Removal of third row seats

Submitted: Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 14:30
ThreadID: 21493 Views:2359 Replies:14 FollowUps:5
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I have today spoken with Queensland Transport regarding this issue and their advice is that for any Queensland Registered vehicle which has had the third row of seats removed for five days or more (they regard five days as permanent) that the vehicle is considered to be modified and will require inspection and the fitment of a modification plate. This applies equally to seats which are designed for easy removal and those requiring unbolting.

So there you have it. Most travellers with roller drawers will in fact be illegal.

Obviously those in other states would be well advised to check with their authority.

Gordon
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Reply By: Member - Matt Mu (Perth-WA) - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 14:48

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 14:48
Yes pretty anal isnt it, yet I believe if someone was to approach the issue well armed you would make them look pretty silly considering todays vehicles.

The Toyota Rav 3 and 5 door models the seat are designed to be romoved at the flick of a latch, this includes second AND third row seats.

Drive that in there with the entire rear luggage compartment behind the rear seat empty (panelvan style) and it passed ARDs, you didnt modify it, its in the handbook.

You also have to watch out when dealing with QT, they will tell you something different every time you ring/talk to them. Such is the state of their rules, so open to interpretation, it depends on the inspector on the day!

They cannot make you change the registered seating capacity of your vehicle by following the makers handbook, or else the vehicle is unroadworthy from the start!!

If all else fails, a quick email to Today Tonight etc for a bit of media attention, they love a good 'bag the Govt agency' story

Matt.
AnswerID: 103722

Reply By: Kazza055 - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 15:37

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 15:37
Now that would be something to see on TV. A current affairs show doing a story with a 4WD owner being on the right side.

I don't think I will hold my breath on this one.

Bob Cheers
AnswerID: 103727

Reply By: flappa - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 15:46

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 15:46
This has actually been discussed a few times.

It becomes more apparent when Cargo Barriers are fitted.

Because you cant use the thrid row with these in place , it is no longer a 7 seat vehicle.

My enquiries with the different state RTA's , were QLD most DEFINENTLY wanted the vehicle to have its ADR changed (no mention of days etc)

Both ACT and NSW didn't care (actually though it was a stupid idea).

VIC , it depended on who you talked to , but generally , it was similar. If they are being taken out for extended periods, and or Cargo barrier fitted, needed to be fixed.
AnswerID: 103729

Reply By: Member - Beatit (QLD) - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 15:51

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 15:51
G'day Gordon,

Did they say how they would handle a regular in and out ? Surely, I'm not the only one taking the seats out and replacing them on a regular basis for longer than 5 days!

5 days aint permanent, typically government decision making - on that basis I must be retired I was home for longer than 5 days not so long ago, or maybe if I was sick for longer than 5 days they will pay me sickness benefits for the rest of my life.

Pretty dumb hey!

Kind regards
AnswerID: 103730

Reply By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:02

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:02
Boy I'm in the poop - I've taken out all the seats except the two in the front !
Willie
AnswerID: 103733

Reply By: Footloose - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:03

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:03
Typical biro crats !
AnswerID: 103734

Reply By: paulpp - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:10

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:10
Greetings all

We are dealing with National Traffic Regulations and the Australian Design Rules (ADR's).

Once again the states cannot agree and people who are supposed to serve the public give multiple interpretations.

I have sought clarification from both the state and federal transport ministers in relation to this issue. I await their replies.

I would encourage others to do the same and seek the reply in hard copy under ministerial letter head.

Regards

Paul
AnswerID: 103737

Reply By: Member - Ed. C.- Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:15

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:15
So where do I stand???

Mine is a (purchased new in '99) GU ST complianced as a 7-seater... (& I've removed the 3rd row seats)...
However, it appears that the dealer registered the vehicle as a DX (5-seater)...
I didn't notice this until I received the rego. papers in the mail, & when I pointed out the error to the dealers, they said they'd get it changed... From memory, I think I also contacted the transport dept. (by 'phone), & they said they'd fix it.....
Forgot about it until the 2nd yr. renewal notice arrived, & I see that it's still registered as a 5-seater... Didn't bother me by this time, as I'd removed the 3rd row seats anyway, so I just thought "no big deal"....

Now this cr@p crops up!!!

I ain't gunna worry about it, & if ever I'm "challenged by the authorities" on this issue, I'll just show 'em the rego. certificate....

Waddya reckon????

Confucius say.....
"He who lie underneath automobile with tool in hand,
....Not necessarily mechanic!!"

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Follow Up By: flappa - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:20

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:20
Its not really the rego papers where the issue is.

(I dont recall seeing , seating capacity on mine in the ACT anyway ? )

Its the compliance plate on the vehicle.

