Digital cameras

Submitted: Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 04:16
ThreadID: 36255 Views:3324 Replies:20 FollowUps:25
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Gday,
what should i be looking for in a digital camera? I've only ever taken happy snaps with a cheap one but i want a good one for our around Oz trip next year. I do have a budget of around $5-600 as the fourby also needs things.

Is an optical zoom more imprtant than megapixels?
Would a $500 camera be any good or do you need to spend more for a good one?
What speed would you need to be practical and not slow?
What qualities make a good camera for close ups and scenery?

Thanks

Barnesy
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Reply By: Steve & Mish - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 04:43

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 04:43
go for a canon, ixus 60 in an excellent choice if you don't want to fiddle with f-stop and aperture settings. If you want more manual control then something in canon's powershot range.......also couldn’t go wrong with a fuji or nikon. Some of the others are a bit up & down with value for money ie: sony & panasonic. If it were a video cam you were after sony is the best, closely followed by panasonic.
some sony & panasonic still cams r great value and others are mediocre value

these are my opinions only
you might also like to check out the choice mag website

steve
AnswerID: 185929

Reply By: Derek from Affordable Batteries & Radiators - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 06:32

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 06:32
The new Panasonic TZ-1 "WOW"

$485.00 on ebay.
AnswerID: 185931

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:49

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:49
Site Link
It's well worthwhile buying a camera with image stabilisation - especially with 10:1 zoom.

At 200mm I can take a shot with 1/10 sec handheld as long as I can steady my self against something.

Be aware of cameras advertising something similar to Image Stabilising. Pushing the sensitivity just doesn't work as well.

If you like taking scenic shots, then you'll find you really want 28mm on wideangle.
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Reply By: Member - Brian H (QLD) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 06:44

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 06:44
There was a post about week two weeks ago about this a search my find the info you are after.

I use a Canon 300D and find it takes a good photo ..... daughter uses a 350D and gets better shots ........ I'm sure thats because of the camera not the person behind it LOL :).

The powershots seem to be a nice camera as well was considering one as a second one.

Brian
AnswerID: 185933

Reply By: glenno(qld) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 06:58

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 06:58
This is a good site
www.dpreview.com/
This is worth while joining
Site Link
AnswerID: 185934

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:32

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:32
Don't buy any camera until you've read a review of it here. Otherwise you may be in for some serious disappointments that the advertised features don't work quite as advertised.
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Reply By: Member - uncle - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:10

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:10
Hi Barnsey, we have a Fuji s602,it has 6X zoom and can be wound up to 6 meg if needed ,we only ever usally shoot at 3 meg.However there is the new Fuji s5500 & 5600 on the market now and have a 10X zoom and also can be used on full auto or you can select your own shutter speeds etc, something you cant do with a "box brownie" digital. Good if you want to slow the shutter speed down to give the effect of water fall in full song.They are in that price bracket now too. Cheers and have a great trip.
AnswerID: 185935

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:34

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:34
The next generation Fuji is the S9000 - selling for about $750 these days - an excellent camera.
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Follow Up By: Member - uncle - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:47

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:47
Yeah ,saw those Mike, just trying to convince wifey now!Nice looking and all the features.
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Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 16:34

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 16:34
. . . but it doesn't have an Image Stabiliser
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:53

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:53
Also got an S602Z, great camera, and would be worth very little now to buy second hand.
Well worth a look.
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Reply By: Kiwi Kia - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:39

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:39
How long is a piece of string?

The only real good advice that I can give you holds for a lot of expensive toys - go for a brand or dealer that you are confident will give you good service if your toy stops working !

Peace of mind is worth heaps, there is nothing so frustrating as having a dealer drop you like a hot potato when you want some service.
AnswerID: 185937

Reply By: ZUKSCOOTERX90(QLD-MEMBER) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:42

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:42
G/day Barnsey,i have Kodak easy share Dx6490 10xzoom & 4.0 megapixel.At the time i bought it , it was about 5/600 bucks it has & still does great shots & also movie as well,i think kodak still have a great range of camera for your dollar.
Cheer's bob.
AnswerID: 185939

Reply By: Member - Stan (VIC) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:53

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:53
here is the link to the best cameras in all categories.

www.steves-digicams.com/best_cameras.html

AnswerID: 185940

Reply By: Leroy - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:56

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 07:56
Another website to checkout is steve's digicams www.steves-digicams.com/

Features I reckon you need are 10x zoom - forget about digital zoom
Big memory card. If you have a laptop you can dump your pics to it but back them up to a cd. If you don't have a laptop maybe one of those portable hard drives to dump pics to.

