Solar panel regulators
Submitted: Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 19:31
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Stuart
Hi Guys, I'm looking for info on a solar panel regulator. I'm using the common Super Solar brand regulator. These are a good and commonly used unit, however they have one problem. In hot and sunny weather my battery goes flat after a couple of days. Why? Becuase the unit can only step the voltage down aprox 5 volts. So if the panel puts out over 20 volts the regulator can't step it down enough and when the charge to the battery reaches 14.5 volts it disconnects it's self from the battery. Once I realised what was happening I could hear the regulator cutting in and out all day and not charging the battery. I have resorted bypassing the regulator and putting a towl over part of the panel and using a multimeter to monitor the charging. NOT very satisfactory. Does any one know of, or can build a regulator that chokes the current back to a maximum of 14.4 volts. This wouldn't be easy as it would have to allow full voltage from the panel up to 14.4 volts then keep it there even with a variable input up to about 30 volts. Any help would be very welcome. Thanks.
Reply By: David Au - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 19:36
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 19:36
How about you tell us what brand and size of solar panel you have for a start.
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Follow Up By: Stuart - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 19:55
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 19:55
BP Solar 80watt.
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347426
Reply By: Stuart - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 20:12
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 20:12
Thanks. I'll check it out. The unit I'm using cost $70. According to the instructions it's working properly. Cheers.
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Reply By: Member - Jimbo (VIC) - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 20:39
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 20:39
David,
What about the job you told me about from Jaycar at about $20. Will this do the job?
Cheers,
Jim.
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Follow Up By: David Au - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:11
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:11
Jimbo the cheapie Jaycar unit is not sufficiently rated for an 80w panel.
Jaycar have the MP3126 $69.95 but it is not PWM. They are a good unit for casual use, but have no PWM. For PWM to work and to get good results, you need to have the solar panel and regulator permanently connected as they have a twenty six day program.
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Reply By: Topcat (WA) - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 20:56
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 20:56
Hi Stuart, I run 2 x 80watt BP solar panels through an "ARRID"
Solar Power Regulator which is available from the 12 Volt
Shop (
http://www.12volt.com.au/) which has the 'Pulse Charge' set-up (reduces sulphation in lead acid batteries) for $80.00. I have used this setup without any problems of over voltage as you mention. Check out their web page. They sell good quality 12volt electrical gear at reasonble prices. Cheers.
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88583
Follow Up By: David Au - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:12
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:12
Topcat sorry to say, they are far from what you would call a quality regulator. Suggest you go and read the PWM links I posted earlier.
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Follow Up By: Topcat (WA) - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 00:02
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 00:02
Well David Au, I don't want to get in an argument with you, but I can say from first hand experience running
solar power systems for over 20years & getting long life out of deep cycle batteries (over 6 to 8 years) that the regulators that I am using are good value for money & have served me
well. Have a nice day. Cheers.
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Reply By: Stuart - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:00
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:00
Thanks Topcat, that's the sort of info I need.
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Reply By: John - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:06
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:06
Dear Stuart
There are several types of regulators in order of increasing performance they are:
1.Simple on off switching a) single level
b) on off switching Multi level (up to 4 levels)
2.Pulse width modulating (PVM) a) single level
b) Multi level (up to 4 levels)
3.Power tracking All multi level
They then increase in cost depending on current capacity and display
The regulator you have is a Simple on off switching (single level I think). Considering the cost of solar panels it is at lest worth the cost of updating to a Pulse width modulating (PVM) single level like the morning star. These are less than $100 and give reasonable performance.
Personally I use a Plasmatronics PL20 (PVM Multi level ) level. These are excellent units are programmable with display They give a reasonable increase in performance over the single level units and the display gives lots of usefull information (for about $350 from memory).
Power tracking regulators give a further 10% improvement in solar panel performance but are bulky and about $800.
Hope this helps
John
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Follow Up By: David Au - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:14
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:14
I am glad you think PLasmatronics are excellent - I don't.
While the features of the Plasmatronics are good, their so called pulse mode leave a substantial amount to be desired.
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Follow Up By: John - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:45
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:45
Dear David
Could you elaborate on the problems. I have used one in my boat battery which is now 17 years old and still going ! but would be intested in what problems you have experienced.
Cheers John
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Follow Up By: David Au - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 22:08
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 22:08
John I did not say there were problems. I would choose other brands with better PWM formula's in preference to Plasmatronics. I am the first to agree that Plasmatronics offer some good features if you actually need them and use them, but as regulator there are better choices.
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Follow Up By: Member - Stillthinkinaboutit - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 08:30
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 08:30
Hi Stuart,
I am with John on this one.
For a basic unit the Morningstar will do the job quite
well.
The Plasmatronics PL20 would be a better choice ( IMHO ), I have used one for a few years now and found it to be very reliable,it is also easily programmed if you have requirements that differ from the preset programs and provides quite useful information from the LCD display such as Panel Voltage, Battery Voltage, Charge Current, Load Current, AH in, AH out, State of Charge etc. etc.
