Corrugated Roads a natural phenomena???
Submitted: Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:42
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Quino
Do you think you know how corrugations are formed??,
well think again.
Hi every one, a little bored tonight and was just wondering after a hard days drive on a typical road out here in WA how those little humps of gravel and sand are formed in perfect patterns across the full lenght of the road and remember the wind blows in all directions, doesnt it, so next time you are on corrugations and i think we all spend time on them if you own a 4x4 and your tape has rattled out of the deck, 0r the CD is jumping tracks and your coffe is in your lap,ponder on the Question: How do those corrugations really form?.
Ive got my theory,but would love to hear from any one who has thought about it before.
Reply By: Savvas - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:51
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:51
Hi Quino,
One guy I enjoy listening and watching is Dr Karl Kruszelnicki. He has a webpage on the ABC's website and there's a 3 part article on corrugated roads. Makes for interesting reading.
Check it out here.
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Follow Up By: Member - Mungo Explorer (NSW) - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 00:18
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 00:18
Very interesting. I've never believed the theories that explain corrugations by vehicle traffic, and this seems to support my view (
well, pt 3 at least does...). Corrugations are no worse in parts of the road that cop most of the traffic than at the sides - or not worse enough anyway to be explained by that - and MUST therefore be caused by wind and rain.
Put me down as a supporter of the "mini dunes" theory then :-)
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Follow Up By: Eric from Cape York Connections - Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 07:19
Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 07:19
Savvas I have dr karls explanation on paper on our trips people always ask the same question.
After a couple of days of thoughts I hand his notes around and this brings on a couple more days of ideas.
All the best
Eric
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Reply By: motherhen - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:51
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:51
Of all the roads we travel on, the Shire road to our farm is the worst for corrugating. It is worst on the inclines at either end of the road. It gets graded twice a year, and it doesn't take long for those little ridges to start forming; first on the inclines. The faster you go, the more bounce to start the corrugations. Once they have started, they make you bounce more and increase rapidly. Washouts and stoney roads are far kinder on cars than this road.
Well that's my observation anyway. Now i'll get back into the kitchen. Enjoy the rest of the weekend.
Motherhen
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Reply By: Muddy 'doe (SA) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:53
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:53
Dr Karl wrote a series of articles on this.
You can find the articles on the ABC web site in the science area.
Very interesting read. I think it has been linked in a previous post in the Archives of this
forum.
Cheers
Muddy
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Follow Up By: Muddy 'doe (SA) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:57
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:57
Dang - Savvas beat me to it!
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Follow Up By: Savvas - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:58
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 21:58
Beat ya to it ... ;-)
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Reply By: beenabout - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 22:00
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 22:00
I believe it is the rebound from
the springs of the vehicles, shocks, tyre pressure and coil springs. As the spings hit a bump - pothole, it contracts and then expands at a rate that it hits the ground with a thump and condenses that piece of ground it hits. Thus starting another bump behind the first one, if the shock adsorbers are worn or just tired they can't stop the second rebound and the process continues!
well thats my theory anyway
If you drive on a sandy track behind a leaf sprung vehicle, the corrugations dont seem to be as bad as when you follow a coil sprung vehicle. Just an observation and a personal one at that.
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Reply By: Member - Fay D Away (Vic) - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 22:02
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 22:02
Hi Quino
Check out post 1227 posted May 29th 2002 and other posts using "corrugations"
But is worth visiting again for an update on peoples ideas
Bill
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Reply By: Willem - Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 22:41
Saturday, Nov 20, 2004 at 22:41
Does it matter? The only solution to corrugations is not to drive on the roads.
Ofcourse if you go fast enough and start aquaplaning ,so to speak, on the top of the 'gations then you will not feel the bounce effect and your CD will not skip a tune.
There is not much you can do about it.
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Follow Up By: Yeah Mate - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 02:47
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 02:47
Willem
But I don't have enough power to reach the 200km warp speed x over, so instead I reduce tyre pressure.
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Reply By: Lone Wolf - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 07:57
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 07:57
I guess I, like many others, have too, also wondered.
I do know one thing, they always seem worse at crappy stock grids, where vehicles have had to either slow down, or pick up the pace again.
Very interesting post!
