3.0lt Patrol Oil Level
Submitted: Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 13:48
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Batman69
Hello all,
I had my GU serviced last week, they changed oil and filter and added 8 litres of fresh oil. When I checked the dipstick (engine cold) the oil level was 23mm above the mark that indicates full. I double checked with the guys that did the change and they only put 8 litres in.
I checked with my Nissan dealer and they were bemused and confused. I have the correct dipstick (was changed with a recall when they increased the oil level to 8.2 litres). We then checked a new Patrol on the lot, it was the same, oil level way above full mark. Again checked with a mate who has a GUIII and his was the same oil level way above full mark when cold.
I personally reckon it's a waste of time checking oil just after the engine has run (even when I do this it is
well above the full mark) and only ever
check the oil when the engine has not run for at least 30 minutes or when cold. I now have a small notch filed in the dipstick that indicates the level that should be in the engine when "cold".
Check yours out next time you change the oil or get it servicedyou may find it may be worth considering putting a cold fill mark if you have the same issue with your GU 3.0lt.
Secondly and more importantly when doing an oil and filter change always add 8 or 8.2 litres to the engine to ensure you have the correct amount of oil in your motor. NEVER fill your engine by the dipstick marks when doing an oil change. You probably won't have enough oil in your motor.
I would be very interested in your comments.
Batman.
Reply By: TerraFirma - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 13:58
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 13:58
Shouldn't matter Nissan or Toyota, Landcruiser or Patrol, if it's over by 23mm thats about 1 inch which sounds to me like thats a lot of oil too much, around 500ml to a litre. Overfilling can be dangerous. Your comments suggest the dipstick is incorrect. This sounds unusual, it's a simple measurement but recalls on this suggest something is wrong, has someone explained the issue with the recall and were you given the correct dipstick..? Could your Nissan dealer be the dipstick..?
AnswerID:
201794
Follow Up By: Batman69 - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:29
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:29
It is definitley the correct dipstick, checked with Nissan dealer on that one.
As far as being overfilled, the guys who did the service swear they only put eight litres in, and I doubt they would be too keen to give oil away. Like I mentioned all Patrols I checked had the same strangely high level when I looked at the dipstick. My mates GUIII was about 20mm over, the new one in the yard of my local dealer was roughly 15 - 20 mm over the mark.
The recall was done in Jan 01 and was to change the oil capacity to 8.2 litres, the recall kit, as confirmed by the Nissan dealer incuded oil, oil filter and new dipstick.
I have had the car since new in 2000 and
check the oil about once a month when driving around town and daily when on trips. All I used to do was see if the oil was above the low mark. It always was
well above the mark and until now I never really looked that closely When it was due for it's last service I checked more thoroughly and it seemed too high before the service.
The car has only ever been serviced by my local Nissan dealer or my local 4x4 specialist. It seems strange and no-one as yet has an answer.
FollowupID:
461216
Follow Up By: Exploder - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:14
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:14
It is possible the Dip stick is wrong, I have heard of this before were a Bach of dipstick’s came out with the wrong marks on em.
I would of done what you did, drop the oil and change the filter then add the amount specified in the handbook.
If the engine is that overfilled you will know about it as it will be getting blown out of the Crankcase breather.
FollowupID:
461228
Follow Up By: Batman69 - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:21
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:21
The dipstick is as far as Nissan are concerned correct, we laid
mine side by side with a new one from spare parts and it was identical!
FollowupID:
461233
Follow Up By: TerraFirma - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:35
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:35
What I don't understand is why are they replacing the dipstick with an identical one..? I can understand them replacing a dipstick which is recalibrated to force owners to increase the oil fill and oil capacity. So what has happened it seems is the dipstick is under reading by around 20mm which would equate to a fair whack of oil and given the problems these engines have reportably experienced Nissan would be keen to get the oil level right. If these engines are carrying 8 litres or 8.2 litres for a 3 litre engine thats plenty, shouldn't have oil problems with that sort of capacity.
FollowupID:
461237
Follow Up By: Batman69 - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:02
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:02
Terrafirma,
The replacement stick is not identical, although I am not sure how they differ.
Mine has the "new" revised dipstick in it which is the same as is fitted to 2006 3.0lt Patrols. The serial number of "old" dipstick ends in 102, the "new" one ends in 105. The serial number is stamped on the stick.
Your point on the oil level is correct, if people fill just to the top mark on the dipstick when changing or topping up they will as far as I can understand be short of the recommended 8.2 litres. Being short of oil could account for some engine failures.......who knows.
FollowupID:
461247
Reply By: PatrolBen - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:16
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:16
What year is your 3.0L Patrol? The early ones (2000-2002) had a recall done to replace the original dipstick with a one calibrated to accept more oil in the sump (around 2L extra) as this was one of the bandaids Nissan applied to the early 3L jobbies in a effort to fix the grenading caused by a lack of lubrication oil around numbers 3 and 4 pistons (I think). Is it possible that yours missed the new dipstick and that Nissan (or mechanic) has added the revised amount of oil whereas it was filled with the original amount of oil before and this is the reason for the extra oil showing up?