Leroy
AnswerID: 185941

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:35

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:35
If you are buying a camera with 10x optical zoom check the reviews that it doesn't have problems with purple fringing.
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Reply By: Member - Stephen L (SA) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 08:29

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 08:29
Barnesy
Go for the Fuji 5600 and you will be very happy. 10 times optical zoom and 5 megapixels and selling for $399. You will not get a better camera for your money.
It is not a compact camera and has a feel like the SLR cameras. Go to your camera store and get them to give you a demo.

Stephen
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AnswerID: 185944

Follow Up By: Member - Stephen L (SA) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 09:07

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 09:07
Barnesy

I forgot to mention that the S5600 is able to also except either a wide angle lens and a telephoto lens and also filters can be added the the original lens

Stephen
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Reply By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 08:33

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 08:33
Actually the best feature i would have loved to get with my digital camera was not the optical zoom, rather a wide angle lens. When travelling, the views are always spectacular, however i find the camera just doesn't do it justice as i would expect. I would aim to get a camera that could accept a polarizing filter and/or wide lens.

Though price range may not work :-(

Andrew
AnswerID: 185945

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 10:46

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 10:46
Cameras with 28mm lenses are becoming more affordable.

It doesn't sound much different to the usual 35mm but it makes a bbbiiiigggg difference when fitting in scenery or indoors.
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew W (SA) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:25

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:25
Andrew - think about the potential for stitching, if most of your needs aren't wide-angle.

For most consumer needs, the auto stitching projects fo a good job most of the time.

Ciao for now
Andrew.
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 16:18

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 16:18
Thanks Andrew.....i currently use a good stitching program, however i usually forget to capture several shots to make a panoramic view in the first place :-(

Andrew
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:52

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:52
remember when your takin photos to make a pano (if you intend to print and frame) to have the camera 'sideways' instead of the usual flat, that way when you stitch, you end up with a print that is deep enough to match the wide enough..

suffered from that with a sweet pano on the top of the hill at Lakes Enterance, did from the heads right around to the mangroves. but when I stitched it together, it was so wide, that when we went to print it it was only 4inches deep (something like 150in long)
:(

Done several the other way now, and works great.

Failing that, if you keep it flat, dont do more than 3 shots per pano.
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:57

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:57
Thanks Truckster for the great idea.....who would have thought you could come up with something like that ;-)

Andrew
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Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 19:01

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 19:01
If you use Autostitch it doesn't matter. I wanted a fisheye style photo of a small bathroom and took 30 shots in several layers - it stitches horizontally and vertically - automatically.
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Follow Up By: Pajman Pete (SA) - Monday, Jul 31, 2006 at 08:36

Monday, Jul 31, 2006 at 08:36
Thanks for the great idea Truckster.
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Follow Up By: Truckster (Vic) - Wednesday, Aug 02, 2006 at 23:15

Wednesday, Aug 02, 2006 at 23:15
>>> you use Autostitch it doesn't matter.

are you referring to the size to print being too long for width? cause ya wrong.
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew W (SA) - Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:03

Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:03
I think Mike's comment was that if you take several rows of photos you can stitch them together ... which can fix any problems of the ratio of the horizontal and vertical.

It pays to keep in mind some standard ratios - like 16:9 (HD TV) or 16:7 (160 format film size) which make for appealing landscapes (for instance this is used by some of the well-known landscape photographers).

Only problem with trying to do several rows, is that the challenge of rotating the camera around the nodal point of the lens gets even harder (rotating in two axes at once), and to make matters worse, you are bringing in more of the foreground and thus the parts of the image closer to the camera which are more likely to not line up through minor changes in axes of rotation.

Only real solution to this is a Panoramic Tripod Head - and a tripod, like the www.gregwired.com Panosaurus.

Ciao for now
Andrew.
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Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:11

Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:11
"challenge of rotating the camera around the nodal point of the lens gets even harder (rotating in two axes at once), "

- Autostitch handles all those problems automatically, as well as fixing differences in brightness and colour balance. Although I always go to Manual Focus, Exposure and White Balance to make it easier for the software.

I've stitched images which are three rows high and ten shots across.
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Follow Up By: Pajman Pete (SA) - Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:22

Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:22
My Olympus came with it's own auto stitching software, but it struggles occasionally so now I have to install something else on my computer!

Thanks guys!

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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew W (SA) - Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:43

Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 08:43
Hi Mike,

You may not realise, nor be doing any sufficiently enough detailed stitching to have seen it, but optically, it is impossible to do it with any sort of practical hand-holding.

