Gen set versus Solar

Submitted: Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 22:56
ThreadID: 31228 Views:2615 Replies:14 FollowUps:26
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This should bring the locals out of there homes. The question is, 80watt solar panel to charge 150amphour deep cycle batterry bank , or genset with battery charger. Hyperthetically(check the oxford on that one!)could be running a waeco fridge, lights,Mini lcd tv ect ect. Useing approx. 40 amp per day.
I know the go with Gen sets and the noise factor. Some of the 950 watt GS. on ebay state 57Db at 7m. How loud is that. I have no idea. And solar is so exy, but great concept. Any thoughts out there.
Cheers
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Reply By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:13

Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:13
Mate, this topic has been done to death in the past. You'll find there are those that swear by solar and others (like me) who prefer the gen set direction.
My decision was based on the fact that I don't often need to top my batteries up whilst on a trip as we tend to not stay in one camp site for more than 2 or 3 days, so flat batts are usually not a problem.
However, when those occasions do crop up (and that includes extremely hot weather when fridges will take their toll on batteries within a day), it is easier to run the gen set for a few hours to bring the batts back up. I run a Fullriver 120a/h gel batt in the Patrol which looks after the 40 litre Engel and also have 2 x 105a/h Super Charge SLAs in the camper trailer to run the 80 litre upright Engel, water pump, lights etc. I also have 2 x 15amp 3 stage charges; one in Patrol and one in camper trailer. I fire up the Yamaha and the 2 chargers go into action on the batteries as well as taking over the direct running of the 2 fridges.
The other thing, in my particular circumstances is that the gennie plus a 10 litre jerry can of petrol is actually easier to find a place for in the CT than what a large, bulky solar panel would be. The solar also really needs to be "on" all day and needs to be moved to follow the sun. Thsi means you need to stay at/near camp all day. With genie, I leave it locked away and only usually start it up late afternoon for a couple of hours and turn off by say 8pm. Also must be very conscious of others camped nearby.
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Follow Up By: Wok - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 07:11

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 07:11
Roachie,

Which Supercharge are you using? Looking @ 2 of the Gold MF31? Series 12 [200Ah RC 920A CCA $170]. Have you had them long enough for an opinion?
I saw these @ a marine place, "normal" battery places don't seem to stock them.[For that matter haven't read experiences on the brand either!]

Thanks...eng

Apologies for hijack......:)
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Follow Up By: Darian (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 08:55

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 08:55
Agree with your "bush power philosophy" WR - bought my little blue devil (the EF1000iS) the other day - off show special - so compact and easy to use ! Seems the oil is the same as Briggs and S 4 stroke but might get a litre of the Yam product - at 300ml a change, it may last awhile !
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Reply By: Truckster (Vic) - Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:13

Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:13
I say get a genny or 3 and rip the mufflers off so you make friends around the bush.
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Follow Up By: Muzzgit (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:55

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:55
You keep going on about this Truckster but I find the people who are inconsiderate live on both sides. I have been camping and met people with solar panels who are rude drunks with foul mouths and extremely badly behaved children, so should I assume you are all the same????

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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 00:14

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 00:14
damn right, I cant wait to get 3 gennys and pay back some of the pricks.

I even thought about buying a couple just to keep in the car, for the @ssholes that play music flat out until 5am, then they expect u to keep quiet for them to sleep till 12.. then fire up the gennys! Payback is sweet
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Reply By: geocacher (djcache) - Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:15

Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:15
While people are thinking about it could they consider this?

I've been loaned a 60W panel (fold away style) for a trip. It just has two 30W panels hinged together and the leads off the back go to croc clips.

I had it out this arvo and hooked it up to a 12v 40Ah gel cell.

I recorded readings of

V (under load of battery) = 16.02 - 16.05v
Amps delivered = 2.1 - 2.5A

To me that's over charging. Monitored closely you could get away with it for a while, and on the next trip the battery will simultaneously have a fridge drawing similar current off the battery so voltage may drop off under load - and the battery it will be charging is an N70ZZ (12" starting battery).

Even with small panels how necessary is it to run a regulator?

I'm new to solar and will eventually set up the camper with a solar setup but for now I'm just looking and learning.

Dave
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Follow Up By: Mainey (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 00:37

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 00:37
Dave, most larger panels put out about 17v plus, that's the reason a regulator is used, however I used a 80 wt panel for about six years without a regulator but the fridge and all accessories run direct off the solar lead to the 120 a/h DC battery (made in usa), which only lasted about 3 or 4 years :-((
When you start looking at Solar 'invest' in quality products!!

