Dang permits

Submitted: Monday, May 25, 2009 at 20:54
ThreadID: 69176 Views:2221 Replies:4 FollowUps:10
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I think the Central Land Council should be applauded for how they have made the permit system so efficient.

Last week I applied online on Wednesday and had the permit on Thursday!

Bob
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Reply By: Member - Mick O (VIC) - Monday, May 25, 2009 at 21:11

Monday, May 25, 2009 at 21:11
I think the DIA in WA have an even quicker system these days. They seem to have pioneered the On-line permit system. Thank goodness the CLC have implemented a similar system. It was a fax system not too far back (like last year).

Cheers MIck
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trip would doubtless be attended with much hardship.''
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Reply By: Robin Miller - Monday, May 25, 2009 at 22:06

Monday, May 25, 2009 at 22:06
Maybe its time to try for Colson track again !
Robin Miller

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Reply By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 08:34

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 08:34
We shouldnt need them at all!! Michael
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Follow Up By: Ray - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 09:10

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 09:10
Agree. We have developed into a racial country by legislation. We condemned South Africa for their racial polices now we have it here only in reverse
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Follow Up By: The Top End Explorer - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 09:19

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 09:19
Some of the posts on this site, go to show that ignorance id bliss.

I could try to explain why permits are needed, but I fear some of you wouldn't understand, and or care.

Steve.
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Follow Up By: Member - Black Mac - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 09:29

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 09:29
Steve

Try us.

Jock
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 10:34

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 10:34
Steve,
Maybe what I should have said was, "should we have them at all" ? Michael
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Follow Up By: D200Dug- Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 11:24

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 11:24
I have no problem with permits. If someone wanted to drive through my backyard I would like them to ask first.
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Follow Up By: Michael ( Moss Vale NSW) - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 13:44

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 13:44
D200 Dug, i understand the principle behind it but surely in modern times, there could be a better way.. Michael
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Follow Up By: Bob of KAOS - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 22:22

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 22:22
Topend Explorer and D200Dug

While I understand the rationale behind permits I can see the damage they have done.

The communities that are shielded from exposure to the public are the worst for substance abuse, violence, poor nutrition-- whatever index of social decline you care to choose.

The communities that are more open have progressed. cf Yuendumu

The analogy with your backyard is weak. At least you can drive along the roads between private properties. Whole tracts of Australia are closed off. Eg the whole top of South Australia. If you wanted to drive from Marla to Warakurna you would have to go via the NT (with a permit) because the APY people say 'no way Jose'.

As a direct result, the APY communities are exploited by certain individuals who have exclusive rights, and have the worst violence, substance abuse, poverty, malnutrition etc etc anywhere in the Western World.

Whoever is responsible for the humanitarian disaster that is the APY Lands should one day have to answer for their crimes against humanity.

Bob Allan (a disgusted Australian)
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Follow Up By: D200Dug- Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 22:53

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 22:53
It is a sad and difficult problem and there ( unfortunately ) is no simple answer, I wish there was one.

The permits have not done the damage nor has any single event or decision. My son spent 5 years in the wester desert of WA as a cop working with indigenous people and I have worked with them on and off all my working life.

I think the state of some communities is appalling but again their is no simple answer and none has been found by any indigenous people anywhere in the world who are facing similar problems.

There has to be a balance found between paternalism ( total control like in the mission days ) and total freedom without responsibility.

The best and most optimistic people I have talked to think the problems will take generations to solve and that it will be a long and difficult process for all involved.

Sadly we have not made a good start and we need to catch up on they decade of neglect we have just experienced. Followed by the short burst of extreme paternalistic vote grabbing policy just before the last election.


I do not know what the answer is, but I think we all need to have some understanding and compassion for how Aboriginal people feel about their land.

PS I use the backyard analogy because I used to have a property with a good fishing creek running through it. I had no problem with people asking if they could fish in the creek but would get upset when I found people who had not asked my permission, camping, chopping down trees, lighting fires and making a mess on my land. I think you will find many Aboriginal people feel the same way. if you ask the right way, their right way, ( this may take months to get to know them) you are usually made welcome in their communities I know I have. If you just ask for access "Whitefella way" then you usually don't get it.
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Reply By: cobber - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 15:41

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 15:41
I agree I applied for my permits to do the Great Central Road, online got the WA permit in one day and the NT permit within the hour, excellent service...............I have spoken to a few people who never applied for permits to do the Great Central Road, and were never asked to show the permit...........Has anyone ever been stopped and asked to produce their permit?
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Follow Up By: Peter_n_Margaret - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 17:04

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 17:04
FACT: We always get proper permits, and have done so for 20 years. In recent times, sometimes for half a dozen different areas each year.
FACT: We have never been asked to produce one, ever.
OPINION: This (or any other) forum is not the place to even begin to debate the necessesity or desirability or any other aspect of permits.

Cheers,
Peter
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Follow Up By: Bob of KAOS - Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 22:27

Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 22:27
Cobber

Like Peter, we always obtain permits. We were asked in Jamieson a couple of years ago. (only time)

Peter, I think permits are core business of a website called ExplorOz. There is a hell of a lot you can't explore, let alone traverse, because of the permit system.

Bob
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