Auxillary Batteries

Submitted: Saturday, Sep 17, 2005 at 23:31
ThreadID: 26541 Views:10809 Replies:7 FollowUps:3
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Last year I got talked into buying an Exide Extreme N70EX to run my Liemack fridge in my toyota Hilux (86) and to act as a back up starting battery. I have also installed a Redark solenoid. On my trip away I had trouble keeping it charged. The regulator fell apart on bumpy outback roads which didn't help and probably flattened the battery too much. I replaced the regulator in Birdsville but the battery didn't improve a lot. I had it load tested when I got back and there is nothing wrong with it. I was told by the battery bloke that the exide is a calcium battery and designed for cold climates in the northern hemisphere and could not be successfully charged using the vehicles alternator and that I should get a deep cycle battery instead because they would supply 12v until almost flat and charge at least to 80%. This year before I went away I got a Century N70T deep cycle battery and took a generator along as well. The battery lasted about three days before the fridge switched itself off. I then had to run the generator hours every day to get some charge into the battery. Has anyone had experience with either of these batteries? (Pros and cons). Can the exide and the century batteries be used in parallel? How successful are solar systems? I tend to say in the same place without much driving for days at a time.
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Reply By: Member - Blue (VIC) - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 00:15

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 00:15
I think you need someone with good knowledge of electronics to check your dual batt setup. I would be happy to accept that the battery was at fault once but twice is a bit hard to swallow. I would say that if your fridge killed the battery in 3 days, the battery was getting little or no top up from the vehicle.
AnswerID: 130621

Reply By: Mainey (WA) - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 01:01

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 01:01
read the new redarc website and you see they recomend the same batteries be used with their solenoid... I had a solenoid and it was not keeping the power into the DC battery, so changed to an Electronic isolator. was also using the Liemack fridge and when I changed isolators I had no battery problems again. I presently use calcium Delkor batteries without problems.
AnswerID: 130626

Reply By: drivesafe - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:40

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:40
Hi richor, you have supplied some details of how you use your set up but to get a better idea of what might be the cause of your problem you need to post things like how much current your fidge is using and so.

From what you have posted, I would take a guess and say that the problem is a simple one of not enough stored power in the first place.

Both batteries, when fully charged, are probably good to power your gear for around 24 to 36 hours before the battery is in need of a full recharge.

One suggestion to get around your problem would be to fit another battery but remember this will still only increase your operating time by about the same time that your existing battery is operating at present.

The advantage of adding an extra battery is that it will take about the same time, while driving, to charge two batteries as it takes to charge one.

One more point, depending on the condition of your vehicles charging system and the amount of time you drive, there should be no reason why you can’t charge either of those batteries to at least 95% charge.

Cheers and hope this is of some help.
AnswerID: 130633

Follow Up By: richor - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 14:05

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 14:05
Thanks for your helpful replies.

The Liemack fridge _Affordable_Storage_Drawers.aspx about 8 amps when running and would run about 10 times during the day and once or twice at night. It would use about 24 Ah a day.

The batteries were fully charged at the start of the trip. Last year we did a lot of driving and as I mentioned, the regulator wasn't working well and after we replaced it, things improved.

This year we stayed in the same place for a couple of weeks without much driving. The Century deep cycle lasted over 48 hours before the fridge switched off which means it probably had less than 40% capacity left.

We should have put the generator on it sooner because even if it was putting out 10A as specified, it would still take 5 hours to charge even without the load of the fridge. I am sure that we never got a decent charge into it except on the long trip home.

I have used 8mm2 cable from the solenoid to the aux battery and the voltage drop is about 0.01v.

Since I got home I have set up an 80w solar panel through a regulator hooked up to the century battery with the fridge plugged in. It may not have quite enough output to replace that used by the fridge but it should go close.