Look at a regulator that shows the actual voltage and also amps via a LCD screen, it's so much easier to aim the panel/s at the peak performance angle to get the most performance from your panel when you see the amps increase or decrease because of the panel angel.
Storage battery idealy should be an AGM Deep Cycle, because they charge quicker and last longer.

I'm still learning - after living with solar since 1996 :-)
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Follow Up By: geocacher (djcache) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:03

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:03
Hi Mainey,

Thanks for that.

I'll be looking around at setups for a while. Circumstances dictate the budget at present and like most I don't have a lazy 2k lying around.

Good point about the controller and a screen. The aux is a starter because I was concerned about linking a deep cycle and starter together for winching but I've since been informed that a DC will survive that okay if only done occassionally. I'm contemplating mounting the panels on the camper roof which will dictate their performance but it's so much easier than a portable. Often though that will dictate the position of the camper being in the sun so that may require a rethink.

The starter was also cheaper and fitted the budget at the time while generally doing the job as a stop gap for a while.

Dave

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Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:24

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:24
You don't need an AUTOMATIC Regulator if

1. You have less charging ability than your daily use. e.g. if you are using 40 amp hours a day, and your panels put out only 2 amps, Then you would need 22 hours a day of charging to overcharge your batteries.

2. If you are going to manually monitor battery voltage and disconnect the panels when the battery voltage reaches 14.5 volts (that's all the Automatic regulator does)

Mike
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Follow Up By: geocacher (djcache) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:40

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:40
Ok. It's a long time ago now but when I was building maintenance chargers at Holden we sensed the current and when the charging current dropped below 100mAh we dropped the voltage to float.

My understanding at the time was that a lead acid charges on fixed voltage values and the current varies according to the batterys state of charge.

Unlike nicads which charge on fixed current and you detect voltages to determine charge state.

My battery today was still taking 2 amps charge current but that may have been due to the 16 volts being applied. At a lower voltage it may have indicated it was charged.

I sort of understand the reasoning but I'm still of a mind that applying 16v to a LA battery is overcharging it. Of course if I'd disconnected it like you suggest it'd not be charging it at all.... maybe I just answered my own question.

The panel wasn't on that battery very long though, and that battery had run lights up the river for 2 nights a few weeks ago and sat idle since our return. It should have needed charging - and 15mins at 2 amps wasn't going to have filled it up.

Nope. Still confused.

I know a few have been posted before but has anyone got any good solar links (written by people qualified to write them) that they care to throw in at this point? Might save someone some typing.

Thanks

Dave

Dave
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Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:52

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:52
A 3-stage charger -

1. Applies constant current (C/4) until the cyclic voltage (14.4) is reached.

2. Holds the Cyclic voltage until reaches C/40 and changes to the float voltage (13.6)

3. Changes back to Cyclic Voltage if currnet exceeds C/40.

Switching charging manually when battery reaches 14.4 is crude, but gives you 80% charge.

Mike
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Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:56

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:56
Should read -

2. Holds the Cyclic voltage until the current falls to C/40 and changes to the float voltage (13.6).

Where C is battery Capacity e.g for an 80 amphour battery C/4 is 20 amps and C/40 is 2 amps.

These voltages will vary by battery type and should be on the battery or in the manufacturers data sheet. They will vary with battery temperature.

Mike
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Follow Up By: Mainey (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 14:00

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 14:00
Dave, I don't believe you can realisticly "rely" on getting approx 40 amp per day from an 80wt solar panel in "normal" use, maybe having it sit in the sun and changing it often to actually follow the sun, but not fixed to the roof of a van as mine is.

I'm going to up-grade my 9 year old 80wt solar system and probably even the batteries before I join the Grey Nomads for the winter, to ~200wt with the addition of another 120 or 123 wts panel and probably also a new 180 a/h DC AGM battery, ~14 hundred max.
(90a/h Deep Cycle AGM's @ <200)
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Reply By: Member - Jeff H (QLD) - Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:21

Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:21
Freezer,
the maggots are beginning to swarm.
We run a 50L Waeco off a 123w Sharp panel.Panel cost was $970, and I spent about the same again with controller,leads, Al section for roof mount.
So far - Brilliant, But so far in hot (but cloud free ) N Aust.
We leave for Tassie in 2 days . Maybe different.
A major "un needed" is petrol in jerrycans in the back.
It may be different if your rig uses petrol.

Hard question - best wishes.
Jeff H.
AnswerID: 157418

Reply By: Member - Norm C (QLD) - Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:24

Monday, Feb 27, 2006 at 23:24
Freezer, I've got a gennie (Kipor 1KVA) and no solar panels, so what am I going to say??