A little exercise to demonstrate the problem.

1. Close your left eye

2. (with your right eye) line up two posts or vertical lines some distance from you (say, the door frame, and some more distant vertical line)

3. Imagine that is the image in one side of a frame that will be stitched with another (you need to remember it)

4. Close your right eye and open your left eye without moving your head.

5. Imagine this is the other image that you want to stitch.

You will see that the two vertical lines do not line up any more because you have moved a little (well "the camera" - your eye" has moved by a few inches).

So, you have one image with two lines lined up with nothing between them, and you have another image with them separated. No amount of stitching can line them up perfectly.

The solution is to rotate around a nodal point of the lens - vertically for each column and horizontally for each row.

This is reason why your stitching (regardless of how good it is) will show discontinuous tones and lines doubled up whenever you have detail in the foreground and you are not rotating your camera perfectly.

Really too, it is important to have the camera exposure set to the same settings for each shot, otherwise the stitching software has to change the brightness and contrast of the image between frames and so you get banding in the sky.

Similarly, you should have a consistent focal length (locked focus) for each shot, otherwise the softer parts of the image (perhaps foreground and background) will be inconsistently soft between frames, and so you will get banding from this too.

Now, all of this is not a problem for most people who just want to remember what that great view looked like, and who will only ever print out small prints of it.

A bit of banding in the sky, some funny lines in the foreground detail, etc. won't matter.

If you care abou the detail however, and want a www.kenduncan.com.au result ... a Panoramic Tripod Head is the ONLY way to go.

Ciao for now
Andrew.

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Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 09:21

Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 09:21
Andrew, I didn't say the result was perfect, but considering Autostitch takes about a minute of processing time, it's a much more practical way for me to get a fisheye photo compared with spending $300plus.

It can also do 360 degree panoramas and spherical panoramas automatically, which no lens can.

Also Autostitch can do things our eye/brains can't - morph and blend the images so they look good to the average person.

I always get a good laugh from the photos where a person was in one shot, but not in the second of the same area - you see a transparent ghost !
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Reply By: Dirty Smitty - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 08:50

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 08:50
Fuji F10 Small, powerful, durable a good all round camera (6.3 megapixels, Total Zoom 18.5x (3 x optical, 6.2 x digital) 2.5" LCD screen, movie with sound, HD, continuous shooting etc) . I paid $759.00 for mine about 14 months ago has never let me down. I think that they sell for $350-$450 now. Depreciation doen't affect me as I can claim it as work expences (TAX).

Good Luck,

Dirty
AnswerID: 185947

Reply By: mfewster - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 09:30

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 09:30
Hi Barnsey
I think we had a long conversation on another thread recently.
Here are what I reckon are the issues. optical aoom mmore important than megapixels. You don't need more than 6 meg unless you are going to do BIG blowups (bigger than A3 size paper) and very few people do.
No one camera does the lot unless you but something very expensive with lots of eeven more expensive lenses,
What do you want to photograph? Do you want landscapes, people/family snaps or wildlife? I would give different camera recomendations for each of these. So-you can get very good results in you price range by getting a camera by getting a camera that has strenghts in one of these fields. If however you want a general purpose camera to try to do all of these, I would suggest getting some extra software. Most landscape photographers want a wideangle lens. You can get over this by stitching photographs togetherin your computerafter you have taken the shots. Go to www.autostitch.net for info about how to do this and a free program that does it brilliantly. Other programs are also availableto do this, but this one is the fastest and its free.
The next big questionHow much do you know about photography already? If you already know quite a bit about it, or if you think it might be a hobby you want to develop, then you will need a quite different camera from one that is designed to work as automatically as possible. In your price range some cameras are designed to do it all for you and others give the photographer much more control. What way do you want to go? If you go all auto, then find you really want to get into photography, you will be looking for a new camera quite quickly. Onthe other hand, if you don't want all the over ride options you will find they just seem to complicate things unnecessarily.
All the sites with camera reviews listed above are good, but thereareso many reviews to wade through, it is still highly confusing unless you already know the jargon.
If you are going on an extended trip, leave yourself enough $ to buy memory cards, or a portable drive to transfer your photos to, or, best of all, have a notebook computer and transfer them to that. The memory card that comes with the camera you buy will be too small to keep you happy.Memory cards can be bought on ebay much cheaper once you have your camera and know the type it takes.
AnswerID: 185952

Reply By: Member - Andrew W (SA) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 11:19

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 11:19
Hi there Barnesy,

It all gets back to what sort of photography you plan to do ...