Its stamped as a 7 seater , so , when its not , it needs to be changed.
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Follow Up By: Member - Ed. C.- Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:36

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:36
G'day flappa,
In Q'ld., seating capacity is stated on the rego. cert., & on mine it clearly states "seats 5"....
As I said, I'm not gunna lose sleep over it, but it'll be interesting to see where this might lead if ever a "challenge" is issued....

Regards, Ed. C.
Confucius say.....
"He who lie underneath automobile with tool in hand,
....Not necessarily mechanic!!"

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Follow Up By: flappa - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:45

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 16:45
Thats fine. I wasnt aware of that , but , as I said the thing to remember is , its really the Compliance plate that is the big thing.

When I spoke to QLD about it , their answer was that each and everytime to change the seating config , it needs to be ENGINEERED , and the compliance plate changed.

Going from what you are saying , it sounds like the Rego papers ALSO need changing.

AFAIK , NSW, ACT, and VIC , dont list seating on their Rego papers (happy to be corrected). It certainly wasn't mentioned when I spoke to the Depts.

At the end of the Day , its certainly something that NEEDS to be checked and clarified.
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Reply By: Brian B (QLD) - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 18:02

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 18:02
Hi Everyone,

QLD Transport can be extremely difficult to deal with.

My son has an FJ40 soft top and when it was new it was built with a bench seat able to seat 3 adults.

As part of his build up, the bench seat went out and 2 buckets went in. These had to be installed to Australian Design Rule specs and had to have a modification plate. So did his roll bar and his seat belt installation.

When we took it to QLD Transport for his rego inspection, they didn't even notice the roll bar or seat belts but certainly noticed the seats as we had reduced the seating capacity of the car. The mod plate allowed this to be passed but it was a huge expensive process.

The funny part about the whole thing is that they weren't even going to inspect the vehicle until their computer crapped out midway through the registration process, so they had to go out and visually inspect the chassis number on the vehicle.

They are a difficult bunch to deal with and they are never consistent with the application of the rules.

Cheers

Brian
AnswerID: 103746

Reply By: Peter 2 - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 19:49

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 19:49
You should try registering a 4wd which was never sold here and isn't built in RHD !
Peter
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Reply By: Willem - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 20:13

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 20:13
We used to say 'Only in the USA' but now we can say 'Only in Queensland'

Yes, Queensland Transport can be difficult and inconsistent. Have registered a few cars there over a period of time.

I wouldn't worry about interstate travellers going through Qld with an uncomplied vehicle. So too Queensland residents.

The best way to counter these sorts of orders is to hire a lawyer for a short while to write a letter on your behalf. QT will most likely back down very quickly.
AnswerID: 103768

Reply By: Member - Jeff M (WA) - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 20:25

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 20:25
Ah they can all go and get stuffed. Sounds like bollocks to me. I bought a Daihatsi Feroza from a holden dealer (second hand of course) and it only had two seats in it. That's how it was purcahsed. The rego said it was a 4 seater.
So anyway, I just went and put seatbelts and seats in it myself, happy days they can ram it up their pipe holes, I got to much living to do in this world to worry about this kind of CRAP.

And yeah yeah yeah, you can't do that, you can't do this, and ohhhhhh what about insurance. Bloody hell, I really don't give a flyingbleepany more. It's just getting too hard to live life the way you want to without breaking any laws. So stuff them all. I'll do whatever the hell I like.
AnswerID: 103769

Follow Up By: V8Diesel - Friday, Mar 25, 2005 at 03:53

Friday, Mar 25, 2005 at 03:53
I couldn't agree more with you Jeff, well said.

After a lot of thinking about the anxiety of modern day living and the ever increasing nanny state mentality, I made a conscious and informed decision last year to simply ignore all idiotic rules and regulations and just do whatever I f*&#ing feel like too. I know what's right and wrong, safe and stupid - and I don't need some pencil necked poindexter telling me.

Feel much better now :-)

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FollowupID: 361311

Follow Up By: Joe - Friday, Mar 25, 2005 at 10:58

Friday, Mar 25, 2005 at 10:58
Hi Guy's,
I'm with you Jeff and Diesel,
Yes I agree, these small minded people are a vexation to the spirit if you play their game.
I have taken all my seats out of my 120 Prado...so I'm reading these posts and starting to take it in....finally got to point where I said ...no...I'm not buying into this...the seats stay out permanently as planned.
So I have gone from reg 8 seater to a 2 seater and that's the way I want it...bugger the red tape.
Regards
Joe
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FollowupID: 361320

Reply By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 22:00

Thursday, Mar 24, 2005 at 22:00
Yeah but you did say Queensland!!!! Not even part of OZ!!! LOL.
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Reply By: Mike - Saturday, Mar 26, 2005 at 19:43

Saturday, Mar 26, 2005 at 19:43
GLAD I Live in Western Australia!!
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