Reason though is tha gennie charges faster than solar, I can govern when it is used (not the sun) and with my set up it is easier to carry. Also the 3 stage charger I use with the gennie also gets used when I have access to 240V.

In my view, if you are a 'camper' rather than a 'traveller', solar might be the go. Otherwise, go the gennie but be considerate of others.
AnswerID: 157419

Follow Up By: geocacher (djcache) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:08

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:08
Hi Norm,

Is that Kipor a yellow one with sinemaster on it? If so are you happy with it?

I've been offered one that's done about 30 mins work from a mate who's upgrading to a 2 kVa for his Oka. He wants about $700 for it and would wait a little while I suppose so it's an option. Something else to pack though and I'd have to carry petrol as I drive a diesel.

And I don't generally like generators. No judgement on anyone else just a personal preference. Can't argue with the dollar comparison though. If I don't buy it he'll have it at the Yarra Glen Swap Meet on Sunday - look for the Landy 101 camper for sale.

Dave
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Follow Up By: Member - Norm C (QLD) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 11:16

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 11:16
That's the one Dave. You can get them for a bit over $800 new if yo look around. I drive a diesel too, but carry one gerry of ULP, which lasts forever. If space is an issue, a 10L gerry would probably be heaps.

I'm not a big gennie fan normally, but I dislike no power and warm beer even more.

My Kipor has been good. Very quiet and starts every time, but it hasn't had a lot of use yet.
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Reply By: V8 Troopie - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:04

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:04
Freezer, in my humble opinion its not an 'or' question. To cover yourself for all eventualities you should consider having BOTH.
There will be times when you are glad you do have both.
For a longer stay it is my opinion that 80W of solar is not sufficient to supply 40 Ah*/day (this IS the correct term) to your toys AND keep your battery fully charged.

* Just to be nitpicking, Ah (Amphours) is a battery capacity term, you drain that much, you have to replace that PLUS losses to keep the battery full.
40Ah can be 40Amp for one hour or 4 Amp for 10 hours if you get my drift. Though you'll need a mighty BIG battery to supply 40A or accept a 40A charge continuously for one hour ;-)

Klaus
AnswerID: 157433

Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:45

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:45
I agree, Solar Panels are expensive ballast if it's cloudy for 4 days.

But for practical reasons, so far I only have a 1kVA Kipor charging an 80amphour Remco AGM using 24 amp 3-stage Chargers. I also have a 1.5kVA (120amp) Alternator in the vehicle as a backup.

I will buy a Solar Panel when I find a good bargain.

A long 240 volt Extension lead is a cheap way to be able to position a quiet generator where it will have minimal impact on people (like me) who enjoy the peace and quiet of the bush.

Mike
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Follow Up By: Mainey (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 14:56

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 14:56
Mike, what brand/type of panel would you choose
->if price was not an issue?
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Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 16:01

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 16:01
I've been considering the Bi-facial Panels on eBay - but I would like more info before spending $700.

In singke-sided, the Kyocera seem to have good reputation.
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Follow Up By: Mainey (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 17:49

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 17:49
Mike, I contacted the distributors of the Bifacial panels and was advised outright they won't work to their full capacity when not used as specified, and as mine stay on the roof generally 24/7 they are out of the equasion.

So now the choice (for my own needs) is between the Kyocera and the Sharp as they both come in the required 120/123 watt size, @ 7.1+ amps and similar price, to me:-)

Sharp have heat and shade tolerances that are better than the 'chinese' and even BP panels.
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Reply By: Member - Jeff H (QLD) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:13

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:13
Gennie/solar?
We try to hide, but have struck 'after dark' buddies with clapped out gennie mufflers on 3 occassions, the last being a 'muso' group in a bus,all watching TV as the moon (sorry, that should read Full, Brilliant Moon rising over---)
Same trip, different place. We arrived late, sussed the place out, went away to gather wood for the night.
Came back, and the Old Fart (ahem)apologised for running the gennie.(Had to finish baking the bread, as I recall). He was maybe 2 cricket pitches distant from us. We never noticed it ---
Individual cirmstances, and enjoy.
Jeff H.
AnswerID: 157434

Reply By: Member - Alan (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:56

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 01:56
In 4wdmonthly recently, I saw an ad/article for a battery charger - that was based (from memory) on a Honda gernator motor - but designed purely to charge batteries.

The article suggested that it does this in a fraction of the time that a generator will do it.

This interested me as everything we use when we are camping uses 12v - don't really need a generator - jut a charged 12v supply.

I hope this makes sense - can't remember the brand.