One last question:- even though it is not ideal, many people seem to successfully run their starter battery and their aux battery in parallel via the solenoid so can I have the exide and century batteries connected as a bank running in parallel with the starter battery via the solenoid?
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Follow Up By: drivesafe - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 17:07

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 17:07
Hi richor, first off, if you just have the solar panel fix in one position then your average hourly current output is only going to be around 1 to 1.5 amps which is not going to be enough to charge and maintain the battery and run the fridge.

As for using you main battery as additional power when stopped, there is no reason for not using it as long as you don’t let it get below 12 volts as this is the point beyond which it will becomes a problem to start your vehicle.

The cable size is fine providing it is not to far from the main battery to the auxiliary battery and that you have run both a positive and the negative cable.

As far as the charge time from the generator goes, there are some many factors that come into what is needed that you are just going to have to hope you get enough of a charge each time you use the generator.

Cheers.
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Reply By: Peter McGuckian (Member) - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 13:42

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 13:42
Try getting the exide stirred up by charging with a high capacity - say 210amp plus charge till full then try again. should easily last 36hours or so. i now use a delkor for my no2 battery and it works fine. i gave deep cycles away long time ago for this type of use.

Peter
AnswerID: 130665

Reply By: ACDC - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 19:31

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 19:31
Exide extremes are not calcium batteries.
Normally these batteries perform great,should of been ok with your liemack.
Deep cycle are not recommended for liemack's they don't provide enough start current.
I think also your liemack uses about 35-40ah per 24 hrs.
AnswerID: 130707

Reply By: Mike DiD - Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 20:15

Sunday, Sep 18, 2005 at 20:15
"One last question:- even though it is not ideal, many people seem to successfully run their starter battery and their aux battery in parallel via the solenoid so can I have the exide and century batteries connected as a bank running in parallel with the starter battery via the solenoid? "
- no matter which brand you buy, every isolator just charges the Auxiliary by connecting it directly to the Alternator - they don't provide any extra voltage. There are some exotic schemes for disconnecting the Main Battery to help charge the Auxiliary - but this is pointless - if you need this you just have insufficient charging capacity for your loads - it's like putting a bandaid on Skin Cancer. The only time this will help charge the Auxiliary is if your Alternator has such low output that charging the Main pulls the voltage below normal.
If the Alternator Voltage is sufficient to charge each of your batteries by them selves, then it will charge the batteries together, but obviously more slowly.
If your Main Battery has only been used to start the car, then it will charge fully in 5 minutes.

An N70 size battery may be close to 100 AmpHour and if you are using a 10 Amp Charger it will take AT LEAST 12 hours to charge the battery (have you checked that it really puts out 10 Amps into a battery).

To see whats going on you really need to connect a Voltmeter DIRECTLY to the terminals on the Aux battery. Here is one for $35.
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=XC0118
AnswerID: 130709

Follow Up By: richor - Monday, Sep 19, 2005 at 21:41

Monday, Sep 19, 2005 at 21:41
It is a bit difficult trying to explain everything in this forum and I have missed out telling vital information but the answers have been great. Thanks for that.

I am pretty sure the generator didn't put out 10A. I spent too much time measuring voltages of the main and auxillary batteries but didn't measure the I from the generator. Its o/c voltage was about 30v but only about 13v connected to the battery. It definitely struggled.

I guess I am trying to do too much with not enough. Weekend trips don't cause any trouble but 2 - 3 weeks on the side of a river do.

I now have to look at other options for long term stays.

And he sees the vision splendid of the sunlit plains extended, And at night the wondrous glory of the everlasting stars. Clancy of the Overflow.

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Reply By: Mike DiD - Monday, Sep 19, 2005 at 22:00

Monday, Sep 19, 2005 at 22:00
"Its o/c voltage was about 30v but only about 13v connected to the battery. It definitely struggled."

If the charger can't bring a flat battery up to 14.4 volt within 24 hours then it just doesn't have enough current capacity.
AnswerID: 130929

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