80 series "4 studs that hold the steering arm on to the hub"

Submitted: Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:08
ThreadID: 43051 Views:5841 Replies:6 FollowUps:5
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hi all,

l have recently had a problem with the 4 studs that hold the steering arm onto the hub (passenger side)

Background
My problem may of started last year when l hit a tree stump with the resultant (steering wheel was knocked out quarter of a turn) and the spindle that goes into the pitman arm was slightly twisted, all was ok, never the less l got a wheel alignment and all was to spec.

When we did the seals, both sides (wiper seal was shot) we noticed that the studs were either broken/sheared (l guess the tree stump hit caused this) so we replaced them and did up torc wrench tight.

It Was when driving on Monument Track (Vic high Country Dec 1, 2006) that the bloody studs had all fallen out/sheared/busted, bar 1. Ok, so we fixed that by using 2 from the other side, which got me to Mansfield and to a professional mechanic who replaced the 4 (passenger side). Cost $200. Well worth it l guess!
He (The Mechanic said these Studs dont break easily, infact he couldn't remember ever having to replace any and he'd been in the business for a guess 30years)

It wasn't until l was back in Melb about 6 weeks later that l noticed that the studs were coming loose again......OH. W.T.F. l have now replaced them again, used lock tight, Nylox nuts...and so far so good.

Does anyone have any suggestions or seen this problem before as lm trying to work out why it happen/what causes it, maybe what l should be looking for.

PS. l dont have a cracked housing and many people have said that you would not have elongated the stud holes as the steel is about 1" thick.

Thanks

Barn

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Reply By: nowimnumberone - Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:29

Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:29
when you had the studs replaced did you also get the 4 collets replaced as well?
maybe they were damaged i know with the mine vehicles we work on the place where the collets seat can become damaged
cheers
AnswerID: 226206

Follow Up By: Barn - Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:56

Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:56
l will triple check those collets next time, but lm sure they are all at 100%
thanks
Barn
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FollowupID: 487081

Reply By: Wayne (NSW) - Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:32

Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:32
Barn,

On the end of the steering arm is a shaft that has the bottom swivel hub bearing.

Could this be bent or out of aliment. When the wheels are straight the 4 stud nuts might be tight ,but when the wheel is turned they might become loose because the shaft is bent and has moved into a different position.

The tapered washers are the correct ones for your vehicle. You say that you replaced them, but are they the right ones for your vehicle?

Apart from that there is not much else that could go wrong.

Wayne
AnswerID: 226208

Follow Up By: Wayne (NSW) - Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:37

Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:37
Bran,

Should read tapered collets not tapered washers

Wayne
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FollowupID: 487073

Follow Up By: Barn - Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:47

Thursday, Mar 08, 2007 at 22:47
The collets were replaced each time. they were also checked before re-fitting. l carry a set of 8 studs/ collets, with me now. (just incase)

l have had 2 wheel alignments, but guess they do that with the wheels straight.

That does sound logical, but, you'd rekon l would get some serious vibration if the shaft was bent....lm willing to look at anything to solve this mystery.

The Camber is in spec....

thanks
Barn
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FollowupID: 487078

Reply By: Member - DOZER- Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 00:30

Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 00:30
It is common for them to come loose, if not tightened properly after a rebuild. Two things i suggest....look for a new steering box if the shaft is still twisted, you mention wheel alignment but not the $700 shaft replacement.
Second, there must be something out down there, have a look on the top cap and tell us if there is a nut in the centre of that, which means it has had a cast-align previously. This can cause problems. When the alignment was done, did the readings show the diff was out of caster one side to the other?? Jack that wheel up and see if you can get any movement up and down by putting long bar under tyre and lifting....my guess is the swivel bearings could have also had sheering force through them and that might have damaged it enough to bind, and resist turning by said steering arm, putting pressure on the studs...lastly, you could also try turning wheels left to right whilst both are on jackstands to see if they are showing signs of binding. If all else fails, i have a whole spare diff/steering box
AnswerID: 226238

Reply By: Bilbo - Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 13:26

Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 13:26
I have seen situations where threads in housings have been hit so hard and subjected to so much strain, that the internal threads have actually "stretched" or distorted in shape - INISDE the housing.

No amount of new bolts will cure it as the threads are now "slack" and not making 100% contact with each other. They'll tighten up no problem, but under vibration, they come loose very easily. Even Loctite won't hold it as the thread to thread contact isn't good enough.

It's either a new housing or - as I once did on an old Foden diff - fill the thread with brazing brass and retap it. Bitch of a job, but if ya can't get parts,,,,,,,,,,

If you want to make sure that the bolts can't actually fall out, try drilling the bolt head crossways with small drill and using wire to wire the bolt in place. It can still loosen off but it can't come out completely. This is standard practice on racing engines to ensure the sump and gearbox drain plugs don't fall out and spill oil all over the track.

Bilbo - "the ex-racing mechanic Hobbitt"
AnswerID: 226341

Follow Up By: kiwicol - Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 22:11

Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 22:11
love to see your workshop bilbo Col
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FollowupID: 487292

Follow Up By: Bilbo - Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 23:21

Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 23:21
Col,

The Foden diff and the racing engines were a LONG time ago. The only thing I race now is a lawnmower,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

My workshop?,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,It's a minefield these days. Full of junk, hoarded bits "that might come in handy one day", tools that are stamped "British Standard Whitworth" and a Lancashire Cotton Nappers Thrutching Iron,,,,,,,,,,,stamped "Made in Oswaldwtwistle".

;)

Bilbo - "The hoarding hobbit"
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FollowupID: 487310

Reply By: Middle Jeff - Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 23:05

Friday, Mar 09, 2007 at 23:05
Hi Barn

After I do anything with the cone washes or collets whatever they are called I go back after a couple days and check them and they nearly all need a little bit extra. I have been told they tend to crush down a bit with wear, I used to shear the studs on my axle but now before I go out to play I just give them a quick going over and no more problems.

Have fun

Craig
AnswerID: 226494

Reply By: Barn - Monday, Mar 12, 2007 at 12:44

Monday, Mar 12, 2007 at 12:44
Thank you for all your advice and experiences. l will be having another look at things from a different angle now.

Cheers
Barn.
AnswerID: 226924

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