Wolfie
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Reply By: Member - Brett H (QLD) - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 08:38
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 08:38
I think they are caused by women drivers. hahah
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Reply By: Member - Collyn R (WA) - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 11:01
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 11:01
I spent a happily alcoholic evening over dinner with Ron Moon a few months back - mostly discussing corrugation formation. That discussion became the subject of one of his recent Columns in 4X4 Australia.
The cause of the discussion was my mentioning that I spent two and a half years in Africa studying road surface conditions. I collected a huge amount of data and thought that I had found the probable cause/s - much as the good Dr Karl propounds - and that it had a lot to do with pneumatic tyres.
On my return however I was dismayed to find a report written in the later 1800s on the build-up of corrugations on South African bullock cart tracks. Further research showed that corrugations even form on the vertical steel guides of lifts!
I have come to belief that a corrugated surface is the natural condition of a dirt road, but that there are many and varied triggering causes.
To some extent they may even be wind-caused
sand dunes on a smaller scale.
As with Karl I became aware of a few tracks in non-windy bits of the Sahara that are travelled only by huge 100-tonne plus trucks - these seem to stay corrugation free - here I believe the very high ground loading and huge footprint of the tyres does a steamroller act.
What is very clear though is that on many tracks the build-up is speeded up by drivers braking and accelerating before and after bends. It is interesting that this occurrs more on tracks used by tourists than similar tracks with roughly the same amount of local traffic.
So some of youse guys appear to be doing it to yourselves!
Collyn Rivers
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Reply By: Noosa Bushtrackers - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 11:46
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 11:46
If wind and rain were the cause, then everywhere would be corrugated, not just the roads.
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Reply By: Bob of KAOS - Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 14:32
Sunday, Nov 21, 2004 at 14:32
They are caused by people selfishly towing trailers!
Actually, my theory is that when a wheel rolls on a surface it creates a bow wave in front of it. This is significant on soft surfaces like dirt roads, less on bitumen, and very small on a steel train track. When the bow wave is big enough the wheel rolls up and over the crest and starts the process again. The next wheel to roll along the same track does the same thing, making the crest a little higher. Under braking or acceleration the wheel applies a shearing force to the surface of the track, loosening material (dirt) and increasing the size of the bow wave. Highly inflated tyres mean a smaller area of contact with the road and the resulting increased pressure loosens more dirt. Same with heavy loads.
Suspension bounce also increases damage to the troughs (the vehicle is only in contact with the ground for a fraction of the time so the pressure is greater, and the forward motive force can only act for a fraction of the time so a small wheel spin occurs each time the wheel hits the road which breaks up the surface).
So if my theory is right, there would be fewer corrugations if people travelled slower, let their tyres down, had lighter loads on each wheel (use a trailer ;-) and braked and accelerated gently.
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Reply By: Baz (NSW) - Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 07:39
Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 07:39
Same way braking bumps are formed on a motoX track or dirt track, they are formed by vehicles of different weights and speeds traveling the road, Karl believes it so i do too.
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Reply By: Member - Gary W (VIC) - Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 08:55
Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 08:55
Its a fascinating discussion. What I'm amazed about is that there is still no defining answer. Plenty of theories and a few experiments that provide some clues but not all the answers.
I too have wondered how they form.
Personally I can't agree that
suspension, or tyre pressure a a major factor as every vehicle is different enough to prevent a uniform outcome. It must have more to do with the road surface than anything else because that is the constant in any particular context.
Vehicle setups seem to only contribute to the speed with which they form.
I thought Dr Karl's first article was the most convincing as it involved a controlled experiment.
But it seems we still don't know for sure.
At least it will continue to provide subject matter for the
camp fire and an alternative to the Toyota/Nissan, Hiclone, Tyre Choice discussions.
Gaz
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Follow Up By: Member - Collyn R (WA) - Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 20:05
Monday, Nov 22, 2004 at 20:05
Gary
My research study conclusion was that there is no defining cause. Corrugation has many originating triggers. I was however, and still am decades later, reasonably sure that corrugated is the natural state of a dirt road.
Certainly the rolling wheel trapping dirt in front of the tyre and pushing it along until it the frcition is such that tyre rolls over it is probably the main cause. It is readily demonstrated in laboratory conditions. But it is far from the only cause.
Collyn Rivers
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