Has anyhone any experience with something along these lines?

Alan
AnswerID: 157438

Follow Up By: Member - Alan (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 03:12

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 03:12
I found the name of the firm promoting the product. It was Christie Engineering - see www.christieengineering.com.au/2.5hp.htm

Any feedback appreciated.

Alan
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Follow Up By: FREEZER - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 06:55

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 06:55
just checked out honda charger you spoke about. Looks the goods, only a noisy little bugger 75db @ 7m max. doesnt mention a price.
Freezer
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Follow Up By: dags666 - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 17:54

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 17:54
Allan ive owned a Honda battery charger for 3 years now and it’s brilliant. we go away camping for 3 to 4 weeks up the beach and we use it to charge a bank of batteries, we run a spear light 110 lt waeco and a pump that runs a hot water system mate never had a problem charge for 1 hour in the morn and some times at night all depends on how hot it gets and how much the fridge uses. Looking at buying solar but the same as everyone, don’t understand why it’s so dear when they wont you to use the stuff. Dags
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Reply By: hl - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 07:49

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 07:49
If your Gel cell reads 16 Volts with 2 amps going into it, it's probably on the way out (especially if it wasn't full, as you said).
A 60 Watt panel would be useful to extend the time before you need to start the engine, but it will not be able to keep up running the fridge all the time (maybe it will if it's very sunny and you spend all your time carefully the aiming the panel all day).
You don't need a regulator with this setup as you will not be able to overcharge the battery.
Cheers
(Gil appreciates confidentiality)
AnswerID: 157457

Reply By: Member - Nutter (QLD) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 09:46

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 09:46
Hi Freezer, just thought I would pass on a bit of what I have learned from practical experience. We went away to central Qld at Xmas, it was 35-42C most of the time during the day,not much cooler at night. We are running explorer 70 lt fridge & freezer , couple of fluro camp lights of a 90 AH AGM aux battery that is managed by a rotronics duel battery system, also have hooked a digital volt gauge on the aux battery to help monitor battery. We were using a Christie / honda battery charger , IMO they are very loud, found we had to run this for 2-3 hours per day.We were camped so the vehicle was not being driven. We have since put a 3 stage 20 amp smart charger in (cost including wiring etc $330), permently wired in the vehicle & run a cheap GMC 750 watt generator cost $98 (from Bunnings) don't know if we got a rare one or what but it is very quiet, I compared it side by side with a mates EU 1 Honda and it's may just be a little louder. I was told before buying the smart charger that there would be no warranty if I was using a generator, I have taken that risk, the specs on the charger however say voltage range can be from 170-270 volt ac. quite tolerant I thought. I have had the gennie checked while running the charger when it is at max charge , voltage varies from 220-240 volts. The advise I was given & have adhered to was start gennie first then switch on the charger to avoid large voltage spikes. I run the charger through a surge protected power board. We went away at the end of January, conditions not as hot as xmas, found running the gennie using a 15 meter HD extension lead for about 3 hours during the day was ample to recharge aux battery, I shut the gennie off once the charger indicates float charge. I wanted to go the solar option however cost was the major limiting factor for us. The fridge stays in the back of the ute most of the time so I just plug the charger in when I get home each night.
I am not making any sugestions here just passing on what I have found works for me, no doubt I will learn via this forum some or all of what I am doing is incorrect, but I know in practise it works. Hope this is of some help.
Regards
Nutter
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Follow Up By: FREEZER - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 11:08

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 11:08
Nutter

Thanks for your reply. Very interesting indeed, as the way you have set yourself up is an option i have been thinking about. Great to hear other peoples experiences, nothing like learning from experience.. or someone elses.
do you find people camping around you tolerate the noise or is it not that bad
Freezer
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Follow Up By: Member - Nutter (QLD) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 17:08

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 17:08
Because of the noise level of the Christie charger, I approached all (3 separate groups) whom would be affected , and was given the OK to use it , we were in a remote area and refrigeration was vital, if it was going to cause a problem I would have had to go for a drive each day, bit of an inconvienence, however I would do that if it was going to cause any problems. At the end of the xmas hols I decided we needed something that was less noisey & the gennie fitted the bill nicely. On our first outing using the gennie I again checked before starting up,no problems(I run it during the middle part of the day when most poeple are active and less likely to be sleeping) on that 15 meter lead with a slight breeze you can just hear it , I walked towards the camp sites either side of us and it could not be heard , closest camp site was about 50-60 feet away south of us , the gennie was on the north side in a slight hollow. We are very pleased with the whole set up, not sure on fuel consumption as yet, after running for 3 hours it takes about 1.5 -2 litres to refill, the tank is 4.2 litres. We went away for 4 days I run the gennie on two of those days for 3 ish hours each time , started with a full tank & 5 litres, came home with a full tank & about 1.5 litres, it is a 2 stroke gennie. Again just some more info, hope it is of help.

