GU LSD - anyone have the same problem?

Submitted: Sunday, Jan 16, 2005 at 22:41
ThreadID: 19449 Views:6469 Replies:9 FollowUps:7
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The LSD seems to be kicking in when it's not needed. Like when going slowly round a right hand corner at around 10km or moving out into traffic. Very annoying. It's been happening for about 2 weeks now. Off to the dealer tomorrow morning. I'd be interested to know if anyone has had the same problem.

Peter
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Reply By: Member - muzzgit - Sunday, Jan 16, 2005 at 23:28

Sunday, Jan 16, 2005 at 23:28
I thought that's what all LSD's do. Mine always does this (GU patrol), so does my brothers (60s cruiser).

Cheers,

Muzz
AnswerID: 93493

Reply By: GO_OFFROAD - Sunday, Jan 16, 2005 at 23:45

Sunday, Jan 16, 2005 at 23:45
LSD's are designed to transmit aprox 50% of the drive being submitted to each rear wheel, while accelerating, regardless of where you are, via clutch plates in the diff.

Unfortunately, the LSD is driven by the accelerator, so, if you dont want it to work, dont push the accelerator.
AnswerID: 93495

Follow Up By: Mel & Lucy - Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 10:45

Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 10:45
That is what I thought as well.

Could still be faulty though.

What year is the Patrol ?
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Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Tuesday, Jan 18, 2005 at 11:47

Tuesday, Jan 18, 2005 at 11:47
"Unfortunately, the LSD is driven by the accelerator, so, if you dont want it to work, dont push the accelerator."

Ummm.....Wrong.

The LSD effect is driven by the difference in rotational speeds of the two axles. This activates the mechanism that forces the clutch packs together locking up the differential.

It can be noticable at low speeds due to less slip on the surface that you are driving on, also the vehicle is usually quieter, meaning you tend to hear it more.

It is noticable during high accelleration when one wheel breaks traction allowing the wheels to rotate at vastly different speeds momentarily.

It has nothing to do with accelleration per se, just when that accelleration causes one wheel to slip. But you are correct in that the slower you go, the more time the LSD clutch has to slide. It does slide, just slower and less noticable.

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Follow Up By: GO_OFFROAD - Tuesday, Jan 18, 2005 at 22:11

Tuesday, Jan 18, 2005 at 22:11
Not wrong at all garyinoz, you may need to research a little better in future before replying, as the clutch packs are designed to work while under acceleration, and free wheel when under de accelerationm eaning, when he turns,a nd acelerates, the lsd makes the inside wheel want to try and cover the same distance as the outside wheel..
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FollowupID: 352826

Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 01:06

Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 01:06
Well, I've got an Eaton Positrac in the rear of the Kia that bites both ways.

Jack up the differential (both wheels off the ground) and turn one wheel. If the LSD is working properly then the opposite wheel should rotate in the same direction, and in fact it should be diffiicult to get two people to turn them at different rates. ie there is always some bias applied (cross axle "communication"), therefore they are NEVER "freewheeling" even at effectively zero decelleration/accelleration. Note that this is the standard test for any LSD. If the LSD is shot (or for an open diff) the opposite wheel will turn in the other direction.

LSD's actually want to make both wheels travel at the same speed, the decision as to which wheel slips on road/off road relates to which wheel has the better traction on the ground. The internal clutches allow some cross axle wind up to be dissipated across the differential mechanism.
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FollowupID: 352847

Follow Up By: GO_OFFROAD - Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 06:13

Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 06:13
So who asked what you had, or how it worked,a nd how is that reletive to this thread?

