Another Waeco Problem

Submitted: Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 18:23
ThreadID: 75903 Views:5889 Replies:10 FollowUps:23
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Hi all.My Waeco is 3yrs. and 8months old. When on 240v it is fine. On 12v it is fine until battery reads 12.3v or under then error light comes on. Rang Waeco could be poly fuse. Repairer says not poly fuse but I pay him to replace it anyway. Same problem. Waeco says wire to thin replace wire with 50amp. Same problem.???? Any ideas?
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Reply By: Willem - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 18:56

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 18:56
It could be faulty board inside the fridge. Yours is out of warranty so it gonna cost. I was told by the repairer that Waeco had been supplied with a range of faulty switchboards which incorporate a fuse or something like that. You may still be able to get a warranty claim through. Ours went at 14 months and was repaired after two attempts. Has worked well ever since.

AnswerID: 403455

Follow Up By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:11

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:11
Hi Willem did you get yours done in Pirie? Brian.
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Follow Up By: Willem - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:49

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:49
Hi Brian

Yes. Parr Refrigeration in the street behind KMart.

Cheers
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Reply By: Ozhumvee - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:01

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:01
12.2v is approx down to 50% which is ideally where you don't want to drain the battery any further in the best interest of the battery.
what is the voltage dropping to as the frig tries to start?
Peter
1996 Oka Motorhome

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Reply By: Gramps - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:10

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:10
Brian,

fyi


What does it mean if the error light is flashing on CCF/CF range?
We have detailed the Danfoss compressor quick guide below. In the case the electronic unit records an operational error light on the CCF/SE and CF range. The number of flashes depends on what kind of operational error was recorded. Each flash will occur 1/4 second. After the actual number of flashes, there will be a delay withno flashes, so that the sequence for each error recording is repeated every 5 seconds. Once you have recorded the Red Flashes use the guide below.


Number of Red Flashes Danfoss BD35/50 Kompressor Guide Red Flash Guide Type

One Flash
Can be caused by:
• Insufficient cable size
• Too many connections
• Poor connections
• Not designating fridge
with own direct circuit
from battery
Battery Protection Cut-Out
If the error light on your fridge flashes once every 5 seconds, it is definitely indicating that you have a voltage drop problem. This means that the wiring in your car may be inadequate to carry the correct amount of volts to the fridge. To test if this is the problem, plug the fridge into a suitable AC adaptor. If you find that the fridge works, you can eliminate that there is a problem with the
fridge and the car wiring configuration or plug connections should be stringently checked.
We recommend car/motorhome/caravan wiring to be a minimum of 6-8mm cross section wire for up to 4 metres. Above this length the wiring would need an extra millimeter for every metre.
If the fridge does not work on the correct Waeco AC Adaptor, further investigation is required. Contact Waeco if this occurs.

Two Flashes
Fan over current cut-out
If the fan circuit in the control module has a load in excess of 0.5
Amps, the system will fail.

Three Flashes
Motor Start Error
If your error light is flashing three times every 5 seconds, the
rotor may be blocked or the differential pressure in the
refrigeration system is too high. Faulty compressor or faulty
control module.

Four Flashes
Minimum Motor Speed Error
This failure occurs if the compressor is running slower than 1850
rpm.

Five Flashes
Thermal cut-out of electronic unit
If the error light is flashing five times every 5 seconds, the
refrigeration system has been too heavily loaded, or if the
surrounding temperature is high, the electronics will run too hot.
This is generally caused by not allowing enough ventilation
around the vents of your fridge. To overcome this, simply
ventilate your fridge more effectively


Regards
AnswerID: 403457

Reply By: PradOz - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:21

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:21
I had problems with mine until i fitted a RAPS 12R-U2

Maybe worthwhile getting one too. Gives you two outlets and you can use the Hella one for a more secure fitting

AnswerID: 403460

Reply By: oldpop - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:50

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 19:50
Brian P
Waeco fridges CDF models have 3 Year Warranty on both compressor and case

CF models have 5 year Warranty on compressor and 3 Years on case

Just need original purchase receipt

Regards

Oldpop
AnswerID: 403463

Reply By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 20:41

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 20:41
I have a waeco cf50 on low setting it drops out at 12.3v it is out of warranty waeco does not want to know me. It has 6mm or 50amp wire from 2nd battery to hella plug.When I start the ute the fridge starts up.I tried to get it fixed in Pirie the same as you William. by the book it should cut out at 10.4v and restart up at 11.5v
AnswerID: 403480

Follow Up By: Gramps - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 21:43

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 21:43
Where are you measuring the 12.3v ? At the fridge or at the battery ?

