wheel nut tool

Submitted: Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 09:54
ThreadID: 77630 Views:7423 Replies:11 FollowUps:17
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I saw a clever tool on a DVD ( caravan and ). The tool assisted with the tightening/ loosening of wheel nuts. The tool provided torq to take all the hard work out of removing wheel nuts placed on ever so tightly by air guns. It also helped to ensure wheel nuts were not too loose thus avoiding them working loose during travel. I reckon the tool would be invaluable for changing tyres when travelling.

Has anyone seen or used this tool ( tyre torq I think it was called)
Does anyone know where to find it?

Cheers,
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Reply By: Member - MUZBRY(Vic) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:00

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:00
Gday Horseshoe
I have a piece of pipe that fits over the handle on my crucifix wheel brace and a son that can carry heavy weights.
Muzbry
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Follow Up By: Member - Allan B (QLD) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 11:31

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 11:31
Have to agree Muzbry.

This device is a torque multiplier but so is a lengthened wheel brace!

Mine is a 1/2" socket handle that has a telescopic handle rather than carrying a length of pipe. But they all do the same job of increasing the torque.

Even if you use a 12v rattle gun, you still need to carry a wheel nut wrench of some sort in case the rattle gun chucks a migraine. And at some stage.....it will!

Cheers
Allan

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Reply By: Member - mark f1 (VIC) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:00

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:00
yep just google it.
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Follow Up By: Member - MUZBRY(Vic) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:04

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:04
Gday
They are used on a regular basis by earth moving fitters.
Murray
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Follow Up By: horseshoe - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:11

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:11
Hi Mark f1,
yep, found it vai google. ( first few times did not find anything, but found it now) it looks a handy tool , and I am keen togive it a go,
thanks,
horseshoe
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Reply By: Member - Mark G Gulmarrad - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:11

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:11
horeshoe

i've actually seen these things in action and they're great things.as you see in the video they easy remove truck wheel nuts with ease,cheers.
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Follow Up By: horseshoe - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:16

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:16
Hi Mark,

Thanks for the you tube link. The model shown in this clip is much fancier than the one I saw. Below is the to the tool I was interested in. Having broken a nut once trying to remove it, I think these tools are invaluable and make a hard job easy. Thanks, horseshoe.



http://www.nqas.com.au/p/510230/tyre-torque---multiplier-with-19-21mm-sockets.html
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Reply By: Duncanm - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:15

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:15
Tool
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Follow Up By: Member - MUZBRY(Vic) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:26

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:26
Gday Duncan
Thats a better one than I found.
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Reply By: Member - MUZBRY(Vic) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:23

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 10:23
Gday

Try tjtools.com
murray
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Reply By: Member - Graham H (QLD) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 11:00

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 11:00
Firstly be aware that some makes dont fit all wheels Make sure it fits yours before you buy


Secondly why waste effort when you could use a 12 volt rattle gun

They cost about the same and have other uses around the vehicle as well

Mine was $89 and the best money I ever spent.

You can buy them at most 4wd or Caravan accessory outlets

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Reply By: Member - Brian (WA) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 11:54

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 11:54
Hi .As above get a 12volt rattle gun (don't think they are called that )Think it's called a SHANTAI About same size but just plug into cig socket. They work well.
Cheers Brian
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Follow Up By: horseshoe - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:02

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:02
Thanks Brian and Graham,
Your right about a tool that is multi purpose when travelling, it makes a lot of sense. I will check out a 12 volt rattle gun.
Cheers, Horseshoe.
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Follow Up By: john&thejayco - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:32

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:32
G'day Horseshoe,
If you look up 12volt wrench on ebay you will find a number of them ,such as the kci ezi wrench, Shantai , they all look pretty handy and with a set of sockets that fit could do a lot of jobs out on the road or in the shed at home, i read some where that to get the most out of these wrench's you should have the motor running whilst using them for them to work at full strength.
Cheers.
John.
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Follow Up By: horseshoe - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:38

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 12:38
Hi John & the jayco,
Thanks, This is a good place to start and I have a few different options now,
thanks everyone for the feedback and suggestions,

Cheers, horseshoe
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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 16:10

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 16:10
Shentai is GREAT tool and I still have one in my town car (Subaru). But I recently sold the other Shentai I had in the Patrol, in favour of one of these:

18 volt Makita 1/2" Impact Wrench

Probably not worth doing unless you have (or intend on buying) other 18 volt Makita tools so you can interchange batteries etc. I bought 3 tools plus 3 batteries (3a/h) plus a 110v charger from ebay in USA for less than the price of a single hammer drill here in Aust. Fortunately, I already owned a stepdown transformer, although the 240v chargers are available here for under $70- too.