Now your "test" for an lsd would not only be inconclusive, given the load applied by hand has nothing to do with the clutch settings for the lsd operation, apart from knowing the wheels spin the same direction [which a stuck locker or welded diff gears would also do......] because you arent applying any drive through the gear set, and there is no load across the axles, your simple "hand" test just tels you the oil has enough stick to transmit some drive to the other wheel when turned by hand.....
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FollowupID: 352849

Reply By: Patrol22 (Queanbeyan - Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 08:00

Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 08:00
Peter
Short answer is yes....and mine was engaging in most tight turning situations. The boys at Monaro Off Road put a couple hundred mils of LSD addititive in the diff and hey presto the problem disappeared.......and the LSD still works well. I will say that when they drained the diff before doing this it appeared as if there was a bit of water ingress. This was not unexpected as a couple weeks before I had a bit of excitement in the Tuross River that put my snorkel to full use.
Cheers
Pete
AnswerID: 93516

Reply By: Member - Chrispy (NSW) - Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 08:04

Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 08:04
I reckon just be thankful that you have an LSD which works... and WELL by the sounds of it. :)

Nissan LSD's have a reputation for longevity and it's well-deserved. My '91 GQ's LSD is as tight as the day I bought it 8 years ago. That's pretty darn good in my book. Yours should last for many good years....
AnswerID: 93517

Reply By: Member - Bradley- Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 10:39

Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 10:39
just sounds like common shudder , where the plates stick and release quicly instead of sliding with resistance, very common with lsd's , usually fixed with a gutfull of new oil (correct type of course) .Sometimes a bit of additive helps as well.

no real drama i'd say. easy fix
AnswerID: 93551

Follow Up By: Peter McGuckian - Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 10:53

Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 10:53
Thanks for the feedback guys.

Just been to my Nissan dealer and they have a modification - adding some additive to the diff oil. If this doesn't work they replace the diff centre. And mine at present isn't normal. Sounds as if this has been a problem with some diffs.

Cheers

Peter
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Reply By: Member - Andrew(WA) - Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 20:53

Monday, Jan 17, 2005 at 20:53
Peter

I have the same car and HAD the same problem. My diff use to feel like it was 'grabbing' when cornering on sealed roads and caused a shudder effect as the LSD gripped and let go.

It's all to do with tolerances in the clutch plates. Some are tighter than others and thats the way they come from the factory.
After much discussion with Nissan about this I was told 'the above' and Nissan do recognise it as a drama in SOME cases. The trick is to have it sorted out before you reach 40,000km because Nissan will only cover your diff up to the 40k mark, I was told.

Nissan will place an approved additive into your diff and see if it fixes it. (In my case it did) I have done almost 70,000k's now and no more probs.

If they can't fix it with the additive, apparently they will replace your diff centre???

That's what I was told and thats my experience with this issue anyway.

I was pretty scepticle about the additive because I thought it would hinder the effectiveness of the LSD but in the 'limited' true 4x4ing I have done since the additive was introduced, it seems to be fine.

No diff in a modern car should shudder when cornering IMHO so get Nissan to fix it. You paid for the Warranty!

Cheers
AnswerID: 93657

Reply By: Peter McGuckian (Member) - Tuesday, Jan 18, 2005 at 09:49

Tuesday, Jan 18, 2005 at 09:49
Spent 30 minutes at the delaer late yesterday and I'm pleased to say the problem is fixed. I should have referred it to them earlier but anhow it worked. Quite an amazing difference.

Thanks Nissan

Peter
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AnswerID: 93732

Reply By: ExplorOz Team - Kerry W (QLD) - Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 01:36

Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 01:36
There has been a lot of info posted re shuddering Patrol Limited Slip diffs over the last few years do a search of the forum, You will find the main problems seem to be LSD oils used and the interval they are changed at.

The 2 most reccomended oils for the GU seem to be the Castrol LS 90 /140 (dont quote me on that best to go back and check)and Penrites Limslip 140 - they are specific LSD oils and have the correct additives and provide better performance offroad. Both company websites should have reccomended oil specs for the vehicle.

hope this helps.
Kerry W (Qld)
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AnswerID: 93871

Reply By: GO_OFFROAD - Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 06:16

Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 06:16
Nissan also used to have a tube of additive for the gq, which was available, to stop the lsd "chatter" when turning, which you added to the diff, was a like a plastic tooth paste tube, havent used any for some time, so cant be 100% sure its still available.

HSV had a similar thing for the VU on range for a similar problem.
AnswerID: 93874

Follow Up By: Member - Bradley- Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 11:41

Wednesday, Jan 19, 2005 at 11:41
yep Holden have the same stuff in a small bottle , as fitted to jackaroos / commodores etc. GM part number - 10523580.
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