Split Rim opinions...................

Submitted: Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 21:21
ThreadID: 42461 Views:3673 Replies:10 FollowUps:25
This Thread has been Archived
(These posts seem to run in batches...lol)

I see my name coming up in post 42442 re Tyre Pressures and also about Split Rims.

Lets make one thing clear about Split Rim Tyres:

They are old technology
They could be more difficult to repair out bush
They could suffer balancing problems
Depending on which type of tyre (and tube) you use, they could suffer more punctures

Tubeless tyres are:

Easier to repair by plug out bush
Do not deflate in a rush
Are easier to balance
Are difficult to remove from rim out bush unless to have the right tools
They normally give better mileage.

Now, some of my treks take me to where few other travellers would venture. It is my adventurous nature to want to go to these places. In 2006 I went out on three treks, which included some hard-core cross-country driving. Unfortunately there wasn’t time or the opportunity to switch to split rims with Cross Ply tyres and so I ventured out with Cooper STT and Eldorado tyres. Because of the nature of the terrain I had to drop my tyre pressures to 15psi on the GQ and 10psi on the trailer. The results of my 2006 travels were 14 punctures, which included 4 wrecked tyres. I suppose I should have had more punctures but I was very careful where I put my wheels in the 1000km or so of Off Track driving.

Tubeless tyres are just not made for Off-track driving.

After a long search I was able to locate some Nissan Split Rims and have shod them with MRF 12ply Super Traction Cross Ply tyres. They have 12plies in the tread and the thickness of the sidewalls could be 20mm or more. These tyres are really good on gravel roads and rough terrain. A desert crossing will come up this year to test the tyres in sand at low pressures.

If you are running Split Rims, then to safeguard against punctures, you should always buy the best tubes obtainable on the market. Each year you should remove all the tyres and clean the rims with a wire brush and repaint. This will make for easier removal should you have to during the year. Radial tyres on Split Rims are probably more prone to punctures due to the heat build up in them and the perforation of the tubes by the heat.

Like in most cases one has to drive to the conditions and apply the right tyre pressures for your journey.

I have respect for the two outback characters named in the thread as well. They are both experienced travellers. Their advice on the use of Split Rims may not be pertinent to my use of Split Rims but they are entitled to their opinion.

Cheers
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Reply By: Peter 2 - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:06

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:06
To add to Willem's post about the tubes, only buy Michelin, Dunlop or if desperate tubes made in Malaysia. DO NOT buy Korean tubes of any brand especially the ones labelled "Mr Tubes" as they are rubbish and WILL let go along the seams.
If you have a dunlop or Michelin tube compare the weight and thickness with a Korean one there is no comparison.
Cleanliness when refitting tyres and tubes is paramount especially in sand country as a few grains of sand between the tyre and tube will eventually lead to a puncture.
I use a damp chux or similar to wipe out inside the tyre before fitting the tube.
AnswerID: 222569

Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:02

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:02
its not just that Peter 2 patches just dont seem o "vulcanise' to them making it darn hard to get a patch to stick
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Follow Up By: Johnnotoo - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 15:48

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 15:48
Spot on Peter2

I have lost count of punctures in cheap tubes caused by the tubes own weaknesses. Also , most people forget about cleanliness. I take a small canvas tarp on which to operate on my splits AND wipe out with a damp cloth as you say. Easy to get grit etc in the tyre which stuffs tube fast.
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Reply By: djm67 - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:07

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:07
Willem

Got any websites etc where I can hunt down info on ther MRF's?
AnswerID: 222570

Follow Up By: Willem - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:18

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:18
www.mrftyres.com

I got mine through my local Tyrpower bloke(the only tyre business in town...lol)

Cheers
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Reply By: Member - Charlie M (SA) - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:41

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:41
Willem
cross ply tyres ! 12ply tyres are 12ply rating, not actual ply`s in sidewall/tread
Cheers
Charlie
AnswerID: 222578

Follow Up By: Willem - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:46

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:46
Wow
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:03

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:03
They have 6 ply tred and 4 ply sidewall
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Reply By: Angler - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:43

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:43
Did you know that split rims are now not permitted on BHP Billiton sites. Nor are any vehicles that are not white with a yellow stripe down the side.

Funny people these OH&S reps.

