IFS Problems on late model vehicles
Submitted: Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 11:56
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floyd
There has been a lot of negative comments about the IFS in 100 series, Hiluxes and all of the other 4WD vehicles posted over the last couple of years. My Question is:
Has any
forum users had an IFS fail on them?
I am not interested in "I heard of a guy" and "my brothers mate from work" etc... just real
forum users who have had problems 1st hand.
Reply By: Tony - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:19
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:19
No not had a IFS fail yet, but out in the paddocks I have to go a lot slower than I did in the old solid axle Hi-lux. The new one bottoms out all the time, when it's 15k to where the tractor is working you don't want to take all day to get there.
If I go in the GU I will get there about 5min earlier. On the road to town (
Hillston) all on dirt, its fine until you hit the wheel ruts then it's all over the road.
As I say I don't know how long it will last, I think the shocks are gone already and it's only 6 monthe old.
BTW hope to start stripping on Sunday.
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Follow Up By: Tony - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:22
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:22
One more thing IFS 100 out hear don't cut the mustard, three in the area have been traded in already the oldest 11 months. They have gone back to all coils.
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Follow Up By: pathfinder - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:25
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:25
yep, that reminded me...forgot to mention that IFS shocks have to work a lot harder than live axle ones...or maybe it's just that they are smaller/reduced capacity and therefore heat up/aerate faster - either way...they will need replacing more often than on a live-axled vehicle...
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Reply By: pathfinder - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:22
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 12:22
The issue isn't really about IFS systems failing (although CV boots are always susceptible to holing/tearing off road) but the lack of wheel travel and modification-ability they provide relative to live axle fronts... I was tossing up between 2.8TD (great motor) Paj (IFS) and 2.5TD Disco (live axle) last year. The Disco just 'walked' through and over a spoon drain that the Paj got stuck in due to poor front wheel articulation...so the Disco won even though the Paj may be better in some other ways.
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Reply By: joc45 - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 14:10
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 14:10
Hi Floyd,
I'm theorising here, for what it's worth;
the CV joints in live axle vehicles are running dead-straight for 99% of the time; ie, they run at an angle only when turning, whereas the IFS CVs are running at an angle most of the time. Stands to reason that the CVs in live axles should last a lot longer.
Sorry I didn't give you a real-life story....
Gerry
AnswerID:
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Follow Up By: David N. - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 14:29
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 14:29
Agree joc45.
A friend had to replace CVs in his (live axle) cruiser. I forget the figure, but I do remember he had to take out a second mortgage to pay for them (
well almost).
So your point about them wearing out quicker is very relevant. Of course, and if you rip the rubber boot you'll stuff them in no time- and no warranty either for that one.....
Wouldn't touch them with a barge pole, IMHO.
They haven't been around that long on cruisers, but I suspect a few years down the track people will pay more for a live axle .......
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Follow Up By: GaryInOz (Vic) - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 21:29
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 21:29
"...whereas the IFS CVs are running at an angle most of the time...."
Not quite.
The CV's on both are only rotating when the hubs are locked in.
The "crucifix" type of joint only has a range of about 10 degrees of flexion before the internal stresses (from the inherent rotational speed variations) start to seriously affect the longevity of the bearing caps/bearing surfaces.
The standard CV (cup, cage, 6 balls, and
spider) are designed to operate at an angle to spread the wear across all internal components evenly. Operating them at zero flexion for lengthy periods is in fact detrimental to their longevity.
The main issue is CV's are expensive relative to the crucifix type, so manufacturers tend (as usual) to go for the absolute minimum they can get away with, leaving the front end, and CV's in general, with a bad reputation.
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Follow Up By: joc45 - Monday, Nov 03, 2003 at 00:39
Monday, Nov 03, 2003 at 00:39
Hi Gary,
"Operating them at zero flexion for lengthy periods is in fact detrimental to their longevity. "
....Guess that makes sense now you say it like that.
Gerry
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Reply By: Member - Paul H - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 16:54
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 16:54
I'm coming up to 200,000km on a Nk Pajero & have only just split the boot on one side. Had them all replaced & the cv's checked cleaned & regreased for around
$400.00. The vehicle is raised & spends nearly all of its life off road & on long trips in all types of terrain. I would'nt call that unreliable. I think maintenance is the key.
A quick regular inspection just to
check the boot condition.
PMKNext trip please..............................................
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Reply By: Member - Nick (TAS) - Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 20:59
Friday, Oct 31, 2003 at 20:59
floyd,Ive got a 4 RunnerIFS which is used mainly for touring which we find the IFS really nice compared to the rigid axle Hilux we used to have.On ours with manual locking hubs the CV s arnt working at all until locked in.On our recent trip away we did the OTL up
Cape York with a live axle cruiser and in a one spot each we needed two goes to get out of a
creek crossing(different spots).Over all the IFS gave a better ride,suffered no problems(17000kms on this trip alone) and went everywhere the live axle crusier went.Also we saw 10 to 1 CruisersIFS while away so alot of people dont mind em.
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