Sydney people - Cabbage Tree Lane CLOSED!!

bullbleep.

Bullbleep! Very constructive follow up.

The fact is, as I said "straight from the horses mouth". We have a DSE office here in Traralgon & the information I have came from there.
There may also closure of camping areas such as 'Merringtons' due once again to idiots just chopping the whole area up until it resembled a ploughed paddock, with absolutely nowhere left to even pitch a tent. The area has been closed for regrowth & will be reopened soon. If the same thing happens again, it will be permanently closed.
At Huggets Crossing, all the log tables & seats have been burnt on camp fires, so it is no wonder 4 x 4s are getting 'bad press'

Judging by the other responses below, others also feel the same way!

Fact is that one of the head powow's from the DSE is in our club.. We were talking to him at our club trip leaders course earlier this year... He realises that damage is done as much by people with AT's trying to impress their mates by trying to get up that hill until its nolonger a hill, as it is by people with aggressive tires. He himself with aggressive tires.

Ive been to dozens of camp sites that have been ripped up by people in 2wds as well as 4wds. Generalizing is not a smart thing to do. Thats what people with a weak arguement EG DSE, NPWS, the Greens etc do.

heres my reply to it below.

Prime example was last weekend before the seasonal closures.. Me John R from here and couple of mates were up high country. Monument Track up near Craigs Hut, some prick in a HIRED pajero with ROAD tires was determined to either destroy the track or the car in his attempt to get thru... After about 40 mins attempting it, (from about 300mtrs back all we could hear was smashing and amazing amounts of banging where he was just hitting these rocks flat out...) he made it.. Hero points to him, his mate in a stock Pathfinder had brains enough to turn back. But the track was rooted.. I cruised up there in low and didnt spin at all with my "KILLER AGGRESSIVE TIRES"..

All log tables and seats have been burnt by 4wders? Show me some proof... Couldnt have been bushwalkers, mtnbikers, motorbike riders, horse riders, etc etc etc....

Huggetts is only round the corner from our club property and know it well.

I didn't sate that the tables etc were burnt by 4w drivers, but unfortunately it is us that bget the bad press over it. I agree it sems whenever the DSE or relevant authority bulldoze a track & make it easier to get in to, the damage increases dramatically, however, if as you say it is the 'stock' vehicles doing the track damage, I have one question, how do the trenches get so deep? When quite obviously a 'stock' vehicle couldn't possibly do it.

How do they get so deep? When people try tracks they shouldn't, water runoff, bikes, and yes some cars with larger tires...

Look at Sunset for example, been up there many times, and waiting at 1/2 way mark, seeing cars coming up there foot to the floor, spinning the snot out of their AT's or bald MT's all the way up knowing theres no way they will make it, but they wont stop for anything.

Go for a drive along Vic Range Track. The TRACK is a trench, about 6-7FOOT deep. Your car disappears - some places you cant even open the doors, or climb out of the window.. EG the roof line of my truck with 35's on is the same height as the ground level next to the trench!

How did it get like that? Wouldnt matter if you had 48's onboard, the center of the track is still GONE.

Not saying that larger tires dont always do damage, its the drivers foot that does the damage, or the brain cells of the driver, but its like tarring EVERY 4wder as a hooligan, or environmental vandal... ATs on some tracks are more of an issue than MT/ET's..

talk about loads of crap.. Cars with lift do 0 damage compared to stock cars. How does any lift do anything?

Your normal 4wd with AT's may get YOU where you want to go, but it maynot get 99.99999999999% of others 1/2000th of the places they want to go.

Cars with aggressive tires actually can do less damage as you can drive up tracks easier than people with crap AT's that spin the ring out of them to attempt traction.

Prime example was last weekend before the seasonal closures.. Me John R and couple of mates were up high country. Monument Track up near Craigs Hut, some prick in a HIRED pajero with ROAD tires was determined to either destroy the track or the car in his attempt to get thru... After about 40 mins attempting it, (from about 300mtrs back all we could hear was smashing and amazing amounts of banging where he was just hitting these rocks flat out...) he made it.. Hero points to him, his mate in a stock Pathfinder had brains enough to turn back. But the track was rooted.. I cruised up there in low and didnt spin at all with my "KILLER AGGRESSIVE TIRES"..

Maybe "normal" 4WDers should kick up a stink and tell these guys that they are ruining it for everyone. Maybe they should stay on 4WD-friendly properties such as the Hume Hwy that cater for them, and don't mind re-building tracks once in a while as it's their livelihood.

So people need to think before they dribble.

Yes truckster but the key to all your ramblings were you stayed on the track and didnt have to crawl over rock ledges next to the track.