Ben
AnswerID:
201816
Follow Up By: PatrolBen - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:17
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:17
Oops, wasn't a recall, silly me. Just the dealers getting to the when they came in for servicing. You get the point anyway, Cheeky Buggers
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Scubaroo - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:48
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:48
Did they replace the filter at the same time? If not, that might explain the "extra" oil.
AnswerID:
201822
Reply By: Martyn (WA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:49
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:49
Batman,
I've found the same. The dipstick is right,
mine is a 2000 model. If I change the oil, run the engine and top the oil up to the correct level. the following day the oil level is about 15 mm to high. Spin the engine for a minute or so, let it be for maybe a couple of minutes the level is right. I thought that maybe the NRV is the filter unit is u/s allowing the oil to drain back from the oil galleries,
mine appeared to be OK. For me now I top the oil up to the correct level cold and
check before I start the engine, I keep the oil level right to that regime.
FIIK what's going on to be honest, overfilling is bad, when the engine has spun up and the oil is hot the oil level is still within the high and the low so for me that's OK. If I do it the other way and top up when cold to the high mark after spinning the engine up, checking the oil level when the engine is hot the oil level is way over the top which is something I don't want.
My opinions as usual.
AnswerID:
201823
Follow Up By: Batman69 - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:02
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:02
Martyn,
Do you get 8 litres in when filling that way?
All I will do from now on when changing oil is....if I get the filter changed add 8.2 litres and if I don't get the filter changed add 7.7 litres as per the upgraded notes in my owners manual.
If I do that, then regardless of the level shown on the dipstick I can't go wrong.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Martyn (WA) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:16
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:16
Batman,
Yes, I couldn't be as precise as 8.2 but I put more than 7.7 litres in and no more than 8.5 litres. If the dipstick in your engine is or appears to be inaccurate then I would do what you are doing. Measure in the 8.2 litres into the engine, make a mental note of where the level is on the dipstick, best to do this at the same time every time for consistency and trend for a change in level. If the level does change fill to where you had an initial level after the change. Make sure the vehicle is on the level, the same temp and you haven't had a drink this always makes things look bigger than they really are.......................
In my experience of course...........
FollowupID:
461300
Follow Up By: 3.0turbob - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 12:34
Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 12:34
I feel better if the level is a bit above the "full" mark on the dipstick. That way I can be fairly certain that the level is correct when the engine is running. Because new, clean oil is very hard to see on the dipstick, I use a measuring jug (cooking jug) to make sure the right amout goes in. Changing oil & filter I usually end up putting 8.5 litres in. I use the Nissan Semi-Synthetic ACEA B3 oil.
FollowupID:
461507
Reply By: Muzzgit [WA] - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:50
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 15:50
Mine the same. When serviced by Nissan it's always heaps over.
When serviced by local bloke, still over full but not that much.
By the way, did you read the above reply telling you all about the re-call of 3.0 patrols to lengthen the dipstick?"?? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
AnswerID:
201824
Reply By: toohey. - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:41
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:41
giday batman
when i drain my 3.0ltd navara i let it drain for afew hours,fill with exact amount
6.7 lt with filter change it is always spot on the correct mark,when checked if filling up at servo it is down a bit let it stand for an hour it is spot on again,alot of workshops drain when cold put the plug back in when it is just driping,i reckon they are a slow drain motor i also do
mine when hot.
cheers toohey
AnswerID:
201831
Reply By: Member - Oldplodder (QLD) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:44
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:44
What does your manual say?
The Pajero manual says to
check the oil level warm and within 30 seconds or so of turning the engine off.
The oil level then is right on the top mark.
When I
check it cold in the morning, it is about 8mm above the mark.
The pajero takes 7 litres of oil.
AnswerID:
201832
Follow Up By: Batman69 - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:55
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:55
The manual says to
check the oil when motor is hot, switch motor off and wait for a few minutes. It still reads above mark when this is done.
FollowupID:
461245
Reply By: kesh - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:57
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 16:57
Plenty of shock horror about this.
But no one seems to offer information as to what problem this degree of overfill will create.
My suggestion is to park on an incline, uphill or down, on about as severe a slope as you could imagine driving up (or down)
Now pull out the dipstick and see where the oil level is. Have a bit of a sight along the crankshaft line and I would bet any money the rear (or front) of the crank would be dipping in the oil when the engine is running. Add a bit of sloshing around to that due to bumps in the track and I think you would see what I mean.
I have a mate with a Toyo trayback, 1hz motor, which has a sump oil level indicator as standard. He often comes up a "jumpup"out of a quarry with the low level light on, scared the begeez out of him first time but all
well with the oil back on level ground.