Regards,
Mark
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Follow Up By: John - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 09:32
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 09:32
Morning star claim a better "PWM algorithim". I asume by this they mean they control the voltagage more tightly than most to .02V.
This is impressive, but considering they only use 1 voltage level (with basic temp comp) for each battery which is about 0.4V higher than the manufacturers recomend for float and 0.2V lower than the battery can accept when discharged.
I dont see the advantage.
The unit is small cheap and good value for money but I cannot see why anyone would recomend it (cost asside) over a PWM regulator with 4 levels.
cheers John
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Follow Up By: David Au - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 11:27
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 11:27
Stillthinkinaboutit if you read what I said, I said the Plasmatronics has some good features, but the Morningstar is a regulator of preference because it has a better PWM system.
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Reply By: Stuart - Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:16
Monday, Dec 13, 2004 at 21:16
Thanks John, it's of great help. The responses I have received tonight have given me a lot of leads to chase on the internet. I know a lot more now than I did 2 hours ago. I know what I'm looking for now. Cheers.
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Reply By: hl - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 06:32
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 06:32
Hi,
Your regulator is doing EXACTLY what it is designed to do. It is supposed to cut out when the battery reaches 14.5 V, if it didn't you would start cooking the battery!.
Maybe you just need a bigger battery.
Having said that, an 80W panel will not be sufficient to even run a fridge for more than a couple of days. Add a few lights etc, and you will need more than an 80W panel can provide.
Cheers
Horst
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Reply By: Member Eric - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 07:53
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 07:53
I have a BP solarx and seams to work
well , this is regulating a 100 watt panel
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Reply By: Taize - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 07:54
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 07:54
David,
Rather than just tell people that you think they are using bad quaility regulators why dont you tell us why they are bad and why another brand is better. Telling us that something is "crap" without explaining why makes you sound like a salesman with an agenda to push.
Question for you to answer
What, in your opinion, are the qualities of a good regulator
Why are the regulators that people have mentioned on this thread "bad"
If you know of a better regulator please tell us what it is and why its better than the others.
I'm not trying to get into an argument - just trying to work out the facts.
Kym
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Follow Up By: David Au - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 11:24
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 11:24
Kym I did not say there was a bad one at all, I said I prefer technically.
You used the words 'bad' and 'crap' - not me.
If you research the different brand of regulators, you will find that there are only a few regulators with true pulse width modulation. You cannot say any regulator without PWM is a great regulator, they are good for casual use.
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Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 18:50
Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 18:50
Settle Petal! David's just stating his opinion, and he's allowed to do that, take it or leave it its an opinion.
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Reply By: time waster - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 16:25
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 16:25
hi stuart i have a 80watt bp panel that i run through a Solsum 8.0x regulater to an 80amp hr exide extreme battery in my hilux,on a typical
camping day not running the car but using 2x 1amp fluros 1x 1amp tv at night and an engel 40L on normal cooling (beer temp) and if i put the panel out at first sun rise by about 1 pm the battery is fully charged i find this reg very good as gives you l.e.d.s to let you know at what stage of charge the battery is at also at full charge it pulsates the voltage the next model up has an auto low cut off
mine cost $60
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Follow Up By: Mr Z - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 16:33
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 16:33
where are you located? and what ambient temps does your fridge run in?
from what i have heard an 80w panel isn't big enough for this job?
i'm looking into solar at the moment but unsure what to get?
i have a similar setup, fluoro, 39l engel.....
thanks
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Follow Up By: David Au - Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 18:57
Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 18:57
MrZ where do you live?
I will post the output for you over twelve months of an 80w panel.
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Follow Up By: Mr Z - Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 19:13
Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 19:13
that would be great
i live in
melbourne
bp 80w panel and regulator currently on sale at battery world
thanks
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Follow Up By: Mr Z - Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 20:01
Wednesday, Dec 15, 2004 at 20:01
thanks for that info David, price was $799, i'm guessing a very basic regulator-not sure what brand
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Reply By: Stuart - Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 18:59
Tuesday, Dec 14, 2004 at 18:59
Thanks for your reply, I run similar loads and have found that my battery recharges quite quickly as
well when I by-pass the regulator. I have had 2 replies saying that the 80 watt panel is not big enough. Last camping trip I had no trouble running the 40ltr engel and lights ect for 5 days while ever I regulated the charge manually. I ordered a Morning Star Sunsaver regulator today and I will see how that goes. Looks like a very good unit. Cheers.
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Reply By: time waster - Friday, Dec 17, 2004 at 14:15
Friday, Dec 17, 2004 at 14:15
i have the 40th anniversary engel model and they it pulls no more than 2.5amps,i ran
mine through the multimeter and it only used 2.1amps it also has a temp gage that i usally keep around 0-4c i dont know how accurate the gage is though we spent all of september travelling from
moreton island to
tathra onthe east coast and then following the murray
home to
adelaide in this time i was able to
test how
well the panel recharged as there were times we did not start the hilux for several days and the regulated started to flash around 1pm when the battery was fully charged when we had full sun light
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