electrical wiring help PLEASE
Submitted: Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 09:15
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Member - lyndon NT
Hi All
This is my first wiring project so I thought I would put it up here for some advise. At the back of my car I have a 175 Amp Anderson plug, this is used to plug the 80 amp Christies charger into to, to charge the car batteries. I wish to run power back to our boat so we can charge the batteries as we drive and also via the 25 amp charger mounted in the car when stationary. I have three batteries in the boat, 2 x 50 amp AGM Excide orbital’s wired parallel, these start the motor and provide power to accessory sockets in the boat, these are located at the very rear of the boat. The other is a 100 amp Gel cell under the consol in a purpose made battery box with 60 amp fuse and is plugged in via a 50 amp Anderson plug, it purpose is to power our Minn Kota trolling motor.
What I am considering doing is 175 amp Anderson to 175 Anderson lead, this will go to a storage compartment in the front of the boat, this lead will be removable when using boat, at the storage compartment the lead will plug into another 175 Anderson which will split in two(the ones for sale on eBay actually split into 3 x 50 amp plugs, is this the way to go?), one lead taking charge to the rear orbital’s, the other lead to attach the battery box 50 amp plug. Allowing for slack, the lead from the rear of the car will be 3 or 4 meters in length, the other two approximately 3 meters. Unsure of which wire size to use, is 6 B & S the go and will this fit into 50 amp plugs ok, will this and plugs be sufficient for charge from alternator (78 series T/D troopy), will 13 mm solid tube flexible conduit (the black tube stuff, not the split) be large enough to take both wires easily? Is there a way to crimp the plugs without the correct tool, I seem to remember seeing the 175 amp tool and it was large. Maybe I could get an auto elect to crimp the two 175 amps and do the 50 amps myself? Re the wire does it matter if it is twin? I have seen that Anderson plugs from eBay are 1/3 the price of what they are at Jaycar, anyone know where a good place to source wire is? Have been quote $15 a meter for twin 6 B&S from auto elect in
Darwin.
Hope this makes some sense?
Cheers Lyndon
Reply By: Notso - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 11:11
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 11:11
EEER Cripes, a bit too much info mate.
How does one eat an elephant, perhaps a little bit at a time.
AnswerID:
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Reply By: Dunaruna - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 11:50
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 11:50
If done properly, soldering the anderson plug lugs is better than a CHEAP crimper. If possible, get it done with a proper anderson crimping tool, otherwise solder.
6 B&S is perfect for a 50 amp anderson plug. It is sufficient to charge you AUX battery.
No, twin 6 B&S will not fit into a 13mm conduit. You need to use at least 16 or 20 mm.
Jaycar sell 6 B&S for $7 per meter. Buy it online.
Cheap ebay anderson plugs are crap. They have reduced spring tension and brittle bodies. Buy genuine.
AnswerID:
434415
Follow Up By: Member - lyndon NT - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:44
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:44
hi, can you point me to the 6 B&S online at jaycay, they don't seem talk about it like that, rather they talk about guage?
The anderson plugs are advertised as genuine at eBay.
Thanks Lyndon
FollowupID:
705515
Follow Up By: Member - lyndon NT - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 15:17
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 15:17
Just wondering if I should get 6 B&S twin core, what is the extra protective sleeve like? Would it save me having to buy a conduit to protect it?
Thanks Lyndon
FollowupID:
705522
Follow Up By: Member - Vince M (NSW) - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 16:18
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 16:18
Try not to soldier any joint in a car, boat,truck etc as it gives a hard point & will normally fail at that point. So crimp it properly or don't do it
Regards Vince
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Follow Up By: Member - lyndon NT - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 16:44
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 16:44
Thanks Vince, i think I will get the 2 x 175 amps crimped at the auto elct, hoping I can do the 50's by myself?
Lyndon
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Sunday, Oct 31, 2010 at 17:39
Sunday, Oct 31, 2010 at 17:39
"Try not to soldier any joint in a car, boat,truck etc as it gives a hard point & will normally fail at that point. So crimp it properly or don't do it "
Pure myth - I have always used soldered connections for the last 35 years and never had a failure. You have to do it properly so the solder doesn't wick along the wire.
Sure, crimping is used for professional results, but unless you have the right tools, skills and materials, a lousy crimp will give you as many problems as a lousy soldered joint.
FollowupID:
705797
Reply By: nutwood - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 12:34
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 12:34
I'd be giving some thought to what you are doing when you are connecting all these batteries in parallel. Two points; firstly different batteries have different charging needs. You may find some of the batteries may not charge properly. No big deal if you charge them all individually and correctly after a trip, otherwise you may be shortening their lives considerably.
Secondly; when you start the vehicle, it sounds like power could flow back from the boat to the car. Again, you'll probably get away with it as the car battery is closer but imagine if you ever get a loose battery connection on the car battery.
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:00
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:00
Some good points to consider NW :)
Assuming there is a smart isolator in the vehicle, I would imagine there be no major problems as current flow shouldn't be an issue in most cases.
Andrew
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Follow Up By: nutwood - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:12
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:12
Don't forget he says that the Anderson plug was there to allow charging of the car batteries. I reckon that means power can flow into, as
well as out of, the car.
Smart isolator would be a good solution.
FollowupID:
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:23
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:23
Thanks NW, could be right ;)
Andrew
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Follow Up By: Member - lyndon NT - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:38
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 13:38
There is an red arc solenoid/isolator between starter and auxiliary batteries,max inrush current 600 amps. The plugs I am talking about on eBay are advertised as genuine Anderson. Is the $7 a meter for red and black?
Thanks Lyndon
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705514
Reply By: tonysmc - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 14:47
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 14:47
Hi Lyndon,
One thing that I would be concerned about is charging your boat batteries while they are connected to the boat motor. I think with the output of the car alternator you are likely to do some damage to the diodes or charging system in the boat motor. Maybe fit one of those large isolator switches that disconnect the batteries from the boat motor before you connect it to the car.
Cheers Tony.
AnswerID:
434427
Follow Up By: Member - lyndon NT - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 15:06
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 15:06
Wooh, hadn't thought of that Tony! There is an isolator that when turned of prevents any parasitic drawer from the batteries, unsure if when that is turned off that it will be ok to charge the batteries via the car though, mmm, will have to get some advise on that!
Can any
boaties comment on that?
Cheers Lyndon
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew (QLD) - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 15:41
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 15:41
Hi Tony,
I'm lost as to why it would do any damage to the motor and/or electrics? ;) The connection of all of these batteries together is no different to a single battery (broadly speaking) and the charging voltage of the alternator is no different(probably a lower voltage) to a charger connected to the battery, which is done all the time with battery maintenance for boats.
The isolators on many small recreational boats are connected either on the battery box or close by, so would require the andersons to connect to the supply side of the isolator switch or direct to the Terminals with possible fuse protection.
Andrew
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Follow Up By: Member - lyndon NT - Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 16:42
Thursday, Oct 28, 2010 at 16:42
opps, there's another one I hadn't thought of! The batter box is fused but if I'm running straight back to one of the batteries at the back it won't be, do I need to put an inline fuse in the possitve going to this battery? If so, what fuse could/should I run the 6 B&S + into before connecting?
Thanks Lyndon
FollowupID:
705527
Follow Up By: Mike DiD - Sunday, Oct 31, 2010 at 17:41
Sunday, Oct 31, 2010 at 17:41
"One thing that I would be concerned about is charging your boat batteries while they are connected to the boat motor. I think with the output of the car alternator you are likely to do some damage to the diodes or charging system in the boat motor."
No ! Pure myth.
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705798