Pooley
AnswerID: 222580

Follow Up By: Willem - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:48

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 22:48
I have no wish, nor am I likely to visit Billiton sites...lol

Yes OH&S have gone mad.
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:05

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:05
"Funny people these OH&S reps"
Never a truer word has been spoken
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Follow Up By: djm67 - Thursday, Feb 22, 2007 at 23:35

Thursday, Feb 22, 2007 at 23:35
I work on a BHP site and there are plenty of split rims on vehicles..................

And you can get a different colour (than white) vehicle on-site, but it is subject to a risk assessment and approval.
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Reply By: Black Beard - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:07

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:07
In my vast experience here on the station, it doesn't matter a hoot what sort of tyre is on the rim, it'll last until the most in-opportune moment! I've run rags, tubeless this brand and that, at the end of the day, it's where you point the bloody thing that governs how many punctures you'll have. I've got 1 dunlop radial on the trusty windmill ute which has been there for nearly 2 years, while many a cross-ply have been and gone. I reckon there's a lot of chance in tyre life.
AnswerID: 222584

Follow Up By: Willem - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 09:34

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 09:34
'I reckon there's a lot of chance in tyre life'

Too true, mate, too true....lol
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Reply By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:09

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:09
If things go to plan I wil be giving the MTR one last chance out bush next week. sooner or later I will get off my but and reshed my splitties. My super traction are just too bald. I fially got a puncture with them at Mt Elvre. it was a tread puncture but I will fogive them as there was no tread left.
Might try the super Lug next time. less aggressive but have an extra 2 plys in the tread (16 ply I think)
AnswerID: 222585

Reply By: The Rambler( W.A.) - Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:18

Sunday, Feb 18, 2007 at 23:18
I can agree with most of what Willem says ---easier to repair tyres on tubeless --yes but MUCH harder to replace tyre in case of total destruction.Ihave run split rims (and only will use them) for many years through very hard country in all parts of the top end and Ihave seen so many people come to grief with the wrong tyres and wheels .Leave the fancy tryres to the sand and bitumen and save your dollars to the tyres and wheels designed for the job.Ihave done thousands of kms. on splits with very few problems and will continue to use them .All you need is a good set of tyre levers and a few patches.Will be running to Cape York and back this year from Perth and will let you know how little problems I will have with my 235/85/16 Hankooks on split rims.
AnswerID: 222588

Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:16

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:16
Hi Rambler ,
How fast are the tyres rated and how does this affect your insurance ?
Willie .
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Reply By: Member -Signman - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 08:51

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 08:51
"Tubeless tyres are just not made for Off-track driving. " What a lot of crap!!

And I do realize the differentiation of your idea of 'off road' and 'off track '..
AnswerID: 222618

Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:12

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:12
Its simple physics radial tubeless tyres are made for cool running and highway performance 1stly and off road performance as the comparmise hence they are thinner and lighter not desighned for offtrack at all.
crossply tyres are made for driving off track with off road as a compramise and lastly highway performance hence they are thicker and contain more plies giving them more strength.
Ive used both and they do a good job for there intended desighn and not so good when used outside of that
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:19

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:19
OT sorry .

Hi Davoe ,
I am thinking of doing a fossicking tagalong in the Pilbara in June . Can I drop in and say hello ?
Willie
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:25

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 10:25
hopefully I will be working elsewhere. prob a bit hard to tee up as I am out and about all day but keep in touch about it might be able to tee something up. I go back wednesday week for a 3 week stint the 48 degree days
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Follow Up By: V8Diesel - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 12:57

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 12:57
Why do you say that?
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Follow Up By: Kiwi Kia - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 15:59

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 15:59
Davoe, you mention heat as being a problem with radials.

1. Heat will destroy any tyre

2. Wrong pressure and wrong speed will generate too much heat

3. Slow off road will not generate as much heat as fast on road.

It's simple physics allright, I believe that the driver is responsible for most punctures.

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Follow Up By: Willem - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 18:25

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 18:25
Ahhhh Signman

Would please pass on some of your knowledge to us or me in particular.