Here is a digital camera buyers guide I have on my website: http://www.vividadventures.com.au/VAchecklist.pdf

If you want to take Steve Parish -like wildlife images, $5,000 will not be enough.

It all depends, but for many people $500 is more than adequate.

My kids seem to be taking better and better photos with their $150 Olympus - some that are really very good.

Give us a yell if you want some personal training.

Ciao for now
Andrew.
AnswerID: 185968

Reply By: glenno(qld) - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 11:27

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 11:27
http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/#
On the grey title bar click on classifieds then general classifieds then type in digital camera or canon etc
AnswerID: 185969

Reply By: Barnesy - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:58

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 15:58
Thanks to all for responding. I will look at all of the sites mentioned. I had started researching but couldn't understand the jargon. Every camera has claims of being the best. I do have a laptop that photos can be downloaded onto.

I would like to be able to take photography up as a part time hobby but expense would be an issue there. Maybe if there was a way to change lenses and other functions on it from auto to manual as my competency grew?

Would be happy though with an easy to use, good qualtiy all round camera. Scenery photos, wildlife (maybe movement and having to focus in on small animals), and close-ups (flowers etc). those stitching and altering the shutter speed options seem good.

Thanks

Barnesy
AnswerID: 185990

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:57

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:57
If you buy an upmarket camera (around $500) it should have automatic modes and manual modes.

I mostly use mine in Manual modes, but I still use Auto mode when I know the camera can respond faster than I can (and the shot exposure isn't too challenging).
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Reply By: cipher - Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 22:06

Saturday, Jul 29, 2006 at 22:06
Barnesy,

Its all in the lense mate.. Good quality lense equals good quality shots..

Megapixels ideally dont mean much.. Its the quality of the lense and CCD's which capture the light etc etc..

I have a Nikon Z6, 6 mp 10x optical zoom, in my opinion VERY good cam for the price, sits at about 500 i think...

IMHO dont move from Canon and Nikon...(Good lenses used)

Justin
AnswerID: 186027

Follow Up By: StephenF10 - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 08:19

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 08:19
Panasonic use Leica lenses. They don't get any better than that.

Stephen.
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew W (SA) - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:57

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 18:57
Stephen,

Marketing is such a wonderful thing.

Panasonic use lens designs from Leica for miniscule lenses.

Great miniscule lenses still are hopelessly poor quality compared to poor (say) 35mm lenses.

The brand on a very small lens is not in itself an important factor.

The whole combination of camera design factors including lens size, characteristics but also sensor size, technology, software etc., all make a significant difference.

Ciao for now
Andrew who thinks the brand of a compact consumer camera matters little these days - buy one you like (eg. is a Falcon better than a Commode or a Pulsar than an Astra?)
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FollowupID: 443123

Follow Up By: Member - Mike DID - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 19:07

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 19:07
Providing the camera has been reviewed by Steve's Digicams or DPReview, you don't have to depend on the Marketing hype to guess which camera will produce better pictures. Their tests are based on realistic scenes but use scientific methods.

e.g. the S602 (I used to have) at 3MPixel was shown to have better picture quality than some 5MPixel cameras.

It also shows that buying a low-end Digital SLR is no guarantee of great picture quality - the lenses that come with the low-cost kits are also limited-quality lenses.
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Reply By: Bricky - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 20:03

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 20:03
I would definately go the fuji. We bought an Olympus that has 10x optical zoom. Great camera but think the fuji is better, easier to use and cheaper.
Daryl
AnswerID: 186115

Reply By: HJ60-2H - Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 20:11

Sunday, Jul 30, 2006 at 20:11
For most people who take snapshots the display is the most used part of the camera. Buy the one with the best ( usalally the biggest) display you can afford. After that lenses as already stated are the key to getting good technical shots. So buy a know brand from an optical manufacturer, Cannon, Nikon are the best in these for the hapopoy snapper user.

Best accessopry I ever bought was a monopod. Try one and you will want one as well....
AnswerID: 186116

Reply By: cackles - Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 10:39

Thursday, Aug 03, 2006 at 10:39
If you intend on taking good night time or sunsets than you would be best with a camera that has the manual option. You can get these now without having to go to an SLR.
Likewise a good tripod is a must for this sort of work, allowing the long shutter speeds without the problem of shake.

If you do intend to get into it you may be better to stretch to an SLR, I have a nikon D50 and it has been a joy to use and easy to learn too.

Have a look on ebay you may surprose yourself at what you can afford.

Cackles
AnswerID: 186885

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