Holden Rodeo 3.2L V6 1998

Submitted: Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 21:38

ThreadID: 66356 Views:18445 Replies:11 FollowUps:16

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Staffwild

I hope someone might be able to help and I have crawled through the threads on here....

We have a 1998 3.2L V6 Rodeo with 260 000 on the clock, it has been running beautifully with no dramas for the last 2 yrs, then a couple of weeks ago, the OH put in a tank of fuel (was close to empty) from a reopened servo. Car drove normal for 30klms, turned into our driveway and stalled basically, that was it, it will crank but just not fire, we got a slight fire with alot of pumping on the accelerator so figured must be a bad tank of fuel. Got out the tow truck, towed to a mechanic, who drained the tank, changed filters still won't fire, changed spark plugs (extremely worn and black), and checked compression, one side were all around 175 psi, the other side were around the 105psi mark.... So he pulls the timing cover off to make sure it hasn't jumped a cog, nope that is fine.... Sends her off to an auto electrics as there are no error codes and he is scratching his head basically..... Auto electrician finds the CAS sensor plug has been knocked off while the mechanic was fiddling, so fixes that, still won't fire.... Cleans the injectors as he felt that might be an issue. Still won't fire, so he sends it back to the mechanics (the car has now been there for two weeks).......The mechanic says maybe its broken a camshaft so he checks that and says nope that looks to be fine, but you have a fair bit of sludge in the motor...... You will be best to buy a new car or a new engine (quoted $6000 for a 3.5L V6 replacement)....

Any ideas, I am bewildered that it ran fine until this tank of fuel and now i need a new motor lol.... Timing belt was replaced at 180 000 as was the water pump. The car has never used a drop of oil or water since I bought 4yrs ago (110 000 klms).....

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Reply By: Malleerv - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:06

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:06

Fuel pump working?? Sounds like a silly question but if its fuel related like you think dirty fuel can stuff up a fuel pump.

Interesting that you say it fired slightly while you pumped the accelerator. Aren't these EFI? Moving the accelerator in theory will do nothing as they have no accelerator pump like a carby engine. Must have been coincidence.

AnswerID: 351419

Reply By: Madfisher - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:12

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:12

Has anyone checked to make sure the computor has not died. The fact that you had just refueled may just be a coincidence. I expect the mechanic made sure it has spark.
Goodluck Pete

AnswerID: 351421

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:16

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:16

Their is some cluey chaps on the australia 4wdForum and go to the isuzu section.
CXheers Pete

FollowupID: 619682

Reply By: Staffwild - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:22

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:22

I am guessing the mechanic would've checked the fuel pump when he started to work on it..... He did clean the entire fuel system out and pretty much just washed his hands of it now....But the Auto Electrician said its getting fuel to the injectors so i guess it has to be working lol....

Ummm again I am hoping the Auto Electrician checked the computer as that was why the Mechanic sent it there incase it was the computer or something electrical...

It has spark, it has fuel according to them, low compression on one side, and no fire.... Its weird here it coughed and spluttered into life for a split second and they are now saying it wont fire.... No error codes, nothing that says hello I am buggered, please replace, all the mechanic says is high mileage, sludge and get a new motor or car lol....

Thanks heaps for the replies.....

AnswerID: 351423

Follow Up By: Lex M (Brisbane) - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:26

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:26

Maybe you should change the mechanic...

FollowupID: 619684

Follow Up By: Staffwild - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:27

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:27

Hahahah yes that was pretty much what I told him today, but in Bathurst we are sort of limited to who we can use and after two weeks hire car, mechanic and auto electrician bills, I am slowly emptying the bank account and don't want to be told that they have no idea for a fee ever again LOL....

FollowupID: 619685

Follow Up By: Lex M (Brisbane) - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:38

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:38

Logically the only thing that would put compression down on one side is cam shaft timing or intake manifold obstruction(unlikely).
I'd be going for a timing problem but you said that was checked.
I've seen experienced mechanics get that wrong.
That would also explain failure to run. Timing sensors out of time etc.
Assuming that it has fuel and spark.
That's not hard to check.

FollowupID: 619688

Follow Up By: Staffwild - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:45

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:45

It's still at the mechanics, he gave us his advice this arvy and I pretty much walked out and said i would ring him to say tow it here or there and pay the bill.... It might just pay to give it to someone else with all the receipts (i am getting them itemised with every single thing he has done) and see if they can isolate it....

Spark - yep, fuel - yep lol i tripled checked both with both the mechanic and auto electrician.

FollowupID: 619689

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 09:13

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 09:13

Staffwild Did not realise that you are from Bathurst. What Mechanic is it at. Mark at Mick oheihir in princes st is the best Isuzu tech in Bathurst, do not speak to Danial.Did you get the fuel from the bottom of Rocket St.
I do not believe your motor is stuffed as the compressions on one bank are perfect, The other bank is down but still all the same. If worn they are all over the place usually. Heaps of stuff arround to get rid of sludge. Cem on this site or Bitron should clean it out as well.
I have found Mark to be very honest and I am often surprised how little he charges for l;abour.
Good luck Pete

FollowupID: 619719

Reply By: Member - Rob S (NSW) - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:27

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:27

The mechanic says maybe its broken a camshaft so he checks that and says nope that looks to be fine, but you have a fair bit of sludge in the motor...... You will be best to buy a new car or a new engine (quoted $6000 for a 3.5L V6 replacement)....