I take many people away with normanl tyres and educate them.

As per usuall you have to put one paragraph in that sounds makes you sound silly the last one.

If you have spent any time in the cape and other places you can see where your mates have been.
This year I saw a club with the lifted trucks and 37" rubber try a track that was near imposible and what a mess. It used to be a nice creek but not now.

All the sensible stock truckes took the usuall path.

All the best
Eric

OK Truckster - I'll refine my statement. I'm not pointing my finger arbitrarily at drivers of large trucks who know what they're doing. I also have a 6" lifted truck running 35's - so please don't confuse me with a Hume Highway cruiser.

It's usually the new driver (who hasn't the experience) with big powerful V8's AND large tyres that think that no track is beyond them.....until they find it is.

Your average driver isn't going to attempt half the stuff a bloke with 37's is going to. The problem I have are people who come up to a rock shelf with soft soil at the bottom. They climb the first step to find that their wheelbase means that the fronts come up against the second shelf at the same time their rears are right on the beginning of the step below. They have to apply inordinate amounts of power to get both front and rears climing at the same time and bounce up and down with tyres smoking to the point they dig out the soil below. Large tyres and lots of mis-directed power do more damage in these circumstances.

It's also the attitude that makes these guys a problem. They're just not able to admit that they should go around and have to prove to their mates that they "can do it".

It's also the attitude that makes these guys a problem. They're just not able to admit that they should go around and have to prove to their mates that they "can do it".
You are spot on.

More and more the places i go you can see the evidence.

All the best
Eric

And unfortunately that applies to some of the Tag a Long tours up the Cape (other than your's of course Eric .. ;-} ) They just had to have a go at everything regardless. A total bunch of tossers. Not naming names, but it starts with the 4th letter of the alphabet.

Cheers

"Dunce Offroad Tours"?

Yeah Rosscoe - you're right. Some of the operators aren't as conscious of they should be. I think it probably also depends on the type people that come along on the tour. If an operator gets a bunch of young guns, then they'd adjust the tour to those people. If a bunch of oldies were there, it would be a different tour altogether. Eric would probably be able to confirm this one way or another.

chrispy we dont adjust our tours for young and old.
When we get to a part of the track which has a hard/easy option I always take the easier way.
Over the uhf I say that you can go either way but I have taken the easier way. To say the left.
People can have a play but only on formed tracks.
We had a fellow that wanted to take the old palm creek crossing this year and he had a go we had to winch him out but he had a ball.
No harm to anything other than his pride.
We only use formed tracks unless there is no alternative.
We realy love the bush desertand beaches and we dont want them closed.
We have seen many over the last 25 odd years of 4wd driving.
As I have already said I blame the mags.

But dont get Peter or I started on that one.

All the best
Eric

"When we get to a part of the track which has a hard/easy option I always take the easier way.
Over the uhf I say that you can go either way but I have taken the easier way. To say the left.
People can have a play but only on formed tracks. "

Sounds sensible Eric

Cheers
Chris

Chrispy

You're close to the mark. Except in this instance the tagalongs were, in the main, older types. Just the wankers leading the show that got my blood up. There was another crowd behind them, who's name escapes me at the moment, but they had a similar attitude.

P.S. It was a pleasure to stop and yack to Eric further along the track....notwithstanding his "anxious to proceed" followers.

Cheers cob

They climb the first step to find that their wheelbase means that the fronts come up against the second shelf at the same time their rears are right on the beginning of the step below. They have to apply inordinate amounts of power to get both front and rears climing at the same time and bounce up and down with tyres smoking to the point they dig out the soil below. Large tyres and lots of mis-directed power do more damage in these circumstances.

AT's in this example would be no better or worse - The AT would spin for longer before either gripping, or giving up.

The MT/ET's would have more chance of gripping and getting past the obsticle than the AT's so would spin for less time..

Truckster - I'm not one to carry on over these issues... but I still think that you haven't got my drift.

Of course you have a better chance of getting over an obstacle with large aggressive tyres - I have competed and should know.

What happens when they let go though is far more damaging. If you lose traction AND KEEP THE POWER ON, and decide to do this until you are up to your axles, then you a LOT DEEPER into the track surface owing to the larger diameter and more "diggy" tread pattern.

Again - it's when even TSL's let go (which will be way after an AT... duh) that they are capable of far more damage than a smaller tyre IF the driver doesn't give a toss about either his tyres or the track and tries to get up regardless.

If you've managed to get over every obstacle you've ever come across and think it's because of your tyres - then you 'aint been up a hard enough track to stop you.... and they're out there.