Towing a Jayco Swan Camper?? Suzuki XL7

I have seen an ant with several times it's own weight but would hardly say it controlled the weight.

LMAO ... well put.. still have a tear in the eye!

Hayman Reese towbar model R1868 for the XL7 lists towing capacity at 1850kg and ball weight maximum at 140kg so the ball weight on the Swan should be OK.

Note though that with a maximum ball weight of 140kg you are efectively limited to towin about 1400kg as you should have about 10% of the towing weight on the ball to limit sway etc.

Peter

The hayman reece capacity and the registered legal capacity are not necessarily the same. The hayman reece hitch on the Bravo was labelled 110Kg, the registered ball weight was 60Kg. If you go over the registered ball weight, you void your insurance etc.

My recent experience (And I've only checked a few) is that the ball weight shown on the Hayman Reese web site is the same as shown in the manual.

Mitsubishi had a problem with NH-NJ Pajero's where the manual stated 2500kg tow with 150kg ball weight, but when oushed changed the ball weight figure to 250kg. they also supplied stickers for the manuals but they only were put in when quizzed.

So the manual is not necessarily correct either...

We have an XL-7 so I will read the manual tonight and post what it says.

Peter

PJChris, you are saying that the Hayman Reece is the same as the rating in the book, but what if the rating on the brochure is different. What if you were to purcahse the car with the information off the brochure and never looked in the book?

The XL-7 seems different. The two Pajeros I have owned (and a couple of others I've looked at) the Hayman Reese ball weight and the Owners manual ball weight were the same.

With the XL-7 the Manual states 75kg ball weight while Hayman Reese state 130 or 140 kg depending on the model (There are two or three listed for the XL-7).

I believe (And I am willing to be corrected) that ,in Victoria at least, the maximum permissible towing weight and ball weight are defined to be the weights listed in the Owners manual or , if not defined, the towing weight is a maximum of 1.5 times the vehicles unladen mass.

This is why Mitsubishi, apparently, changed the ball weight specification in NH Pajero Owners manuals from 150kg to 250kg with a sticker.

Given the XL-7 manual states that the maximum ball weight is 75kg and the recommendation is always that 10-15% of the trailer weight should be on the ball, then the XL-7 can safely tow about 750kg. And if you were to tow 1850 kg with 75kg on the ball then that is only 4% of the trailer weight and I suspect the whole rig would be very unstable.

If you never read the book, legally it would make no difference. The law makes no allowance for not knowing what the law is. You might get a lighter penalty.

I am trying to get a response from Suzuki about the XL-7 (In writing) as we own one and I want to know one way or the other.

Peter

750kg's??? That's a standard box trailer loaded with mulch. If I bought a V6 4wd that couldn't tow as much as my mother in laws cammery I'd be prettybleepoff!

75kg ball weight vs 150kg ball weight is a WILDY different rating, how the hell could someone screw up so bad. Who would be responsable if something went wrong, would you sew suzuki? Or go after Reece? Or the people who published the brochure. I guess if you were to be found guilty of over loading your vehicle because it can only take a box trailer and your towing a camper then you'd have to go after the DH's that screwed up misleading you into beliving that it could/was aloud do to it. Sound's like a lot of IF's. Sounds like I'd be steering clear of suzki's if you even plan to do some gardening around the house until they sort the sht out....

Same problem I had on the Bravo. Ball weight was only 60Kg. Even a small box trailer can exceed that when loaded!

Ok, I rang bothe the dealer where we purchased our XL-7 and Suzuki Australia today.
Dealer:
Brochure says 1850kg. Manual is different? Don't know/Don't care.
Asked about ball weight? Don't know. They said they get asked this about three times a week. Also said they don't recommend towing anything with any weight with any Suzuki. Told me to call Suzuki Australia.

Suzuki Australia:
They asked "Have you called a dealer?"
Asked about discrepency between manual and brochure. They said: Don't know. No record of ANYONE ever asking before. No news of changes to the Owners manual. Towing limit is 1850kg. They didn't know the ball weight, said they would have to request information from head Office!
Said they would get back to me in 48 hours.

Solution:

Go buy something else if you want to tow a van.

Actually Courts generally make no allowance for confusion.

It is our responsibility to know and understand the law and ignorence is no excuse.

I have not personally been involved but hearsay is that there have been cases of insurance claims rejected due to ball weight, towing weight or Gross combined mass being exceeded.

Peter

Ok PjChris, which one do the insurance companies work on then? Is it the one in the book? The one on the manfacturers brochure? The one on the tow ball sticker? Maybe there is an ADR as well, perhaps a state regulation??? How can they insist you follow the rules when they are different each place you look? Which one is the one that you have to obey, what if you obey one and are not aware there is another? I think it would be a pretty thin case.

I would also like to ad that reading the book in your car to get the maximum tow weight or reading the sticker on the back of your tow ball could be classed as understanding the law. Confusion is generally why things are taken to court. When there is no clear cut answer. Otherwise there would not be much point if your were guilty before you walked in the door.

PJ is right actually, ignorance is no excuse as a mate found out about 12 yrs ago now.

Its up to you to findout.

Which ones do Insurance companies go on, well the sarcastic part of me says "which one suits them", but in reality its the one the law states...

The prblem of course lies in cutting through all of the confusion to thhe 'truth'. When the sales brochure and the dealer and the manufacturer say one thing and the owners manual says another.
I have just got off the telephone with Vicroads and their engineers opinion is that the limits are what is recommended by the manufacturer of the vehicle, generally as expressed in the Owners manual. If the book says, then that's it.
If the book is wrong then you must get the correct limits from the manufacturer IN WRITING and carry that with you at all time when towing. Also they recommended that any change from the Owners manual must be acknowledged by your insurance company!

Jeff, with respect, people whom are clearly guilty go to court all the time. Generally seeking an acquittal through lack of evidence, or they discredit the evidence, or simply to plead for a reduced sentence/penalty. This is one of the cornerstones of our Justice System (No matter how st**fed it may be), that even a clearly guilty party has the right to tell his side of the story. After all that's what a plea of self defense is in an assault/murder case.

just my 5c (2c rounded up) worth.

Peter

Truckster,
" but in reality its the one the law states... "

Which one is that?? How are we supposed to know?

pjchris, I wonder how forthcomming suzuki would be in giving somone a refund on their vehicle when they find out that it won't legally tow the van they bought it to tow. After reading the brochure and purchasing the vehicle only to find out that it is no capable of doing the task that was described in the brochure/advertising. Perhaps someone would like to bring THIS up with their local suzuki dealer?