Road Rules - Turning accross the road to angle park?

Not that I have found - Cheers

Not an easy one :-)

What chance would car B have of seeing car A considering they are looking down the road? Is a car coming sideways across the road counted as coming down the road?

Car A is a ute and Car B is a Toyota Landcruiser Station Wagon.

Cheers

He got it too and was not involved.

My car was, but I was not driving it (Car A) - My wife lent it to a mate ;-) Typical

That sounds reasonable Fred - Cheers

I'm with Fred. Both are in the wrong.

Road Rules - Turning across the road to angle park?

Thats the question :-) What rule would cover it?

I am swinging towards both being wrong as per the above thread. That sounds reasonable.

Cheers

I'm with you, car "A" is doing a "U" turn. in NSW "U" turns not allowed unless sign posted.
Car "A" is also crossing into the opposite lane and its his responsibility to ensure that lane is clear.

MY 2 CENTS

Car A is not doing a U turn, a U turn is 180 degrees.

Car B is at fault regardless of anything else, a vehicle reversing must give way to all traffic.

Disco.

Disco driver,

If there is not a right turn into a street or driveway, then Car "A" is is accessing a parking spot that is available from the other direction.
If the parking spot was parallel it would be a full 180 degree, just because its 135 degree (which is a lot more than 90 degree or right turn) does not mean it is NOT a U turn.

Car "A" is crossing a broken white line and must not do so unless that lane is clear.

Car "B" is reversing into his lane, he is not crossing into another lane or crossing the road.

Just think about it if you ar not turning into another street, or a property or driveway then you are not performing a lawful turn.

Reversing from a 45 degree parking bay, you will look to the direction of the traffic in your lane so looking left, not for people crossing the the line from you right.

In NSW the offence's can be.

If U turn is allowed.
Rule 37 (b) Driver not safely begin U-turn without obstructing traffic* $197 and 2 demerit points
Rule 38 Make U-turn without giving way to vehicle/pedestrian* $253 and 3 demerit points
Rule 39 (1) Make U-turn at break in dividing strip contrary to sign* $197 and 2 demerit points

If U turn is not allowed.
Rule 132 (1) Not keep left of centre on two-way road $253 fine and 3 demerit points
Rule 132 (2) Not keep left of dividing line 5 253 fine and 3 demerit points
Rule 132 (2A) Drive across dividing lines to perform U-turn 253 fine and 3 demerit points

With a possible
Not give way (move from one line of traffic to another) or Not give way (diverges left or right within marked lane) Rule 148 $253 and 3 demerit points.


NSW General Driving Offences - Effective 28 September 2009

TJ, I'm not so sure - obviously it worked out well for you in that case but it will come down to whether the other vehicle is performing a u-turn or whether it is leaving the road (entering a road-related area ie. parking area at the side of the street).

Image Could Not Be Found
This diagram from p129 of the Australian Road Rules (available here) indicates that driving across a single continuous dividing line is permitted to enter or leave the road (example 2A), even to enter a road-related area (example 2B).

If it is determined to be a u-turn then it's a different matter because that is NOT permitted over a continuous line.

I could add that when he struck us the wife had spotetd him and hit the anchors. It was clear that the way he tried to zip around us that he was trying to beat us backing out, He even said that after the stack. In fact he said way too much which aided me greatly. I mentioned all of this when we made our claim. Even though we had been reversing and stopped he knew he was wrong for trying to shoot around us to get to the angle park on our left.He even apologised. Just goes to show how grey some of these sorts of stacks are when it comes to liability.

Had it been a question of criminal law he may be in the right as per the info you provided above. As for liability, our Insurer was happy to fix our car with no excess payable and no loss of NCD.

Hmm, Spellcheck!

exactly what I reckon

Spot on.

In Qld car B would be in the wrong on two counts. Reversing without due care and attention and failing to give way when leaving a parked position.

Car A would also be to blame for failing to give way when leaving a road to park.

Car B would probably be breached.

A car doing a U turn also has to give way to everyone. So both are in the wrong and the insurance will see it that way (especially if they're both insured by the same company.)

I think they were right....

In the case set out in the original post, the driver of car B should have checked for other traffic. That means not only looking over his/her shoulder to see what traffic was coming (behind the truck), but also checking driver's side and internal mirrors. Internal mirror (or possibly driver's side external mirror) would have shown the car A doing the U turn (or, more correctly; making a right turn).

When reversing from a nose-in 45 degree parking space, there's no point ONLY checking for oncoming traffic (from the direction the truck would have just come from). No, you need to check what is behind your vehicle (kiddy etc) and also what is on YOUR own side of the car...(could be that somebody has opened the passenger's side door on the vehicle next to your driver's door for example). The driver of car B is singularly responsible for this situation (IMHO).

Roachie

your probably right except for one thing...who began making their manoeuvre first?

I would say that whoever began to move first must be given way to...not to be confused with having right of way.

From what my wife told me Car A after starting the turn saw car B reversing so sped up to try to make in before getting t boned in the door.

Suppose I am happy about that, because car A was mine the wife had lent to a mate.

He was quick and blamed car B. Car B had a lot of damage to the tail light area, my car only some bent rails on the tray

Cheers

G'day Hairs,

I grew up in Narrandera (not all that far from Albury). It must be a southern NSW thing as i was brought up on 45 degree nose-in parking and have always just accepted it as the norm. Because of this, I tend to find the idea of 45 degree reverse parking (rrrrrrrrr's to the kerb) to be very foreign and a PITA.

