Ultimate Camper fridge replacement

Submitted: Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 18:18
ThreadID: 65846 Views:8631 Replies:8 FollowUps:31
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Hi, looking at replacing my RM2310 fridge in the ultimate. Leaning towards the RM2355, any experiences wit this fridge.

hanks
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Reply By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 19:17

Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 19:17
I don't recognise those codes, but I assume you are planning to replace a 3way fridge with another 3 way fridge???

I chucked mine in favour of a Engel upright jobbie. I installed a 2nd battery in parrallel and have never regretted the decision over the 4 years or so that it has been fitted. No more farting around with gas whenever we pull up for a few hours in the middle of the day or at the end of each day.

Each to their own, but I just can't see the appeal of the 3 way fridge.
AnswerID: 348361

Follow Up By: MEMBER - Darian (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:50

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:50
We too flogged off the 3 way and bought a Waeco 60L fridge for the car - much less 'management' needed. Re leveling - funny thing is that while mobile, a 3 way doesn't need to be level - just when its static. Anyway, in the van currently on order, we're going with a 150L 2 door compressor fridge and will back it up with the necessary batteries nd solar hardware to keep it going in the heat.

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Follow Up By: Ozrover - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 11:19

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 11:19
Yep. I chucked the Dometic we had in the camper & installed a Vitrifrigo compressor fridge (Danfoss compressor), the only problem we have had in the last two years is that I had to replace the Mobitronic after I drowned it up in the gulf (my fault, poor choice of mounting location).
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Reply By: Best Off Road - Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 20:26

Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 20:26
Check the rating.

If my memory serves me correctly the 2355 is rated "T" and will work a treat.

Avoid the 2350 like the plague, it is only rated ST and fails above 36 degrees.

A properly rated 3 way is indeed a joy to behold. No need for solar, generators, and battery banks that all cost a fortune.

Give Dometic a call to check its rating.

Jim.

AnswerID: 348379

Follow Up By: oldtrack123 - Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 23:06

Monday, Feb 09, 2009 at 23:06
Hi
Jim said"A properly rated 3 way is indeed a joy to behold. No need for solar, generators, and battery banks that all cost a fortune."

I'll add "& you can stay camped for as long as your gas lasts no worry about bats going flat , lack of sun , carrying fuel , park in shade.As long as it's level nothing to break down.

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Follow Up By: Gronk - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 00:10

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 00:10
As good as the 3 way is supposed to be.......try this simple test.......Camper sitting in approx 35deg plus.....3 way has 1 dozen beers in it......drink a six pack before say 3pm....put another warm six pack in and drink the still cold six pack before 5pm (2 people drinking, I can't drink that fast anymore ).....then see how cold the 1st warm six pack has gotten !!
If it isn't nice and cold ( approx 1 deg ) and you like to use it for this type of cooling then a compressor fridge is needed....

If on the other hand you don't need it to chill things down fast, then a 3 way is going to be adequate....especially if your not a beer drinker !!
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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 09:48

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 09:48
I guess it depends a lot on what type of travelling and camping you do.

In my case, when we are travelling, we tend to be on the road most days. Now, the roads we travel on tend not to be nice and flat. As far as I know, the 3 way fridges only work efficiently (or "at all") when they are sitting dead flat/level. This is not a situation that the fridge is likely to encounter when travelling and switched onto 12 volts.

On the other hand, for those people who tend to travel to a campsite, set-up and then stay in one place for a week or so, then the 3 way fridge is probably the better proposition...... provided the ambient temp is not too high (although I acknowledge that the newer versions of the 3 ways are apparently much better at coping with extreme temps).

The only other thing that used to peeve us with our 3 way camper fridge, was the hit and miss nature of the temp control. Sometimes the contents would be barely chilled at all, whilst on other occasions the bloody thing worked too well and the lettuce and tomatoes etc were stuffed from being frozen.

Cheers

Roachie
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Follow Up By: Member - Matt M (ACT) - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:05

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:05
Gronk,

Your test is not statistically or scientifically valid.

You would need to repeat it at least three times to ensure that the results are reliable. But then again, you're probably going to forget the outcome and have to start again the next day.

Matt.
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Follow Up By: Gronk - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:36

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:36
But I could do the same test 3 days running......but I already know the outcome lol....

Nothing worse than cracking a beer and it's not icy cold !!!!!
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 12:09

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 12:09
Roachie posted "As far as I know, the 3 way fridges only work efficiently (or "at all") when they are sitting dead flat/level. This is not a situation that the fridge is likely to encounter when travelling and switched onto 12 volts. "

This is not so. Each Dometic fridge is supplied with a round fridge level. Provided the bubble is within the green disk in the middle the fridge will work to its maximum efficiency. It will even work fairly well with some of the bubble over the green section. Even when stopped for the night between camp spots we block the van up level so we can get a good nights sleep, the fridge works efficiently when more off level than we like to sleep.

