Old air-cond Gas??

The refrigerant you are refering about is a hydrocarbon and is commonly called ER-12 or HR-12 and yes it does work OK but if flamable

DAMM!..I hit the submit button instead of the spell check.

As I was saying Hydrocarbon refrigerant is flammable but it does work well and in some vehicles better then R-34a refrigerant.

Do a goggle search for Hychill, they are the biggest maker in Australia.

LPG and Hydrocarbons are related to each other to a degree but the manufacturing processes and the source materials are different.

When you convert your air con system to R-134a refrigerant you have to...
1) Replace the receiver drier.
2) Add the correct amount of either Pag or Ester synthetic oil.
3) Fit R-134a Hi and Low side charge port adaptors.
4) Refill with R-134a refrigerant.

Plus all the standard service procedures.

If it was to be put on to a Hydrocarbon refrigerant the only two things that would be differant are...
1) Add oil but you can use a synthetic or mineral based oil.
2) You do not fit R-134a service adaptors.

It should only cost you maybe and extra $40.00 to $50.00 to get it converted to R-134a refrigerant. (The price of the adaptors and synthetic oil.)

R-134a refrigerant will only carry synthetic based oils and R-12 refrigerant will only carry mineral based oils....your system has a mineral based oil in it, Hydrocarbon refrigerant will carry synthetic or mineral.

There is a lot of disputing in the industry whether you use R-134a or a Hydrocarbon rerigerant and the pros and cons, do your homework and ask questions and make up your own mind.

Ignore the people who tell you it is or refer to it as BBQ gas or is only used by backyarders,Hydrocarbon refrigerant is a proper refrigerant ,BBQ gas is not and it is differant type of gas.



Regards Richard

"Fit R-134a Hi and Low side charge port adaptors"....no you dont!..the old service connections work just fine!!!

It is Illegal not to fit them under the act.

Sure the old one work fine but it is not the correct way of doing it.

R134a adaptors are fitted for a reason.

Regards Richard

i stand corrected...thanks
but if using r12, you dont have to use them

"if going with r134a, get a larger condenser fitted ..one with more heat rejection than the existing R12 condenser...(but not too large as this could also cause problems)"

Heat rejection....you want the condenser to dispense heat and where would you be able to fit a larger one?

SP34 is good for commercial applications and people use it in automotive but why would you use it when you can use R134a and the retrofitting procedures are the same....change drier and add ester oil.

The main problem with SP34 is very very few automotive air con places use it and have it.

Regards Richard

most older model cars ...the ones that used r12!!! have plenty of room to fit a condenser capable of more heat rejection (larger also means the same)

this could be more fins/inch (not a convert of the metric system yet), more rows deep (not neccessily longer or higher) but again most older cars can accept a physically larger condenser!

yes I want the condenser to reject heat!...what is the problem with that?

sp34 works just fine, and just because the auto industry doesnt use it doesnt mean it aint good...the refrigeration industry has been working on automotive cooling a lot longer than the automotive industry...we invented it lol,....you would use sp34 if you didnt want to do a oil change, drier change ...all of which cost extra $$$ in parts not to mention the $60-100/hr labour charges.

What ever you say.

What you have to remenber it's not refrigeration mechanics that design refrigerant it's scienctists.

You can not fit a larger condenser into a Hilux they don't have the room.

To make Hi flow condensers work you need air flow and again Hilux's suffer from air flow.

Can you please explain what REJECT means?

With the service adaptors, if you took the time to read my post correctly about using adaptors I did say you use them when you convert it to R134a.

reject.....richard we are not talking about the reject shop lol

what do you think it means?...and or
what do you think a condenser does?

no offence meant, but you obviously have some knowledge of auto air but probably not enough to understand how a refrigeration system works...

"no offence meant, but you obviously have some knowledge of auto air but probably not enough to understand how a refrigeration system works..."

I was wondering why ARCtick gave me a full RAC licence with full automotive endosement.

But then again I supose installing servicing and repairing systems upto 84000 Btu's arn't that big afterall.

One of companies we own is a refrigeration company hence the name.

We do commercial and automotive including cars but mostly heavy vehicle like truck, earthmoving, freezer vans and trailers and containers.....and the odd boat and plane and a couple of deep sea drilling rigs.

Regards Richard

Richard
any decent fridgie knows or SHOULD KNOW that a condenser rejects heat!!!...it rejects the heat absorbed by the evaporator (and some other waste heat) to the ambient air.

the capacity of a condenser is expressed as heat rejection....or to be more precise "Q=total heat of rejection" . Check out the Bohn and others' Selection Procedures & data in your Heatcraft catalogue..mine is on page 108 of the 2002-2003 cat.

you are a wally if you truly are a fridgie....and do ARC need to reassess your abilities?

I don't think I would use the word REJECT as a general term.

I would of use dispel or remove heat, more people understand those words.

I Q= total heat rejection but rejection and reject mean two totally different things and the way you use reject was wrong.

Q also means total latent heat transfer and some people even use total heat transportation.

And why have you got an old heatcraft catalogue, the last one was 2006.

The guy who started this thread was asking about automotive air conditioning and your recommendation of using SP34e is OK but why would you use something that is more used in commercial applications then automotive.

As you know the condenser is there to remove heat from the refrigerant and in the process the refrigerant also changes state.

An air conditioning system is only a heat transferrer, removing heat from one area and moving it to another area.

I don't know why you didn't go into glide rates and confuse every one.

I know you are a very smart person and a lot smarter then me so if you want me to tell everyone that's fine all you have to do is ask!

The guy asked a simple question and I replied with an answer.

So I bow to you intelligence.......

Wally

do you have any idea what your talking about...

are you trying to tell me a condenser rejects latent heat?

it is not called heat transportation...hahaha...how absurd

THR is shown in the bohn techdata
here

look at page 7

so I think you must agree by now that a condenser rejects heat....if we are not rejecting the heat absorbed by the evaporator coil to the ambient what the hell are we doing then

ah! we stick it on a truck and transport outside ?



have a nice day Wally