'Blocks' throwing off tyres??

Submitted: Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 13:46
ThreadID: 54499 Views:1948 Replies:10 FollowUps:8
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There has been heaps of comments on here about some of the more popular (read: heavily advertised) tyres throwing off blocks from the tread.
I'm wondering what might be the cause of this.
Personal experience- I tried a set of these type of tyres for the first time on a trip to the Vic High Country a few weeks ago. They had about 2000km usage when I got them. I was very disappointed with the appearance after the trip.Image Could Not Be Found
Is it normal for the rear to suffer more??
Could it be sharp rocks being thrown from the front tyres into the rears ??
Without brand bashing- could there be a common cause for this??
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Reply By: Notso - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 14:05

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 14:05
Compound too hard, gets cold and brittle maybe?? Rips off on rocks, rear more susceptible because driven more than front unless in 4wd??
AnswerID: 287052

Follow Up By: Member -Signman - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 14:11

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 14:11
Dunno about the compound- they are as supplied.
As for temps...it was very warm (even overnight)..
Was in 4WD for all but on the blacktop..
Yes- some of the tracks were rough & rocky..but not necessarily any rockier than other areas I've been- with other 'conventional' non-block type tyres..
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FollowupID: 552278

Reply By: Robin Miller - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 14:17

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 14:17
As you could imagine Signman , a number of factors contribute to this including the rubber compound, its shape and depth.

Tyres in your picture are generally better than average.

But basically its caused by wheelspin and the stress of the
tyre tread when it deaccelerate as the wheel hits a rock edge.

Wheel articulation is a primary cause , and lowering tyre
pressure improves this.

Cars with leaf springs suffer more from it for the same reason.

Using 4wd as much as possible and using diff locks also reduces it.
Robin Miller

Member
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AnswerID: 287053

Reply By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 15:18

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 15:18
hey, you didn't mention what brand they were.....why's that? ;-)

Andrew
AnswerID: 287059

Follow Up By: Member -Signman - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 15:30

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 15:30
The inquiry is not really brand relevant- as it seems to be related to the 'blocky' type tyre, irrespective of brand...
FYI- B F Goodrich AllTerrain T/A KO
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FollowupID: 552286

Reply By: Stephen M (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 15:20

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 15:20
Look like BF's a/t's to me ?? That seems to be very excessive to me. I did 50k on mine on the old lux and they copped a hard time,rocks,shale,beach work, Vic high country, pressures up and down to suit, did a lot of off road Id say 30% of the 50k and didnt look like the ones in the picture. I reckon I would have got another 50 out of them only I sold it.I did have a few where the lugs were cut and gouged. I have fitted the same to the prado as I had such a good run with them on the hilux. So far havnt done nearly as much rough stuff with the prado so time will tell. I hope they dont end up like yours. Regards Steve M
AnswerID: 287060

Reply By: GaryW - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 16:29

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 16:29
Ref ThreadID: 35262 - I had a similar issue with some Dick Cepek FCIIs.

Relevant facts were.
Vic High Country rocky terrain
Tyres were 3+ years old with about 80,000-90,000ks on them
Low Tyre Pressures (18-20psi) on the day I lost blocks on all 4 tyres.
Air Lockers in.
Done the same tracks before without the same damage.

Only difference this time was lower pressures & age/wear of tyres.
AnswerID: 287069

Follow Up By: Member -Signman - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 16:52

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 16:52
Pressure not as low as that- aired down to about 28
Lockers used when required...
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FollowupID: 552292

Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:04

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:04
Quote from GaryW :"Air Lockers in."................

Gary, how often did you have the diff lockers "in"?

Diff lockers (selectable, eg: ARB or Prolocker) should only be used as a last resort and only for the shortest possible period of time. They should also only be used when traction is lost or likely to be lost (eg: you see a gnarly piece of track where you simply KNOW you're gunna be lifting a wheel or 2).....when you actually reach such a spot, then (and only then) should you engage your locker/s. To have them in when you are driving along with good traction, is simply asking for trouble with tyres and/or drive-train overload/wind-up.

I'm not saying you were using the lockers too much, it's just the way you sort of threw it into the conversation without adding the words "when needed" etc......

Sorry, I don't mean to preach either.