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Reply By: splits - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 13:27

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 13:27
Some of those seemingly over tightened nuts from tyre services just might be correct on some cars.

I found the post below while looking for five stud Landcruiser nut tensions. I knew it was 154 ft lbs, or about 209 nm, after seeing it in the owner's handbook and a workshop manual and I was wondering if anyone had discussed it before. I too was left asking how would you get them up that tight and how would many lightly built people undo them? It is exactly double the factory recommended tension for my Hilux which in turn is different from the Prado.

If you try and tighten them that much with a length of pipe on your wrench, you would really be guessing and could easily go too far and overstress the studs leading to eventual breakage. If you don't use a pipe or some kind of extension, you will never get them anywhere near that level and then have to run the risk of them working loose.

The obvious answer is a tension wrench or a high quality rattle gun that can be set accurately. Both would be expensive. The commonly used 120 ft lb wrench is upwards of $300 for a good one but it would be way too small. I would hate tothink what larger ones cost. Who knows what a good gun would cost and how much air or electricity it would need?

Whatever method you use to tighten wheel nuts, the correct tension is critical. People go to no end of trouble to get cylinder head studs tightened to the factory tensions yet many treat wheel nuts as an after thought. I can't remember ever hearing about an accident caused by incorrectly tightened head studs. Unfortunately I can't say the same about wheels falling off due to loose nuts or broken studs.

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FollowupID: 470734 Submitted: Saturday, Dec 16, 2006 at 21:27
Mikee5 (QLD) posted:
Thanks Phil,
You are right 154ft lbs, I thought 130 was too tight for my arms and wheelbrace. I will have to get a long bar and socket!!! How could anyone ever get this tight with the bendy tool provided by Toyota?

Mike.
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Follow Up By: Member - Duncs - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 14:54

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 14:54
Wow, 154 ft/lbs seems very high. I am not prepared to say outright that it is wrong but I would be checking it for myself.

The workshop manual for my GQ said 80ft/lbs which I initially thought seemed a bit light. I was not prepared to argue with the book so that is where I set them and I never had a problem. I have been using the same on the GU because they are the same size studs and nuts and my mechanic backed it up. Somebody here did suggest that it is actually 90 on the GU but even that is well below what Mike is suggesting for the Toyota.

As for fancy tools for doing up and undoing wheel nuts. I use a torque wrench. Mine cost $40 about 20 years ago it fits in the box with my socket set and does that and a host of other jobs just fine.

Duncs
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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 16:17

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 16:17
Duncs, I was of the understanding that the GU Patrol is 98ft/lb....but I will stand corrected. As I said above, I recently bought a Makita 18v Impact Wrench: Site Link
and as I was a bit concerned what tension I was going to end up with, I also bought a 90ft/lb torque limitinf rod which goes between the rattle gun and the socket. This seems to be a satisfactory solution in my mind, although I sometimes think I should have bought a 100ft/lb limiter......
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Follow Up By:- Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 17:20

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 17:20
you can buy a torque multiplyer to use with a tension wrench for doing nuts up
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Follow Up By: Member - Ed C (QLD) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 17:21

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 17:21
Duncs,
I think you'll find that the 5-stud 'Cruisers have 14mm studs, hence the 154 ft/lb nut tension..

Roachie,
Off the top of my head, I'm pretty sure the recommended torque for the GU is 89 - 108 ft/lb .. even at the lower end of the scale, this is more than what is normally recommended for 12mm fasteners (80 ft/lb), and is one reason I've always felt that 12mm studs are 'barely adequate' for a vehicle of this size...
You only have to look at all the reports of lost wheels/ broken studs on GU's for confirmation of this.. My local friendly parts man tells me that they sell heaps of Patrol wheel studs, and replace heaps more in their workshop...

It is for this reason that I've replaced all the studs on both of my Patrols w/- ½" ones, 6mm longer than originals, & use correspondingly longer nuts to suit, which I torque to 90 ft/lb..

12mm to ½" may not seem like much of an increase, but (a) hold the 2 side by side, and the difference in cross-section is very noticeable (to say the least), and
(b) it is the largest one can go & still use the same wheels, and without making any other changes..

FWIW, I have one o' them there Shentai thingys... Handy gadget, but no way, no how does it go anywhere near my wheel studs.. Not ever, not even to loosen 'em.. In any case, by the time I've got the thing out, unravelled the lead, & pluggedit in, I will have 'cracked' the nuts w/- the cross-brace anyway ;-))
(YMMV)

:)

Confucius say.....
"He who lie underneath automobile with tool in hand,
....Not necessarily mechanic!!"