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Follow Up By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 21:50

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 21:50
Hi Gramps fridge plug.Brian
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Follow Up By: Gramps - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:02

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:02
Good, we're measuring at the right end. Does the fridge run at all on the High setting ?

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Follow Up By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:03

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:03
Brian,
Is the fridge attempting to run when you get this 12.3 Volts? The measurement needs to be taken as close as possible to the fridge and preferrably inside for an accurate answer.

6mm or 50Amp, who on earth came up with this rot?

How long is the circuit, both positive and negative?

How is this magical 6mm measured? Cross sectional area of the copper in square millimeters or the overall diameter of the copper and the PVC? Copper carries power, PVC doesn't. PVC just keeps the power "on course"

Who decided this magical 6mm was good for 50 Amps?

Brian, please don't swallow what boating and automotive suppliers try to pass off as the universal panacea for all electrical situations. They have absolutely no idea.

Your problem sounds like voltage drop from far to small a cable or a high resistance joint.

Geoff,
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Follow Up By: Gramps - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:13

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:13
Bewdy, someone with electromagical knowledge has joined the fray. Glad you could make it Geoff :)))

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Follow Up By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:31

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:31
Square millimetres the 50 amps was on the roll. The fridge does not run a tall on high. Med sometimes if the motor is running.I will keep trying. Thanks all.
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Follow Up By: Gramps - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:46

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:46
Brian,

As per the excerpt from the Waeco FAQ above "If the error light on your fridge flashes once every 5 seconds, it is definitely indicating that you have a voltage drop problem." Is that what is happening when you refer to the error light?

They also state in relation to the cabling "We recommend car/motorhome/caravan wiring to be a minimum of 6-8mm cross section wire for up to 4 metres. Above this length the wiring would need an extra millimeter for every metre. " Is your cable run less than 4 metres ?

Can you try the fridge on someone else's setup ?

Since the fridge works fine on 240v and seems to work OK for a while on 12v and the polyfuse has already been replaced, I can only keep coming back to your battery setup and cabling, sorry.

Regards
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Follow Up By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:48

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:48
Hi Brian,
The 6 square millimeters is good, the 50 Amps should be shoved where the sun doesn't shine! (and I don't mean you mate!)

It's actually real important to know the true circuit length as I asked it. Do you know?

The fact the fridge runs sometimes on Medium with the engine running tells me 100% you have VD! (It's ok, Voltage Drop is very easy to cure!)

Mate, go back to my original post and if possible answer the questions.

Geoff,
Landcruiser HDJ78,
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Follow Up By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:56

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:56
Hi Al,
Electrics aren't that hard,

Volts = Pressure

Amps = Flow

Watts = Volume

If the pipe is too small you get pressure drop!

If the pipe pressure measures Ok with no flow but drops with flow the pipe is too small!

You pay for the volume consumed! If you own a 5,000 litre tank and you use 1,000 litres per hour it'll last 5 hours! (Think battery life for this one)

See mate, it isn't that hard!

Geoff,
Landcruiser HDJ78,
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Follow Up By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:58

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 22:58
Geoff, the cable is 4.5mt long. The only other thing I can think of is I have soldered a spade fuse holder in line next to the + terminal. It has a smaller diameter wire about 20mm long. It has a 20 amp fuse. Brian
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Follow Up By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:06

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:06
Hi Gramps. yes 1 flash =5 seconds.Brian
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Follow Up By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:10

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:10
Hello Brian,
I left a couple of really important question out of my earlier posts.

Has this system ever worked?

Or is this a brand new problem?

If a brand new problem have you or anyone else changed absolutely anything and I mean anything in the system. (Regardless of how trivial the change may seam)

Geoff,
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Follow Up By: Gramps - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:15

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:15
Brian,

I agree with Geoff that it looks very much like voltage drop due to ?????? I'll leave you in his knowledgeable hands although we all know that electrics, as explained above by Geoff, work in every conceivable circumstance EXCEPT fridges !!! For whatever reason, there seems to be some Dark Art involved with these devices.

Good luck
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Follow Up By: johnny diesel - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:15

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:15
I had similar intermitant power supply problems with my brandnew engel.Took it back to dealer, fridge mechanics, auto electricians, club gurus, anyone with a helpfull suggestion. It went on for a couple of years, and problem would reappear. Colin Files from CJ 4WD said, have you checked the Engel plugs?
Of course, a hundred times. Well he said, everyone checks the positive terminal, but no one checks the other earth terminal. The plug is a simple spade type. A slight twist with a pair of pliers to the male sides of the plug, and after ten years it hasnt missed a beat.
Frankly, I never believed him when he told me. How could so many "experts' overlook something so simple.
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Follow Up By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:16

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:16
Hello Brian,

This: "1 flash =5 seconds" is voltage drop.