If that is the best answer the mechanic could come up with is to replace the motor.
Get towed some were else, even a Holden dealer might be worth a go.
6K to replace the motor tell him he's dreaming!

Rob.

I only ever made one mistake
and that's when I thought I was wrong!

Lifetime Member
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AnswerID: 351425

Reply By: Staffwild - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:31

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 22:31

I rang Holden and asked them about it and their costs, they said diagnostics are free, I said ok what if the computer says no error code and you have to go searching, they told me $90/hr LOL sorta scared me off, but I am of the mind, they built it lol they can bloody find out.... AT the end of the day if they say this is wrong, you need a new motor I can live with that, but to be told I have no idea, you need a new motor just doesn't sit well with me.... Should add i am female and blonde, so I get the feeling they are just screwing me around .......

AnswerID: 351426

Follow Up By: Member - Rob S (NSW) - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 23:08

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 23:08

Being female and blonde shouldn't matter I'm big and ugly
and still get screwed around.
270000 klm is a few klm's but generaly if the the engine has had a good service history it still should be ok. and will only be something electrical or a fuel problem.
If you say you are Bathurst give Holden a go as they should be able to sort the fault out quickly or have a better idear.
Member Madfisher who replied is a holden fan he is located in Bathurst as well and may be of some assistance.

I only ever made one mistake
and that's when I thought I was wrong!

Lifetime Member
My Profile My Blog Send Message

FollowupID: 619692

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 09:23

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 09:23

Goodday Rob,
The chap I recommended was trained on holdens and isuzus, use to work up their. Personally A dealer is the last place I would go in Bathurst. We have just changed all our work cars servicing to chapman motors at the bottom of lambert st. The dealers can not even get their billing right. I interested to find out where it is currently.
Cheers Pete

FollowupID: 619720

Follow Up By: Staffwild - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 11:36

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 11:36

If you can pm me Pete, I will let you know, but I am don't have a membership here atm, so can't pm you to give it to you. I can't outright say the current guy is a twit, but I still think 2 weeks to tell me it is stuffed is a joke when he knows we are paying $85/day for a hire car as that one is our only car and time is really really important.....I do know however it sat at the Auto Electricians for 7 days, and they only spent an hour on it and had the injectors cleaned??? I called both the Electricians and Mechanic daily wanting an answer on what was wrong, when could I expect it back and reminded them that I was paying $85/day for a hire car and really still feel like they screwed me around....

FollowupID: 619735

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 12:07

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 12:07

Hi Staffwild,
Went for a drive, and spotted it if it is the white d/cab on the trailer.
Have a talk to mark first, before taking it there, they are very busy.
I really think the current mechanic has no idea whats wrong. I suspect if the fuel was dirty the fuel pump is not delievering enough pressure.
Keep the fuel as you should be able to be compensated by the servo for your expenses.
I only ever run premium in our Jacks, works out cheaper in the long run.
My mobile no is 0432370735.
One of the problems with modern cars is the motors are incredidably complex and only the most competent are up to speed, and a lot do not know much about isuzus in general.
We had problems with a brand nerw truck at work yesterday, when the mechanic plugged his scan gauge in it gave 160 diff possibilities of what was wrong, mechanic was pulling his hair out.
Sorry need to be a member to pm you but give me a ring, I am off work this morning.
Cheers Pete

FollowupID: 619740

Reply By: Staffwild - Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 23:19

Friday, Feb 27, 2009 at 23:19

Thanks, I think a trip to Holden with strict, do not spend hours and charge me a fortune to tell me you have no idea is in order lol.... Hopefully they find the problem pretty quick...

AnswerID: 351437

Follow Up By: Oldsquizzy (Kununurra) - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 00:14

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 00:14

First two things are spark and injection pulse, after that fuel pressure, Flow does'nt equate to pressure. after that cambelt and timing after these are checked and found to be ok you should get some reaction from the engine ie:- run , backfire, a slight kick.

After the valves open and the fuel squirts and there is a spark. There should be some type of bang. After all that is the basic four strokes. Suck squeeze bang blow.
Ask your "mech" if he has used a noid light and checked injection pulse.

FollowupID: 619700

Reply By: Member - Tony B (Malanda FNQ) - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 08:48

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 08:48

Staffwild. Bummer Hey! You would have to think filling up at the new servo was connected with the problem. As said above I would be looking at thwe pulse & fuel pressure, who knows how well everything was cleaned out?
You had an auto electrician look at this so this may not help, but hey its worth a try! Thinking outside the square, I had a similar fault in a vehicle some time ago and after doing many things I looked at the fuses. Went through them all and all were OK - Bummer I said. More checking the car over but it should have been working. So pulled all the fuses out again and cleaned the connections - Yes! - put it back together and off we went (It was one of the ignition fuses that turned out to be the one). As it was an older car, over a period of time you can get a corrosion coating on the connections all looks good but there is no contact! Worth a try I would say. Cheers Tony

AnswerID: 351458

Reply By: Staffwild - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 11:24

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 11:24

Thanks heaps for the replies....