Fridges work effectively when travelling. The motion whilst travelling assists with the fluid and gas flow in the cooling unit.

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Reply By: jdwynn (Adelaide) - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 06:53

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 06:53
zzkazu, we were at the Ulti factory in Decemeber. I am sure they said latest Dometic automatically switched to gas / DC etc, whatever was available. So check if that's the case and if so you should do well. After all the $ we've spent setting up solar panels, buying exxy AGM's, reckon I could go for a quality 3-way now. Cheers
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Follow Up By: Gronk - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:56

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 10:56
The good 3 ways are pretty good " most " of the time.

.But....are they capable of pulling the temp down from 20 deg to zero on 12V....in approx 1/2 an hr..( or even 2 hrs ?? )

Will they hold the temp at 1 deg on a 38 deg day.....and having the door opened approx ten times during the day..

I like the simplicity of the 3 ways, but for a beer drinker, I haven't seen one that could suit my needs ??

I know people have improved the 12V current side of things, but has anybody got one working as well on 12V as they do on gas ??

But jdwynn.....if you buy a 3 way....can I have your solar panels ??
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Follow Up By: Best Off Road - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 11:50

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 11:50
"Will they hold the temp at 1 deg on a 38 deg day.....and having the door opened approx ten times during the day.. "

Yes they will. Mum and Dad's "T" rated 150 L Fridge in their flash Jayco was holding 0 on a 42 degree day with the thermostat on mid setting.

Our RM 2350, "ST" rated in our budget Jayco was running at 10.

The problem lies not with the fridges, rather with Caravan Builders who continue to fit units not suited to Australian conditions.

Cheers,

Jim.


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Follow Up By: jdwynn (Adelaide) - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 16:31

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 16:31
Gronk, we did in fact check price of replacing our 110l compressor Waeco with a 3-way. That was also not cheap and presented us with some logistical issues. I think in the long term panels will be good - just taken some effort & $ to set up. So I'm keeping them.........cheers
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Reply By: Isuzumu - Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 11:38

Tuesday, Feb 10, 2009 at 11:38
The first question I always ask in this situation is "do you only have one fridge?"
I have two an old RM 2 way in the van and a Waeco 80 Litre in the back of the rig. We only use the RM for salads/veg etc, I do not run it on gas while travelling but have a sealed container in the freezer of the RM to keep it cool while we are moving, use the RM to freeze it while stationary.
Basically only have to worry about the battery on the Waeco.

Cheers Bruce
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Reply By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 10:23

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 10:23
Hi Hanks

Roachie has given you a good response from one fellow
Ultimate owner. We have one of the early ones - no 10 -
and changed our fridge last year - best thing we have done
with the camper which we love. The waeco 110l is the best
swap I think. Certainly works well for us. You just need to add
A second battey and charger.

If you're in Melbourne drop over and have a look.

Cheers

Peter


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Reply By: Nomadic Navara - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 11:52

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 11:52
This thread has brought out the usual rabble who have accepted that the van manufacturer installed the fridge correctly. Most manufacturers take scant notice of Dometics instructions. They then attempt to correct the problem with the fan fix - which also does not do much. If they had secured a copy of the installation instructions and modified their van, their fridges would have worked satisfactorily.

Instead they purchased a compressor fridge and install it by following the instructions - so it works OK. They then become vocal on forums saying Dometic fridges fail to operate correctly. The only thing that I see that has failed is their own investigative skills and their ability to fix problems caused by others.

They then have to increase their battery systems (if they are off power campers.) This probably has been at least another $1,000 cost. In all probabilities it has also made their van overloaded (if it was not that way in the first place.) Did they weigh their van in travelling trim after the changes? I bet most did not.

Jim and Roachie raised or answered the question of fridge ratings. To the best of my knowledge all Dometic fridges except the smallest are "T" rated. The standard to which absorption fridges are rated also applies to compressor fridges. I hope that the members of the compressor fridge brigade checked the ratings on their fridges before they purchased them. Some Waeco fridges are "T" rated. I believe all Vitrifrigo models are "N" rated.

zzkazu

For your own peace of mind, check the climate rating of the fridge before purchase. As you are having your fridge changed over you have the perfect chance to check the installation. If there is any gap at the sides and top then pack the void with insulation or corrugated cardboard. Check to see that there is not too much clearance between the cooling fins and the side of the van, the smaller the gap the more air you can force through them. Check that the cavity height above the top fins is sufficient and the top vent is at the top of this cavity - if this fails the specifications you will have the fridge out and can easily modify your van - this will be much cheaper than a huge solar installation and upgrade to the chassis to carry the extra weight.

