't have a prob with CV boots crushing as mentioned by utemad.
I would go and buy a set of 31" BFG muddies as the rolling diameter is larger than other brand 31" tyres. That prob made more difference than the lift as I had more grip to boot!

Leroy
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FollowupID: 331259

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