Regards,
Nutter
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Reply By: Atropos - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 11:44

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 11:44
I use a little 800 w Austec Generator , but I take about 200mtrs of extention leads so I can make sure its well away from everyone , I also erect one of thse beach shade tents (shade shelters) over the genny to keep any rain or junk off it. and dont forget to use a ground spike (Earth)

Its a question of doing the right thing, if you make sure that what you do does not bother others, then using a genny is fine

AnswerID: 157496

Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 22:27

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 22:27
I assume you use an Earth Leakage Circuit Breaker to make the Earth Spike fully effective.

Mike
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Follow Up By: Atropos - Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 08:10

Wednesday, Mar 01, 2006 at 08:10
Inline type on first section of extention lead.. good for when using power tools in the garden at home.
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Reply By: Member - Collyn R (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 16:29

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 16:29
Within reason and with the odd exception the charging voltage is not important. What is - is the effect of that charging voltage - and that effect is the charging current that results and also the temperature of the battery.

For a deep-cycle battery charging current should not exceed 20-25% of the battery capacity - thus a nominally 100 Ah deep cycle battery should not be charged at much over 20-25 amps. No matter the charging rate however, the electrolyte should not exceed 50 degrees C (this is often hard/impossible to measure but case temperature is close enough.

On excepotion is where a battery is heavily suphated. This results in high internal resistance and then charging voltage will (even with a flat battery) show as high (but 16 volts is exceptionally so) and charging current as low.

It is correct that, with constant voltage charging, as charge increases and voltage thus rises, charge current falls.

It is for this reason that deep cycle will only accept a heavy charge until about 50-55% charged. From there on charge rate is likely to fall to ony a few amps and to virtually cease by not much over 70% charge.

An 80 watt solar module is unlikely to produce anything like 40 Ah/day.

Such a module produces 4.6 amps (it says so on its back).

At the typical summer 5-6 Peak Sun Hours for much of Oz that's 23-27 Ah/day max. A safer assumption is 18-20 Ah/day. If you assume 40 Ah/day you'll need to acquire a taste for warm beer!
Collyn Rivers

AnswerID: 157558

Follow Up By: FREEZER - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 20:15

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 20:15
so how would a generator with a battery charger go.

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Reply By: Alloy c/t - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 18:38

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 18:38
Freezer , how cold do you want your beer , from personal experience 1x 80watt panel will NOT supply enough "grunt" for a better term to run your waeco ect ect ,,no way will you get 40amps [you would have to be up at sparrow fart and costantly move the panel every degree as the sun moves untill sunset ] .Sugest you redo your sums as per power required per 24hr period . We run a 120watt Kycera +a 64 watt unisolar for a total of 11.8 amps per hr in "perfect" conditions ,that gives 70/75 amps perday in peak hrs ,,our 80lt Waeco uses 64amps per 24hrs [on average], throw in the odd light ect ect means no real surplus ,, overcast day/s rain ect ,out comes the genny [2 stroke 950watt Scorpion 53db ] if allowed and if not the cruiser set at 1500revs soon makes up the shortfall.
AnswerID: 157588

Follow Up By: Member - Collyn R (WA) - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:04

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:04
Freezer - fine but noisy unless you use a Honda or Yamaha type inverter/generator.
Far prefer solar but one needs to be realistic if used with 4WD and camper trailer.

My Nissan Patrol's 60-litre Engel runs happily from two by 80-watt Sharp modules on the roof of the Nissan. It has provision for running from the alternator but that is rarely needed - even in Broome.

Alloy C/T - even with the ideal conditions you suggest that 80-watt module would still not put out 40 amps. The output from your own modules is almost exactly as expected.

Solar module output can be calculated for anywhere in the world with surprising accuracy if averaged over a few days.

I will happily supply the numbers if you give me nearest major town in Oz of NZ - and latitude and longitude anywhere else. Also time of year.
Collyn Rivers
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Reply By: Gu_Patrol - Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:41

Tuesday, Feb 28, 2006 at 21:41
Another trick you could try is dig a hole about 1to 2 foot deeo and place the genny inside it, apparetly it will half the noise, so a friend told me. I know who wants to dig a hole that deep, it's bad enough to dig a hole for your ka ka. :-)
AnswerID: 157645

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