Once you have your fridge up and working you too will be able to thumb your nose at those too incompetent to get their absorption fridges operating to specification.

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Follow Up By: Best Off Road - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 15:27

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 15:27
As a compressor fridge owner I totally concur with whar Peter has said. If a big enough "T" rated portable fridge was available I would ditch our Waeco 80 in a heartbeat.

So far our investment in keeping stuff cold exceeds $4000. That is the fridge, dual battery system, Solar Panel, Battery Charger and Generator (for when there is no sun). That is absurd.

When we evetually get back into a Caravan it will be fitted with a 150L "T" rated 3 way fridge. For bush camping, a good old fashioned gas lantern for outside.

I'm sick to bloody death of moving solar panels about all day, checking battery voltage to see if I need to fire up the gennie. Then running a lead off into the bush to stick the gennie well away so that the noise doesn't bother anyone etc. Then pack it all away on departure.

Jim.

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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 16:54

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 16:54
Peter

The gas fridges in Ultimates are installed to specs - as you describe. They just don't cope with touring where they rn most of the time on 12v. Many of us have tried believe me! And neither I nor Roachie are incompetant in this area.

For our use the compressor fridge solution with 2 batteries that will allow for 3 days sitting and then run superbly when traveling is by far the best solution. Horses for courses I guess.

Cheers

Peter
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Follow Up By: Best Off Road - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:05

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:05
Peter,

I just had a look at the Ultimate Website.

They are fitting the RM2350 which is only rated "ST" and no matter how well it is installed it will not keep cold at above 35C.

What I say about the useless RM2350 is not my opinion, it was what I was told by the technical guru at Dometic. When I say useless, I mean useless in Australian conditions.

To call yourself "Ultimate" and then fit a fridge that is the furthest thing from being the ultimate is somewhat ironic. Not acceptable in a 50 grand camper.

Cheers,

Jim.

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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:13

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:13
Jim

My response was to the Nomadic Navara chap who appeared to maintain that if installed correctly then a dometic would work ok.

Sure - ours worked ok - not well on gas. But as I said above not effectively on 12v which is required in the heat of the day up north.

Would the T rated models be any better on 12v?

An added advantage of having the new fridgeis that our gas bottle now lasts for 10 weeks for cooking.

Cheers

Peter
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Follow Up By: Best Off Road - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:23

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:23
Peter,

Yes, the T rated fridges work well on 12 volt. My parents one held temp fine on 10 hour trips.

Your point about gas useage is valid. They will get through a 9 kg bottle in 2 to 3 weeks depending on size. So if you are planning a very long remote trip it could be an issue.

Might see you at Wandin. We're going again, must be mad, it's bound to be 40 degrees as ever LOL.

Cheers,

Jim.



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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:33

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 17:33
OK Jim. Will see you there if it's an OK day.

Yeah, our outback trips often involve up to 3 weeks out in the bush and away form gas refills/exchanges. Plus the daily running is plenty to top up the batteries.

I had a look at the dometic site and the only difference I can see between their 90l models is that the 2355 automatically senses heat source. I wonder if the heat units are the same? There isn't much difference in price.

A good debate on a key issue for us Ultimate owners. For us at least the Waeco is the Wae to go.

Peter
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Follow Up By: jdwynn (Adelaide) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 18:13

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 18:13
Hi Peter and Jim

We’ve got the 110l Waeco. I'm not wishing to be a wise guy but I have been through the electrical set up in a bit of detail this last year, and the following details are what I have based my electrical calc’s on in part.

I emailed Waeco who informed me the fridge uses an “average of 2.8 – 3.2apms per hour, this is with 5 degrees in the fridge section, -12 in the freezer section and an ambient of 32degrees”. I asked for a 24 hour average so (not having measured it) I assume that’s what they gave me. Based on that the fridge alone will take 72ahr a day. Using 2/100ahr AGM’s, taking them down 30% (general recommendation) gives 60ahrs, meaning you get less than a day from the batteries. Hence we’ve added 160w of solar to the equation. Give or take, depending on the season / location, I calculate we will get about 4 days max.

Still putting it together so haven’t tested it yet. If anyone reckons this all wrong let me know. cheers
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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 19:00

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 19:00
Hi JD

If we assume that the fridge uses an average of 3 amps per hour - 72AH per day and you have 2 x 100AH batteries then this wwill leave you with 56AH when the fridge has run for 2 days.

200 - (2x72) = 56

I think you will find that actual usage is less than this with the fridge set to 5.

We easily get 2 days and into with use of our solar panel.

160W of solar will give you heaps more than 4 days.

160W of panels would produce about 8amps at least so it depends on how long you have it connected to charge I guess. If you're camped for a few days and can get sun for much of the day the you should keep the batteries pretty full.