Either your cable is too small or there is a high resistance joint in the cable. (Read dirty or poorly crimped-soldered joint.

Geoff,
Landcruiser HDJ78,
Grey hair is hereditary, you get it from children. Baldness is caused by watching the Wallabies.

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Follow Up By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:18

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:18
No system has never worked. Do I need a fuse between battery and hella plug? Or can I try it with out?
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Follow Up By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:36

Tuesday, Feb 09, 2010 at 23:36
Hello Brian,
Looking at your response I see these answers,

"No system has never worked." Tells me the problem is without a doubt voltage drop. The cable is too small for your circuit length and/or the chosen plug type is incorrect for the load.

"Do I need a fuse between battery and hella plug?" Yes all circuits need a fuse. In this case a fuse will not solve the underlying problem of voltage drop.

"Or can I try it with out?" You can but see above.

Geoff,
Landcruiser HDJ78,
Grey hair is hereditary, you get it from children. Baldness is caused by watching the Wallabies.

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Follow Up By: Willem - Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 09:12

Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 09:12
Hello all you luminaries :-)

If the fridge has been running OK for 3 years plus...then why would Voltage Drop suddenly appear?

Cheers

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Follow Up By: Gramps - Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 17:31

Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 17:31
Willem,

We're assuming it has worked on a different setup as Brian P stated "No system has never worked" i.e. he has had it working on a different setup prior to this. Of course we could be totally wrong, it would'nt be the first time LOL

Regards
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Follow Up By: Gramps - Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 17:35

Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 17:35
As per my followup earlier "Since the fridge works fine on 240v and seems to work OK for a while on 12v and the polyfuse has already been replaced, I can only keep coming back to your battery setup and cabling, sorry."

Regards
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Reply By: oz doc - Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 09:59

Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 09:59
Hi Brian- as a diagnostic test- can you run the fridge off the battery using a standard 12v cord? This will determine if it is a fridge problem or a cord problem. If it is a cord problem then you will need to consider replacing the fittings on each end (one by one) and consider a trial without the fuse, to see which area is causing the problem.doc.
AnswerID: 403550

Reply By: andoland - Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 10:07

Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 10:07
Brian,

I had a similar problem with my Waeco and tracked it down to the cigarette lighter plug on the Waeco cord.

In the past I had had this plug show signs of overheating and the plastic tip melting which indicated a poor connection and had replaced the cord.

The next time I had the problem, which had the same symptoms as you with a charged battery but the error light flashing on the fridge, I decided to investigate more. Using a multimeter discovered that I had 12.5V at the socket that the Waeco cord plugs into but over a volt less at the fridge. I removed the cover off the Waeco plug and plugged it in to the cigarette socket and with the mulit meter was able to detemine that the voltage drop across the Waeco plug was a whole volt.

I have since replaced the cigarette plug arrangement with an Anderson plug and the problem has gone away. I intend to eliminate this plug altogether but cutting the off fridge-end of the plug (the rectangular one) and connecting this directly (with a fuse) to the wiring coming from the battery.

Hope this helps.

Ando
AnswerID: 403553

Reply By: 93 Navara - Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 10:41

Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 10:41
Had the same problem with my waeco 60. Auto elec said planty of voltage, repairman said fridge was fine. At end of day fridge was fine. If your battery is on way out as mine was it read fine on initial testing and pull down test. Hooked up a 100 watt globe and left running on battery for half an hour. Light began to dim so retested and voltage well down. This wasn't evident on the pull down test on the battery initially. Replace battery and all well.
AnswerID: 403558

Reply By: Member - Brian P (SA) - Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 17:59

Wednesday, Feb 10, 2010 at 17:59
Thanks every body. I am charging my 2nd battery now. Then when it is fully charged using 240v charger I will isolate battery then run the fridge and see how long it runs for and what volts it cuts out. Brian
AnswerID: 403654

Follow Up By: Member - Terry W (ACT) - Thursday, Feb 11, 2010 at 08:13

Thursday, Feb 11, 2010 at 08:13
Brian,

I have the same problem. I had the Waeco supplied wire run on a dedicated circuit direct from the second battery to a quality plug in the rear of the vehicle. There is no discernible voltage drop between the battery terminals and the fridge end of the fridge lead. After a couple of years of faultless service, the fridge now switches off and shows the voltage drop error signal at 12.6 volts measured at either the battery or the fridge end of the lead. In this case the problem is not wiring or voltage drop but a failure somewhere in the fridge control circuits. Still works fine on 240 volts, but a real failure on 12 volts.
Terry
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FollowupID: 673278

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