I would really like to hear where you have been with your tubeless tyres
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Follow Up By: V8Diesel - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 19:21

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 19:21
waiting, waiting..........
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Follow Up By: Member - Willie , Epping .Syd. - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 19:48

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 19:48
"waiting, waiting..........." for what Mr Diesel ?
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Follow Up By: V8Diesel - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 20:43

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 20:43
Signman's response to my question. Just curious, that's all.
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Follow Up By: Member - Davoe (Nullagine) - Sunday, Feb 25, 2007 at 16:20

Sunday, Feb 25, 2007 at 16:20
well I have just finished a head to head I have done the Yowie rocks track 2wice now once with bald rags and once with MTR tubeless with around 70% tread. Conditions were simular with the ground being damp fromthunderstorms. The rags managed it without a flat whereas the MTR had 3 punctures to 2 tyres (both front interestingly) The MTR is probably the strongest radial available and I wouldnt have considered the track with any other radial
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Reply By: steve&anja - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 14:32

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 14:32
Hi I have just joined the forum days ago and hope my experience can help.
I have been in the Tourist industry for 13 years from arnhemland,Kakadu, and the Kimberley and before the I was in the surveying industry for 12 years in the same area so Ive done 1 or 2 km in the bush on many different tyres and many different Toyota's. When we going bush surveying the split rim was the go useless for mileage but easer to repair at night in fact we would replace the good highway rims and tyres for old near bald tyres for the bush work and take plenty of old tyres with us and as we destroyed a tyre we would just replace it at little cost. Obviously not practical for weekend trip or long holidays.
As for doing tours a friends of mine used handcook 16 ply splits got no punctures but about 25 thousand km @ $250 a tyre between 60 to 70 thousand km a year 5 troopys it was an expensive exercise. Another colleague has 2 100 series gxls and runs 265 65 16 coopers he swears by them they he gets 55 to 65 thousand km @ $340 a tyre his vehicles do about 70 to 80 thousand a year.
I run 2 100 series gxls and 1 78 troopy my vehicles do 50 to 60 thousand km a year and I run Austalian made Bridgestone a/t duellers 265 65 16 in 6 year my trucks have worn out 8 sets with 1 puncher and I just put 2 new sets on Im getting about 50 to 55 thousand km per set @ $ 225 a tyre I wont buy anything else. These prices were Darwin prices hope this helps.
AnswerID: 222676

Follow Up By: Willem - Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 18:32

Monday, Feb 19, 2007 at 18:32
Interesting Steve

I used to run Tours in the Top End and Kakadu Area in the late 70's and early 80's.

I think of it I seem to remember that I ran Dunlops on splits

Cheers
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Follow Up By: Richard Kovac - Tuesday, Feb 20, 2007 at 00:28

Tuesday, Feb 20, 2007 at 00:28
Hi I still run Dunlops on splits ;-)
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Follow Up By: Mike Harding - Sunday, Feb 25, 2007 at 17:17

Sunday, Feb 25, 2007 at 17:17
>I run 2 100 series gxls and 1 78 troopy my vehicles do 50
>to 60 thousand km a year and I run Austalian made
>Bridgestone a/t duellers 265 65 16 in 6 year my trucks have
>worn out 8 sets with 1 puncher and I just put 2 new sets on
>Im getting about 50 to 55 thousand km per set @ $ 225 a
>tyre I wont buy anything else.

Impressive numbers! Although I am not a fan of Bridgestones
what you report would seem to challenge many of the posts
in this thread?

Mike Harding
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Follow Up By: steve&anja - Sunday, Feb 25, 2007 at 18:33

Sunday, Feb 25, 2007 at 18:33
Hi Mike
I don't think it challenges the post's it shows what can be achieved by good maintenance and good driving skills, I like Kiwi Kia beleive a large amount of tyre damage is driver related and yes ive wrecked some tyres in my time.
For the work I do and the places Ive traveled on these tyres running them at 40psi f and 42psi r and the only time I deveated from those pressures was Fraser Island dropped them to 36psi the proof is in the tyre. May be my next trip at the end of the year will test them some more. I don't intend to use much black stuff.
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Reply By: djm67 - Thursday, Feb 22, 2007 at 23:46

Thursday, Feb 22, 2007 at 23:46
Willem,

Another question, I cannot find a listing for a "Super Traction" on the MRF web-site.

Could you confirm the tyre model name for me please.
AnswerID: 223461

Follow Up By: Willem - Friday, Feb 23, 2007 at 08:34

Friday, Feb 23, 2007 at 08:34
Ahh yes..................

I see they have changed the name to Super Trekker. My tyres however, are still marked as Super Traction.

BTW these tyres are quite noisy on bitumen(everything is a compromise) but give a good ride, especially on dirt roads with 30psi air.

Cheers
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