Cheers

Peter
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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 19:01

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 19:01
Sorry - that should have been 2 days and into 3

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Follow Up By: jdwynn (Adelaide) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 19:24

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 19:24
Peter, 56/200 is 72% draw down. Most advise that you draw down not more than 30% or risk killing the batteries. So at this stage that's what I'm working on. Anyway we're pretty well set up now. cheers
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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 20:03

Wednesday, Feb 11, 2009 at 20:03
JD

From my reading we can easily use 50% from AGMs and if fridge AH use is less than 3 you will have no problems.

Peter
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Follow Up By: zzkazu - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 07:48

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 07:48
I have actually contacted Ultimate and the claim is the new fridges are topical rated. I have read else where that there is no official tropical rated fridges in Australia in the 90 litre range and below. So maybe more a manufactures claim

I also don't see any difference between the RM2350 and RM2355 from a cooling perspective. However I dont want to spend $k's and have to camp where power is , so 3 way for me is the go..

btw didn't mean to start a war..
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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 08:54

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 08:54
Hanks

Given the cost of the gas and 12v fridges are about the same then the only additional cost is the batteries and a charging system. We have a manageable size solar panel to use when we are stopped for a few days and an inverter generator to use when needed.

We certainly don't camp where power is available.

A friend who travels with us is also changing his fridge over to a Waeco after seeing how effective ours was on our PIlbara trip last year.

As I said earlier this has been an interesting topic. It's always good to hear the views of others.

Peter
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Follow Up By: zzkazu - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 12:34

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 12:34
Peter do you know if waeco's have been installed in ultimate campers?
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Follow Up By: jdwynn (Adelaide) - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 12:54

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 12:54
zzkazu, 110L Waeco in our Ulti was installed at the factory (its an option). During a tour of the new Ultimate factory in December their electrician said of the 2-3 campers they produce each week, less than a dozen have a compressor fridge each year, so they are not real common. cheers
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 17:07

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 17:07
Peter McG - re FollowUp 2 of 15

The modern Dometic fridges have 12 V elements that are the same wattage as 240 V elements (up to the 150 ltr models.) See. These ones also have the 12 V element controlled by the thermostat. The problem when you are travelling is related again to poor installation. Generally fridge wiring from the tug is too light to maintain the 3% maximum voltage drop that all installations should be designed for. With a modern Dometic fridge and heavy enough cable from the alternator you should have no problems with fridge cooling.

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Follow Up By: Peter McG (Member, Melbourne) - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 17:53

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 17:53
PeterD - re Followup 16 of 16

I guess that the new ones must have been changed significantly then from the one we had fitted - a 1996 model. As I said earlier installation by Ultimate is by the book - including wiring. Voltage loss from our Patrol to the battery in the camper is around 0.3V when running.

Cheers

Peter
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Reply By: snailbait (Blue mntns) - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 14:50

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 14:50
Hi ET ALL
My 2 Bobs worth
One of the factors in keeping Frigs operating is the charge to the Baterys I have found
1 the cables are too light to take the charge
2 the vehicle alternator goes to sleep when the starting battery is full and only a trickle charge goes to the 2nd or Third bat
3 you all may do this, keep the headlight on in the daylight this will make alternator wake up and supply a decent charge to the 2nd and third bat.
Terry
ps
I think taht te RM 2355 have the control's on the top of the fridge where the RM2310 has the controls at the bottom
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 17:15

Thursday, Feb 12, 2009 at 17:15
Regarding point 2, the alternator regulator does not monitor the state of the battery. The alternator output voltage is controlled by a temperature sensor in the regulator. When it gets hot the assumption is that the battery is hot also - after all they are both under the same bonnet. A hot battery needs less voltage to charge it than a cold one. If the alternator did not have this temperature compensation in it the battery would be boiled dry.

Because of that your point 3. does not apply.

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Reply By: Findanomad - Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 at 15:29

Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 at 15:29
We picked up our Ultimate in December 08 and went for the 2355 as an upgrade to the now standard 2350.
It automatically checks for gas, then 240 then 12v. No having to changeover when ever you stop.
This worked like a charm when travelling and stopping each day.
Just had 10 days on fraser and the gas worked well on a 4 setting temp and certainly freezed ice packs each night.
Cheers
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Follow Up By: zzkazu - Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 at 21:33

Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 at 21:33
What does setting 4 equate too? 70% of the range?
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Follow Up By: Findanomad - Wednesday, Feb 18, 2009 at 10:10

Wednesday, Feb 18, 2009 at 10:10
Temp settings are 1 to 5 with 5 being the coldest. We had it on 3 for the first 5 or 6 days then moved up to 4 as we started to take the remaining meat out of the tropical esky and utilise the fridge.
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