Parrellel parking is the best option, but where you have a wide street available, it tends to waste a lot of parking spaces.

I can just picture you in the old shaggin wagon mate....I bet you had the bumper sticker too....."If'n it's rockin; don't ya be a knockin". Or did you have the sticker on the glove box: " Get in, sit down, hang on and shut up".

hahahahaha.....ahhh the good ol' days, eh??!!

Roachie

Hows it going Roachie?
Mate the van had the tinted/blacked out tear drop bubbles in the sides at the back and a Blacked out rear glass in the top of the lift up tail gate. Four droopy drop down pipes out the back and the 308 was fed by a pair of 600 square bore Holly's on a Edelbrock tunnel ram with a 30/70 cam in it :)
Hmmm

Anyway, yeah, at the time it must of been a southern thing.
These days Yamba has the 45 degrees nose in parking, and people shoot across the road to grab a park, it's like watching a Dodgem car track at the show.
Nah, sorry mate, not a big fan of nose in parking.

Hey Jon,

I first encountered nose in angle parking in 1979 in Ballina which is on the far north NSW coast.

I first backed into the traffic in a Ford Escort. That was bad enough. The panel van would have been plain scary.

Ballina is trialling rear to kerb angle parking now. I always preferred that.

We did get pretty comfortable with nose in while living in Broken Hill.

Duncs

Hi Duncs,
Grew up in Ballina from 73 to 82, did the big move up the road to Byron, all of 30 k's away. Left home when I was 16, so I didn't notice the nose in parking cause I didn't get my license till I had move to Byron where they never had nose in parking.
I did notice last time we drove down River St it was nose in, that was about 4 months ago, usually when traveling back to Byron we would go through East Ballina from the round about in front of where to old Tinkerbell C/P was, It's a shopping center now. If you haven't been there for awhile you'd notice a lot of changes over even the last five years or so.
I wonder why they are reverting back to rear to kerb after such along time? It would be interesting to hear why.
Ballina did have a lane that you could reverse back out into, so you weren't blocking traffic.
Hey Duncs, you probably knew my father Maurice Kenny who owned a taxi there about that time.
Hmmm, How things change.

Hi Jon,

I never lived in Ballina, went there chasing a girl. Have visited just about every year since 79.

The mother in law lives just down the road from the K-Mart & Coles complex.

Check your MM for more details.

Duncs

Nose-In Angle Parking !!! Which maroon thought that was good idea ????

Hi Wilko,
In the reply above I mention to Roachie that in Yamba they now have nose in parking in some streets, But it's not every where. and you get the same thing, all the cars are parked rear to kerb and there will be a few nose in.

Funny thing is, I've never seen someone park rear to kerb, in a nose in area, but it common to see it the other way round.

Voxson,

Dissagree

You say.
1. Car B has to give way to all traffic on the roadway.
2. Car A cannot make his turn unless it is safe and clear to do so.

I would suggest that.
Car B has to give way to all traffic in his lane NOT the other side of the road, because it is illegal to cross the white (solid or dotted) line.

Car B waited until his side of the road was clear and his manoeuvre was never going to impinge on the lane of traffic going in the opposite direction.

There is no doubt that Car A on the other hand is changing lanes has crossed the lane and had did not checked to make sure it was clear.

What is forgotten is that a normal road is 2 x one way streets joined in the middle the law for changing from one to the other is clear.

Forget about car B and imaging a pedestrian who is looking for traffic from the right and you have a dead person.

NSW Road Rules.

If U turn is allowed.
Rule 37 (b) Driver not safely begin U-turn without obstructing traffic* $197 and 2 demerit points
Rule 38 Make U-turn without giving way to vehicle/pedestrian* $253 and 3 demerit points
Rule 39 (1) Make U-turn at break in dividing strip contrary to sign* $197 and 2 demerit points

If U turn is not allowed.
Rule 132 (1) Not keep left of centre on two-way road $253 fine and 3 demerit points
Rule 132 (2) Not keep left of dividing line 253 fine and 3 demerit points
Rule 132 (2A) Drive across dividing lines to perform U-turn 253 fine and 3 demerit points

The person driving forward has 280 degrees of vision, the person reversing and looking over his shoulder has 30 to 45 degrees.

Have a look at the drawing again.



V or U turn, semantics, Car A definitely changed lanes, quote: "a turn made so as to head in the opposite direction"
To get to that parking spot that is accessible from the opposite direction, car A had to access the other lane, no matter how briefly and needs to ensure that that lane is clear or pedestrians or vehicles.

This turn was not at a marked junction or access to an off road property (driveway), so not a legal turn, it is either changing lanes or a U -Turn.

For all those who debated if this action was a U Turn

u-turn definition
U·-turn (yo?¯o¯'t?rn') noun

a turn made so as to head in the opposite direction: used esp. of a vehicle in a street or road figuratively, a reversal of opinion, strategy, etc.

Etymology: so named because the path of the turn is typically -shaped

Webster's New World College Dictionary Copyright © 2009 by Wiley Publishing, Inc., Cleveland, Ohio.
Used by arrangement with John Wiley & Sons, Inc.
Definition of a U - Turn.

South Aust.......

What was drawn is not a "U" turn.

You can cross a centre broken dividing line for any purpose as long as all the right observations and indicatons are adhered to.

You can cross a solid centre dividing line (single) for the purpose of entering or leaving a road.

30 - 45degrees over your shoulder,,, WHATEVER......

If you are only checking over one shoulder then you are looking for a smash.

I gather you are reading these straight from a book....