UHF Antenna set-ups

Submitted: Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 20:31
ThreadID: 16116 Views:7967 Replies:7 FollowUps:14
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Hi all

I was wondering if anybody has tried mounting 2 antennas on the car, say a 3db and a 9db then running the coax cable back to the radio via a splitter of some description. I am kinda assuming this is not possible as someone would have done it already but if it isn't, why?

Cheers Jim
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Reply By: James M - Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 21:11

Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 21:11
To my knowledge there is no advantage to usuing two antennas. You would be better off just using the 9db. If you really wanted extra range you can get directional antennas that use one aerial followed by one or more reflectors. This is of no use to a 4wd. They call them yaggis (not sure on spelling)
My advice is to mount the antenna as high as possible.
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Follow Up By: Nudenut - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 08:15

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 08:15
I'm with James advice (last line)

if you remeber the simple saying.....'Height is might' ....then you wont go wrong
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Follow Up By: Jimmy - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:27

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:27
The problem with my car is that it is a High top Patrol/safari and if I have understood things correctly the high top will block a large portion of the signal if its mounted to the gutter ( i can't bring myself to drill a hole in the roof) as the base will be nearly 300mm below the roofline.

I will probably mount it to the gaurd which will mean I only need about 2.5 meters of cable whereas if I mount it to the bullbar I will need about 4.5. The amount of cable makes a difference to doesn't it?

These sodding uhf setups are pretty pricey so I wanna get it reasonably right first time

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Follow Up By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 15:10

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 15:10
Of course there would be a reason for wanting to do it, just sticking with a 9db might be fine if your driving accross the nullabour, but in the hills or in town it's going to be bleep all over by lower db anetennas. The problem with most switch setups is that you lose power through them. You can get the spring bases by GME that you can an screw the antenna and put a smaller one on, or the other type where you can add extra length to the antenna to go from 6db to 9db.
the other options is to mount the rig somewhere where the back is easy to get to so that you can simply have two plugs and just unscrew and screw in the other when you need it.
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Follow Up By: Mad Dog (Victoria) - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 18:17

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 18:17
A good quality coaxial switch would only have .1 db insertion loss so it's really nothing to worry about. I have one in the ute, can't see any difference on the s meter inline or not.
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Reply By: Eric Experience. - Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 21:43

Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 21:43
Jim.
A small antenna mounted on the roof or at the back over the spare wheel is best on any vehicle, the advantages of high gain antennas is much overstated. The limiting factor on CB range is the signal to noise ratio, a high gain antenna does not help that but placing the antenna as far as possible away from the vehicles electrics does. The reason you can not use 2 Antennas is the impedance maching problem and the signal from the 2 antennas would not be in phase and therefore would cancell out in some directions. To get an idea of the correct set up look at an ambulance or fire truck, these are installed by profesionals who could end up in court if the radio fails. Eric.
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Follow Up By: Member - 'Lucy' - Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 22:36

Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 22:36
Good evening Eric

Just had Willem & Judith around for tea.

He tells me you are in the Oakleigh area, and as I live in Mt Waverley I would be very interested in meeting you, your vehicle, your 4wd knowledge etc etc, if you would like to that is.

If so, please contact me on.

9888 1027 (H)
0427 060950 (H)

0438 553 975 (W)

or krobbo@optusnet.com.au

regards

Ken Robinson
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Follow Up By: Eric Experience. - Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 23:03

Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 23:03
Ken.
Thanks for the offer, there are 3 Erics on the forum, I dont know Willem and I dont live in Oakley so you may have the wrong one. Eric.
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Follow Up By: Lone Wolf - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 07:44

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 07:44
Eric.........

Go and eat him out of the house first.........THEN tell him your'e the wrong Eric!!!

Cheers

Wolfie
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Follow Up By: Member - 'Lucy' - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 23:21

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 23:21
Evening Eric

Just goes to show what a good night I had with Willem and J.

I think I had one wine too many, and as for 'Wolfie', may the 'three little pigs' huff & Puff and blow his house down.

Willem has given me the good oil on the correct Eric, so I'll try again.

Regards

Ken Robinson
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Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Saturday, Sep 11, 2004 at 21:12

Saturday, Sep 11, 2004 at 21:12
You mean Eric, also known as Nitro and Member - Eric.
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Reply By: Mad Dog (Victoria) - Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 23:24

Tuesday, Sep 07, 2004 at 23:24
You can use as many antennas as you wish Jim but there's really nothing to be gained in your situation. Radio Amateurs stack directional antennas both vertically and horizontal for added gain, some of the moon bounce arrays are huge.
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Reply By: fozzy - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 08:01

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 08:01
jimmy
no expert but if u want two aerials why not run the coaxials of each through firewall to unit and if in desert connect the aerial most suited and if in high country connnect that one.
obviously u have done a bit of research into aerials suitable for different areas.
for me i use one most suitable to high country etc but at end of day dfor me doesnt really matter as most of time other vehicles in group are within range.
only time there was slight issue was on trip to and from simpson where cars were spread out ie couls have been 20-30km between front and back car of seven cars.
all u do is relay messages if its that important
hope i got drift of your question
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Follow Up By: Jimmy - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:19

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:19
Cheers all for the responses and Ideas. Fozzy u r right I am tossing up between getting a GME TX3200 and a Icom 400pro.
The Icom has a lotmore features and comes with a 3db antenna. It looks like a 6db antenna, which I assume is a sort of mid range compromise, will cost me around $70.
Bringing the price for the GME to $365 for a basic model vs the Icom @$399 with all the bells and whistles, but with a hilly area specific antenna, which may well be all I will need, and if it isn't i can then do as you suggest and install a 9db for outback travel and switch between.
I thonk the 6db would be most suitable but then that puts the price of the Icom to $469 which is getting a bit ridiculess
Ah decicions decisions....
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Reply By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:41

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:41
Jimmy,
I have a splitter you can have if you like. It's a 3 way unit (Dick Smith from memory). Very simple 3 way switch and has 4 connectors; 1 on one side and 3 on the other. You can run 3 antennas into it and switch to any one of them just by moving the switch knob.
I used to have 3 UHF antennas on my b/bar. What an idiot, eh? I now don't have any on the b/bar, just one up on the roof rack.
Let me know if you'd like the splitter box......it's about the size of a cigarette packet.
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Follow Up By: Jimmy - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:51

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 09:51
LOL Thanks Roachie but you can keep your splitter. Interesting that someone else went to the trouble of doing this though!