Roachie
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FollowupID: 552294

Follow Up By: GaryW - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:14

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:14
Sorry should have been clearer.

Lockers were in during difficult terrain where wear was most likely to occur. I'm not one for trying everything without lockers and then only using them as a last resort. I've got them so I use them which means I can take it easier and reduce slipping tyres significantly.

To be clear I do not use them unless I get a tyre slipping - but I'm quick to use them rather than keep trying with more grunt without them. Easier on vehicle etc..

I'm also quick to release the lockers particularly when turning.

On "when needed" thats a bit subjective because there are times I use them but don't "need" to - but to not use them would require higher speed or more chance of damage to vehicle - so I use them.

Hope thats clear.
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FollowupID: 552296

Reply By: Crackles - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:03

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:03
Rears lose more blocks & sustain more cuts because they are usually more heavily loaded particually climbing steep hills when the weight is transfered to the back. We see a similar wear out central Oz with overloaded vehicles too.
Over or under inflated tyres seem to increase the damage at times as well.
Cheers Craig...........
AnswerID: 287078

Reply By: Moose - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:28

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 17:28
G'day Signman
Had exactly the same thing with a set of another brand of tyres a few years ago. That was due to the hard compound. As they proved to be unsuitable for my purposes the dealer replaced them with something else.
It would certainly not be related to rocks being flung from front to rear - would take a lot more force than that to rip the lugs off.
Mine were worse on back also - due to the weight being on the rear when ascending rugged terrain.
Are you able to get a refund/exchange?
Cheers from the Moose
AnswerID: 287083

Reply By: On Patrol (East Coast) - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 18:02

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 18:02
Just face facts Dave, your old bus was struggling most of the time to keep up with us on those rocky and steep hills Ha Ha Ha.

Jokes aside David, you looked at my tyres at Talbotville and saw similar wear and chopping, some of those stones were pretty sharp down in Vic. plus I took a months wear off mine towing Bert up that hill.

Bite the bullet Dave, and get out of that Tojo mate.
Colin
AnswerID: 287088

Reply By: Wayne (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 18:51

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 18:51
Signman,

I had much the same problem as you.
While I was at the Queanbeyan 4WD show I spoke to the rep from the brand of tyres that I used and he said it has a lot to do with tyre pressure.
If the tyres are too hard they will not grip, combined with the Troopie suspension not as supple as most vehicles and the low down grunt that the Troopie has, something has to give.

You are pushing 3t up a rocky outcrop that is hard to walk over let alone drive a vehicle. When the tyres do get grip the vehicle is not going to leap forward like some light weight 4WD. Something has to give.

Better a tyre lug is broken away than the teeth in the gear box.

I will be down in the Vic High Country again next week. I am going to air down a bit more and see if there is any difference in tyre wear. I have a new set of STT so any damage will be from the VHC. I will let you know how I got on when I return next week.

Wayne
AnswerID: 287093

Follow Up By: On Patrol (East Coast) - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 19:30

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 19:30
G'day Wayne

You Lucky Lucky Ba8tard, is that trip 3 or 4 this season Wayne??

You really do know those tracks like the back of your hand, your descriptions were spot on, thanks mate.
Colin.
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FollowupID: 552314

Follow Up By: Member -Signman - Wednesday, Feb 13, 2008 at 08:26

Wednesday, Feb 13, 2008 at 08:26
Hi Wayne
Will be interested in your input after the next trip...
I was gonna add- do you need a navigator?? But you could probably do that trip with your eyes closed..
Cheers & have a good one
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FollowupID: 552370

Reply By: thepunter - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 19:28

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 19:28
In my opinion 28 is too high. You need to be down to 18-22. I do a lot of High Country trips on 285/75/16 STT's at 18 and have never had a problem. No lockers though. You need to have flexable tyers that roll over the rocks and not force against them - OMO! - it works for me.

David.
AnswerID: 287108

Follow Up By: On Patrol (East Coast) - Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 19:36

Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 at 19:36
David
I ran 23-25psi on the Patrol and while I had no traction problems at all, it did scrub the side walls a bit more than I was comfortable with, I did receive some chipping of lugs on my ATR's as well as Signman, on the same trip. Who knows.
Colin
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FollowupID: 552316

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