winching

Submitted: Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 08:53
ThreadID: 19942 Views:2016 Replies:9 FollowUps:7
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hello gang

when you are winching yourself do you winch while the 4bie is in neutral or do you have the 4bie in low 1 and use the drive and the winch at the same time.

the reason i ask is on the weekend i was out with a group and the person needing to winch was told to winch and drive in low 1.

i thought i read somewhere that you are not meant to do it this way cause you can cause some damage to winch or snap the cable if you suddenly jump forward and slip back.

your thoughts on this would be a great help.

gra
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Reply By: Well 55 - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:12

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:12
Your correct in what you say, let the winch do the work,

The exception maybe when the load becomes to much for the winch (lets say you are using a snatch block already) you can use 1st low and low revs to help the winch out, careful not to let the cable fall slack.

Care is all that is required for a sucessfull extraction.
AnswerID: 95767

Follow Up By: Member - Paul J (ACT) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:16

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:16
Morning Tony, how was Xmas and the New Year?
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FollowupID: 354579

Follow Up By: Well 55 - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:47

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:47
Great thanke Paul, spent most of the time at the farm except for a few days down at Falls Creek.
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Reply By: Kiwi Ray - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:37

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:37
Hi There
When we drive in winch challenges
We always drive when winching as this helps the winch reduces stress on components as you have both systems helping to move the truck. The leaning prosess is is experience and time behind the wheel or winch.
The object is to have the wheel turning at a speed to match the truck speed
Ray
AnswerID: 95776

Reply By: Wayne (NSW) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:40

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 09:40
Very simple,

If you are being winched, you do not drive

If you can drive you do not get winched.

Winch the vehicle until it has traction, disconnect the winch cable, and then drive the vehicle out.

The risk of placing the winch and cables and all the other gear under a shock load is very high if you get traction for a short time and then start to slide back with the cable still attached. The vehicle moves forward a little bit the winch cable goes slack because the winch can't keep up , the vehicle loses traction and slides back and the you have a the recovery gear put under a shock load.

Sometimes the person who is being recovered has to say I am not happy with what I have been told to do by someone else and do it the way they think it should be done.I belive that the person who owns the vehicle has a right to say how the vehicle should be recovered.

If you own a winch learn how to use it and all the safty requiments and equipment required befor you set out.

Winches are great but learn how to use them.

Wayne
AnswerID: 95777

Reply By: Member - Davoe (WA) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 10:02

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 10:02
I always drive as well but have never been in a situation where I would have slipped back again, usually bogged on the edge of saltlakes
AnswerID: 95784

Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 11:57

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 11:57
People are saying hard and fast NOT to drive.

But every situation is different. I usually drive to assist the winch, but then again, when I bogged, Im usually stuck fast. It all depends on the situation, conditions, and more.

Some situations you need to drive as well to give the winch some assistance, and also you can sometimes then just drive out of the bog once you get out of the inital goop.

Watch some competition videos, or some touring videos, they all drive while winching.
AnswerID: 95810

Reply By: Wayne (NSW) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 12:23

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 12:23
I will agree that every recovery is diffrent, how ever, trying to drive when bogged will only have wheels spinning and that only allows the vehicle to sink deeper.

Removing the build up of the mud or sand from in front of the wheels will help, the same as putting rocks to build up a deep hole. Logs and sticks should not be used because of the damage that they will cause.

All those winch challenge competitions are just that, competitions to see how fast a vehicle can get through a marked course and have very little to do with recovery and safety and should not be seen as the only way to winch.

The post asked to clear up something that was read about winiching and that has been answered.

Wayne
AnswerID: 95815

Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (WA) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 12:47

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 12:47
Think truckster put it best. Instruction usually take the safe way out coz it keeps it simple and they dont want to allow for Human interpratation but I reckon it depends on your situation. Just like your coment about rocks vs logs. I used to work for the geol survey and our job was to find rocks which could take over a day just to find them what do you do if you are bogged in between? (actual answer is to take your own 4x2 planks) otherwise you assess the situation and act accordingly
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Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:33

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:33
Davoe,

Professional instructors have to take the safe way.

If we were to say that it is safe to winch and drive then that could mean that in all recoveries and levels of experince that this is safe to do so.

When things go wrong and someone is hurt or killed they turn to us to blame and then sue.

What they do after the training course we have no control but we must keep to the safty side of everthing that is said or implied.

Wayne
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 20:22

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 20:22
"...drive when bogged will only have wheels spinning and that only allows the vehicle to sink deeper"

They wont grip and drive you out of the bog? You dont stick your foot thru the floorboards, you stick it in low, and turn the steering to gain grip once you have moved a foot or 2... Usually u can drive from there.
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Reply By: Tim HJ61 - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 12:38

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 12:38
Hi,

I'm guessing these replies refer to electric winches. What about PTO winches?

The first time I used my PTO winch I broke the shear pin.

Was bogged in sand, wheels stuck but not sitting on difs, needing a pull up a slight incline and had one rear wheel down a gully off the track. I had thought the PTO drive would only work when the transfer case was in neutral therefore I couldn't assist winch by driving as well.

Any hints - one could be to try it out, and another to do a course....

Ta
Tim
AnswerID: 95819

Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:04

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:04
Tim,
There are only a few vehicles that can run a PTO( Power Take Off ) winch. As you said they run of the transver box. A manual 80 Series GXL with the thrid diff will not take one but the DX with free wheeling hubs can. 60 series and 75 series can also run a PTO.

The good thing about the PTO is that it is a multi speed winch. 5th gear for a quick rewind of the cable with very little pulling power down to first gear which is slow but will pull the bend out of a river. The other thing is that while the motor is running the winch can be used with no cool down time required.

The other winch that is not used or talked about much is the hydraulic. Runs off the power steering pump and only requires the motor to idle. Has two speeds, high for rewinding the cable and low, which is very slow, for all the pulling power. This winch will work with little or no cool down time.

The hydraulic can be fitted to any vehicle that a electric winch can be fitted as long as it has power steering .

Wayne
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FollowupID: 354644

Follow Up By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:04

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:04
Tim, most THOMAS PTO winches I have used are off the Tcase. With these you can have the Tcase in Gear of neutral. The winch in then controlled by the gears and throttle.

The argument is the same for a PTO as it is for an electric. If you are in a competition and need speed over safety or equipment...then use drive as well as the winch. But for most recreational 4wders, your equipment is expensive and precious as are the lives around you. So you are taught to let the winch control the pull.
If a cable goes slack in a pull it wont lay on the drum and you will cross the cable, do it once and the strength of the cable is compromised. The same goes for shock loading all the equipoment, mounting points and straps etc. So why would you??
Put it this way, if you were at the top of a slope winching a guy up from the bottom and he shockloaded your gear or crushed your cable by driving up....would you be impressed? I certainly wouldnt.

Opinions are like ar$eholes, everyones got one!

Matt.
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FollowupID: 354645

Reply By: glenno(bris) - Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:38

Monday, Jan 31, 2005 at 13:38
I would say winching in general is dangerous and anything you can do to minimise risk is the way i would go .
Question. What do competition guys use as a ground anchor .
AnswerID: 95834

Reply By: Mike-TS - Wednesday, Feb 02, 2005 at 23:32

Wednesday, Feb 02, 2005 at 23:32
Winch plus low gear first. You're trying to get moving. If you only use the winch then when you stop winching you stop!
AnswerID: 96367

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