What antenna did you end up with on the roof rack and did you notice any major difference to reception when switching between antennas?

Jim
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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 10:26

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 10:26
Jimmy,
The different aerials made no noticeable difference at all. In fact, the idea of cutting the cables and using joiners etc turned out to be a contributing factor in signal loss as far as I know.
I put in a whole new cable with no joins. The antenna I use is just one of those ground-plane independant types and i can screw on either a short rubber aeirial or one of those black steel ones with a pig's tail spiral in the middle. The base is about 1 foot long shiny silver on a spring. In your case, could you perhaps overcome the problem of the high roof, by using a piece of angle steel bolted to the roof gutter mount and then adding the spring-based antenna to the top of that, so that the spring base is about level with the roof?
I've only recently changed mine over to the roof and I ran the cable through the top of the pasenger's door, relying on the rubber door seal. That idea hasn't worked, rain drops find there way in and drip onto the seat. So I'm just about to buy more cable and do the job again. This time, I'll run the cable down the outside of the "A" pillar (hidden by the snorkel) and under the bonnet, through the firewall and up to the radio. The other idea I had was to drill a hole at the top of the "B" pillar and use a rubber grommet for the cable to go through. It would sit between the front and back doors if you can picture what I mean.
Good luck.
The reception since I moved the antenna to the roof is much better, but i can't be sure whether it's because of the roof position or the fact that I now have an unbroken cable instead of one with 2 joins in it.
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Follow Up By: Jimmy - Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 10:59

Wednesday, Sep 08, 2004 at 10:59
Thanks Roachie I think I will go with the Icom, get some blue tack and experiment a bit!
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Reply By: louie the fly - Friday, Sep 10, 2004 at 21:45

Friday, Sep 10, 2004 at 21:45
Jim, I have a 1m UHF whip mounted on a spring base on the bullbar of my Patrol. It works fine but after some trials I will soon be moving it to the rear, mounted off the spare wheel carrier, alongside a HF whip. Should work fine providing I don't transmit on both at the same time so I'm told. A simple bracket is all that is required, making sure it doesn't stick out to far so that it smacks the body when you open the "spare tyre" door and also clears the wiper arm. When I tested it at the back I found that I had stronger RX & TX than at the front. As well as all this, it is in my vision at the front (front right corner) and it drives me nuts.
I was recently on the Strez and didn't need my radio other than for some idle chatter. It worked great. In my opinion you should set it up to work best for when you are in remote areas, as best as you can with UHF anyway. How often will you use it around town?

Good luck
Lou
AnswerID: 75993

Reply By: Muddy 'doe (SA) - Saturday, Sep 11, 2004 at 20:46

Saturday, Sep 11, 2004 at 20:46
Jimmy,

I have recently installed the Icom IC400PRO in my Prado. I went with an antenna mount on a roof bar above the B pillar with the cable running down the side of the windscreen/ A pillar, into the bonnet and down to the firewall then thru and into the centre console bin between the front seats where the radio is mounted. (out of sight from thieving eyes!)

The antenna mount teminates in a screw fitting (BNC i think) that will take any standard antenna. I have two antennas. One is a $14 rubber duckie type about 6 inches long. It is a 3db antenna that is very flexible and is good when I am in woody hilly country. The other is a 6db 1 metre steel whip with the spiral centre section that cost about $65. This is good when in flat open country.

Both antennas are stored in the vehicle and it is literally a 20 second job to pull up and screw on the antenna appropriate to the terrain. You could also have a 9db model if you really wanted.

I have just one wire to worry about with no switch boxes and stuffing around. One risk with having the antenna up high is wiping it off in the scrub on low hanging branches (or low carparks!) but for me the benefit of the better transmission from the higher location makes it worth it. Amazing how many people manage to wipe out a bullbar mounted antenna anyway! You just have to be careful and the other advantage of the screw on connection is you can just hop out and remove it (if you remember!).

When i am around the metro area I genarally have the UHF off and the antenna unscrewed. Less chance of someone souveneering it (or just damaging it if it is not a screw off type) and the language and crap makes the radio virtually unuseable anyway.

Regarding the hi-top roof, if you mount the antenna on the guard or bullbar you are going to lose much of your rearward signal anyway. I would do as suggested earlier and maybe go with a gutter mount that gets up to roofline at least.

Have fun. Hope you find the solution that suits you.

BTW, I am very happy with the Icom so far.

Muddy 'doe
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Follow Up By: Sandboy - Monday, Sep 13, 2004 at 22:08

Monday, Sep 13, 2004 at 22:08
Muddy Joe

About to stick an Amateur Antenna on my Prado and funnily enough, I'm going to run the cable up the windscreen exactly as you've done. Its the only way I can see to get it up there without drilling holes in the Pilar.

Going to run a Dual Band antenna up on the roof for height and then a thumping Amateur Antenna on the bar out front.

Think I'll stand outside the car when I 1st tune up incase the airbags have something to say !

Ciao and Regards..Pete
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