Yes the fuel was from Rocket St (mobil i think its under now) lol near the rail lines.... First time he filled up there and was just above empty so a full tank of E10 that was horribly dirty, we have the fuel still............

I might get the current dude to tow it to Mark at Mick Oheihir.... Umm I really don't want to bag the mechanic out until I find out the problem lol and I have the car back also and paid whatever he currently wants to charge me to get the car back......

I agree that I don't think its totally dead, but I've already had this arguement once with the Mechanic in his shop, I felt like smacking him in the head for treating me like a dumb female and smiling when I said that a car just don't die like that lol.....

AnswerID: 351473

Follow Up By: Staffwild - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 11:28

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 11:28

And if they do LOL least tell me exactly why, just don't say well I dunno, something must be wrong internally...... (keeping in mind it turns over nicely, just won't fire)

FollowupID: 619734

Follow Up By: Member - Tony B (Malanda FNQ) - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 13:55

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 13:55

If it turns out to be dirty fuel you are entitled to a claim for repairs! Keep that in mind. Cheers TONY

FollowupID: 619757

Reply By: Staffwild - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 20:14

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 20:14

A big thank you Pete for the conversation today, great to talk to someone that knows people in the area.... I was getting ready to call my old mechanic in Brisbane and start asking for a phone diagnosis lol.....

A huge thank you to everyone that replied, I will update with the solution if we ever find it LOL...

AnswerID: 351549

Follow Up By: Madfisher - Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 22:06

Saturday, Feb 28, 2009 at 22:06

Glad to be of help Staffy. Still would not hurt to talk to your old mechanic. Hope it is sorted soon
Cheers Pete

FollowupID: 619816

Reply By: bordertrek - Sunday, Mar 01, 2009 at 13:50

Sunday, Mar 01, 2009 at 13:50

Hi Staffwild. If the compression is that low (105psi) on one bank of cylinders I'd say it could be a blown head gasket or cracked inlet manifold gasket where it joins that cylinder head. The inlet manifold gasket on these is a special plastic and they can split especially under stress like coughing and backfiring.
As for the fuel, definitely sounds like bad fuel you got, especially if the servo has recently reopened. The storage tanks have most likely been condensating while empty and maybe rusting as well, and the water and crap gets mixed in the fuel.
If it made the car cough and splutter and backfire it is very likely that can cause a gasket to blow. Water in fuel gives those symptons!
I have a 98 3.2 Rodeo as well. Top rig too.
By the way, Holden dont make Rodeo's or Jackeroo's etc. They are made by Isuzu Japan which is why they are such a good rig. They just have a Holden badge on them.
The late Rodeo's and new Colorado's with a V6 do have the Holden 3.6 Alloytec motor though.
Cheers, Dave

AnswerID: 351655

Follow Up By: bordertrek - Sunday, Mar 01, 2009 at 13:53

Sunday, Mar 01, 2009 at 13:53

Forgot to mention too that to check for compression leaks, you have to pressurise each cylinder with an air compressor through each plug hole with all four valves closed as you do each one. Then check for air leaking into the sump or cooling system or out the exhaust. Should point the mechanic in the right direction.
Cheers

FollowupID: 619866

Reply By: Staffwild - Monday, Mar 02, 2009 at 07:55

Monday, Mar 02, 2009 at 07:55

Thanks, I am going to get it taken elsewhere as soon as I can sort that side of it out, I just haven't given up totally on getting it running again lol....

Heaps of suggestions I have written down now, so hopefully one of them is correct and it's on the road and going again this week. On an interesting and amusing note, while sitting in a Holden Dealership yesterday when they were trying to sell us a car, one of the staff came in and asked what was going on with our car, told him and he said you need to replace the entire fuel lines when you have that problem lol then said $3500 to do so....

AnswerID: 351818

Follow Up By: Staffwild - Wednesday, Mar 04, 2009 at 17:03

Wednesday, Mar 04, 2009 at 17:03

A quick follow up, car has been towed elsewhere, but here is the 1st mechanics report........

Spark - Ok
Injection Pulse - Ok
Drain Fuel - Water present
Flush Lines, Replace Fuel Filter
Remove Spark Plugs and Replace - Tips worn excessively
No Codes on Scan Tool
Connect Fuel Pressure & Flow Guage - 240kpa/ 1.2L/pm - ok
Check CAS and Cam Shaft Position - Ok
Conduct Compression Test -
R/H (drivers) 1 - 105, 3 - 100, 5 - 115
L/H 2 - 170, 4 - 175, 6 - 175
Remove timing belt cover & Check cam timing - ok
Remove R/H Tappet cover to check for broken camshaft or drive pins - appears ok, severe sludging in top of engine

Suspect internal fault with engine, recommend replacement engine.
Timing case centre nut was seized on - had to be cut off to remove. (WTF)

FollowupID: 620389