After all, your Honda genny. etc. all have a protrusion on the end of the conrod to dip into the oil, its called "splash lubrication" I truly think that 20mm overfill wont cause one iota of problem
kesh
AnswerID:
201833
Follow Up By: Batman69 - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:09
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:09
I agree, but my point is that I don't think it is over fill.
I just think some goose engineer at Nissan didn't think too carefully about the regime for checking the oil, either hot or cold and that the dipstick is inadequate.
When I told the guys at my Nissan delear how I
check my oil they said "that's fine, that's how it's supossed to be done". Which differs to the manual!
To me that means the dipstick ain't right. That's why I put a notch in the stick marking the full mark when cold, then I can't have any problems or questions about whether I let it stand long enough or too long before checking.
Check it cold first thing in the morning and I know if its got enough in it.
FollowupID:
461252
Follow Up By: hl - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:48
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:48
That sounds pretty right. There is about a liter in the oil cooler that is very slow to drain back to the sump.
Just start the engine, run it for 30 seconds and then turn it off.
Check the oil level and you will find it is pretty
well spot on.
It is not a problem in the ZD30 to have the level a bit high. Miine is always just above the squiggly bit on the dipstick when I put in 8 liters and
check it after it settles overnight.
Don't worry, be happy.....
cheers
FollowupID:
461260
Reply By: Barnray - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:43
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 17:43
The oil filters on the patrol are upside down and there is some return to the sump overnight hence when checked cold the high reading. If the oil is checked after starting the engine and warming up and stopping you will have the correct reading. barnray
AnswerID:
201840
Follow Up By: Member - Glenn D (NSW) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 23:08
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 23:08
Sideways !
I am guessing you havent had one out then !
Glenn.
FollowupID:
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Reply By: David CREES - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:25
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:25
I Have a 2001 3 litre patrol, engine the was changed under warranty with a 2004 motor(previous onwer blue at 84,000) have the same problem when it was serviced. Told the mechanics about it being over filed. They stated they left it standing for 30 minutes and checked the oil level and it was all right, when i got it
home and checked it it was over full. I rang nissan re the changed/altered dip stick and oil capacity and got the usual response, who knows no help at all. I now service it myself, if you put the amount of oil as stated in the Gregorys manual it is over filled by about 1cm. I just live with it, better being a tad over filed than under filed.
AnswerID:
201870
Reply By: On Patrol - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:51
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 20:51
Is it possible that a bit of sludge build-up is stealing some of the sump capacity and that the amount of oil put in is the same as the amount of oil that came out?
Just a thought.
AnswerID:
201875
Follow Up By: brett - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:16
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:16
The oil capacity figures are generally for a brand new totally dry engine, even though you drain the oil you don't get it all out, particularly if you have an oil cooler, if you add what the manual says and include the half litre still left in the engine it will be overfilled by half a litre, which is probably what your seeing on the dipstick. Only problem with overfilling is if the crank is dipping deep into the oil and foaming it up, you then get air in the oil, not good for lubrication. You would have to overfill by alot for this to be a problem, with an oil capacity of around 8 to 10 litres en extra half to one litre isn't going to be a problem, probably best to have a bit more than a bit less.
FollowupID:
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Reply By: Member - Nick (Kununurra) - Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:59
Monday, Oct 30, 2006 at 21:59
Why worry about that, I'd be more worried about when the engine blows up.LOL
AnswerID:
201917
Follow Up By: On Patrol - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 06:46
Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 06:46
No need to worry yourself about that Nick, you just worry about your front diff.LOL
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Follow Up By: Batman69 - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 09:45
Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 09:45
Nick,
Thank you for your thoughtful and intelligent response
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Follow Up By: Member - Nick (Kununurra) - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 21:33
Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 21:33
No worries guys.BTW i'd rather a front diff go than an engine, at least I can still get
home again. Cheers
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Reply By: Chaz - Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 14:01
Tuesday, Oct 31, 2006 at 14:01
Hi Batman,
I wouldn't worry about where it is on the dipstick, I just put in 8.2-8.5 liters and like you keep note of where it is for checking. I think in the case of the ZD30, we should be more concerned if our oil level is low and not high. I have always ran my motors a little on the high side and have never had a problem, but I think it would be much worst to run low and the full mark on the dipstick is too low.
Chaz
AnswerID:
202044
Follow Up By: Flash - Wednesday, Nov 01, 2006 at 14:24
Wednesday, Nov 01, 2006 at 14:24
On my TD42 (Yeh a bit different to a 3 litre) it will read overfull on the dipstick after being shut down for a while, often by a substantial amount. I've never lost any sleep over this (Have had it sixteen years) and would rather a bit too much than a bit too little... It doesn't appear to create any problem at all.
Cheers
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