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Follow Up By: Member - Roachie (SA) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 20:15

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 20:15
G'day Ed,'I'm a bit confused about your thoughts on the Shentai.....

I have used it to undo my wheel nuts but when I used it to re-do them up, I made sure I only let it HIT the nut once or twice, then I took over with the breaker bar.

Now that I have the 90ft/lb torque limiter extension bar, I would be comfortable enough to use a Shentai to nip the nuts right up (with the limiter placed in between). I reckon the Makita rattle gun would have about the same capacity as the Shentai, but haven't done any comparo's.

The bloke I sold the Shentai to (a forum member), was over the moon when he receieved it.... Apparently he'd been having all sorts of dramas undoing some nuts (can't recall what they were on), and no luck at all. Once he had the Shentai, he was able to undo them in a jiffy; no sweat!

Cheers mate

Roachie
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Follow Up By: Geoff (Newcastle, NSW) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 20:22

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 20:22
Gents,

I can safely say 154.2 ft-lb is 100% correct for 5 Stud Landcruisers!

From Page 193 of the 2006 Edition of the Landcruiser Owners Manual I see the following:

Wheel nut torque, N-m (kgf-m, ft-lbf):
209 (21.3, 154.2)

I have a 78 Series (Troopy) which has the same wheel studs as the 100-105 Series.

As to undoing wheel nuts, I actually bought Roachies surplus Shentai for the sole purpose of getting the wheel nuts off my off road trailer.

It has 16x8 Landcruiser 5-Stud rims complete with 285-75x16 tyres. The nuts had been done up so tight by some rock ape I actually managed to lift each side of the trailer off the ground with a breaker bar on each of the 10 nuts. I successfully removed one of them, eventually!

The Shentai dislodged them after much banging and struggling. A thoroughly successful and valued purchase.

Now I can remove them with normal tools and have purchased new studs and nuts to replace the probably damaged ones!

Geoff,
Landcruiser HDJ78,
Grey hair is hereditary, you get it from children. Baldness is caused by watching the Wallabies.

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Follow Up By: Member - Ed C (QLD) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 21:01

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 21:01
G'day Roachie,

No criticism of the Shentai per se ;-)
As I said, a handy gadget, and no doubt invaluable in some instances (as per Geoff's example)...

Rightly or wrongly, I just have a firm policy of no rattle guns (air or electric) anywhere near my wheel studs... Now if I had a Land Rover, or a 'Cruiser with 14mm studs, this may well change;-)

Others may have different opinions on this, and that's quite OK with me ;-)

Catch ya later.... Ed C

:)



Confucius say.....
"He who lie underneath automobile with tool in hand,
....Not necessarily mechanic!!"

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Follow Up By: Muntoo - Monday, Apr 12, 2010 at 00:21

Monday, Apr 12, 2010 at 00:21
Used my KC Shentai rattle gun thing once, after that never worked again. Needs over 12v to work so car has to be running, and mine needed to be at a fair idle to get it to rattle when i used it first time. I thought they were unreal so i got one. Waste of money in my books. And because it was a year when i went to use it again, warranty was finished. You beauty.
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Reply By: Member - Charlie M (SA) - Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 21:46

Sunday, Apr 11, 2010 at 21:46
Hi
Wheel nut torque's are all over the place now depends on model and year, even Holden commodore now has different torque's.
Tyre dealers need a njoy book with all details to be able to keep up now days.
cheers
Charlie
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Reply By: vk1dx - Monday, Apr 12, 2010 at 08:35

Monday, Apr 12, 2010 at 08:35
The boys got me one of these.12 volt impact wrench

Wouldn't swap it for quids. Especially when swapping tyre sets, before a trip, from town wheels to muddies. Not bad for the odd flat also. Haven't had one since the 80's. Nick off Murphy!!!

Phil
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Reply By: Member - Allan B (QLD) - Monday, Apr 12, 2010 at 17:14

Monday, Apr 12, 2010 at 17:14
Yep, I agree with Geoff from Newcastle. My Owner's Manual for the HZJ78R Troopy also says Wheel Nut Torque 209N-m, 154.2 ft-lbf

Incidentally, those using nut-drivers/rattle-guns, have any of you properly checked the torque calibration against a suitable reference such as a torque wrench? It would be so easy to just start using one only to later find that it was hopelessly out of calibration.

Cheers
Allan

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