Another "Tyres for the Troopy" thread.

Submitted: Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 19:37

ThreadID: 83934 Views:18450 Replies:11 FollowUps:9

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Primitivist37

Hi All,

I'm a reader more than a poster but I'm getting too overwhelmed by the info on the forum and can't decide where to go with Tyres (and maybe wheels) for the Troopy.

I recently purchased a '92 in excellent condition (first real 4X4). I have put about 8000km on it in the last 3 weeks and I'm in love with the beast. It was formerly owned by a Toyota diesel mechanic and as such all parts that have been replaced, renewed, etc. have been with stock Toyota parts. This has it's pluses and minuses I guess and over the next few months I intend to "upgrade" the necessary parts.

To start with I should mention what sort of driving I (intend to) do. This seems to be something missing from a lot of threads.

I live in country NSW and spend a lot of time driving through the gravel and dirt roads of the national parks and forrests. My daily drive is black top (about 80 - 150km/ week) but weekends usually see me do 100 - 150 km of dirt and gravel. On top of this I do long stints (3-7hrs) of HW to go caving/ canyoning/ outdoor stuff that usually includes a bit of dirt/ mud to get to sites. I don't think that I will puirposely go looking for mud and I'm not really into pushing the vehicle to its limits. However, this may change once I get a little more confidence up and hear about good places to go that are hard to get to etc..

Currently it has stock skinny splits on it of course. I have read through the arguments for skinny v wide, split v single piece. I've yet to learn how to fix a tyre as I'm in my infancy of 4x4 driving but it seems like both are relatively easy to do on the track of need be. (correct me if I'm wrong)

I'm erring toward keeping the splits. I'm not tied to this however and since I'm not a cockie that is fixing tyres day in day out it may not be the wisest choice. However I already own the splits and I have 3 spares so cost wise (not the most important thing) keeping the splits makes sense.

IF I keep the splits my thoughts are that I should go for an AT tyre. Given that I don't go looking for mud and spend a lot of time on black top this seems to make sense. In the 750R16 size the only "worthy" tyre choices are the Road Gripper Fs (which I have and have had some trouble with chipping and balancing) or the Silent Armours (which have overall very good reviews but not for this size).

I get the Impression that ATs are much of a muchness but can anyone give me an argument for or against either of those tyres.

Currently I'm really impressed with the fuel economy of the troopy. Fully laden (bed in back setup. cupboards, etc.) I'm getting 10.5 - 12.3 L/100km on highway and only slightly worse around town. If I swap to another tyre/wheel type this is likely to be affected. I've been told though, that going to single piece would probably make it better as the splits weigh a ton. I don't want to go ridiculously wide as the arguments for narrow tyres almost always suggest that narrow tyres will do everything a wide will and sometimes do it better.

IF I were to part with the cash and go for some new one piece wheels what should they be and what tyres would I then be looking for? From my reading it seemed like there were two other common 16" wheels that people who swapped went to.

I really appreciate any help that people can give me. If you reply please don't simply say "use the search function" as I have well and trully done that but can't find answers specifically suited to my circumstances.

Another related question. I have no experience in tyre pressures and will be learning and experimenting with that very soon. I would like to get a compressor for filling the tyres and have read that the "big red" is the one to go for. Can someone post a link to a particular model that is suited to inflating tyres (I don't have lockers).

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Reply By: Primitivist37- Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 19:55

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 19:55

When I said "worthy" above, I was refferring to tyres that have had generally good reviews. I'm welcome any and all suggestions that fit my criteria for driving.

AnswerID: 443236

Reply By: Drew - Karratha - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:02

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:02

if you chose to go to new wheels and tyres - you would be able to buy white Sunraysias and tyres in 15inch size tyres cheaper than just the 16inch tyres...
Drew

AnswerID: 443241

Follow Up By: Member - Doug T (NT) - Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 02:11

Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 02:11

15" wheels up the revs at 100Kph by 400rpm and the speedo reads 6kph lower than reallity.

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Reply By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:09

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:09

As a suggestion, 16 x 8 ROH trak 2 rim -or similar-
with a Toyo Open Country MT 285x75Rx16 tyre.

Not the cheapest but you will go everywhere you wish with confidence.

I had them on my Troopy during our desert trip, as did others, and was very impressed.

Not cheap but you get what you pay for.

Anyway check 'em out

Rgds
Michael J

AnswerID: 443244

Follow Up By: Drew - Karratha - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:15

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:15

Be a bit careful trying to run 285/75/16's on a non-turbo 1HZ. I tried it for 2 days and swapped back to the 265/75/16's due to the dreadful loss of power from trying to run the bigger tyres... (which the 1HZ doenst have much anyway in the frost place) (if the Toyo Open Country's come in 265/75, I think they would be a very good option for a very good quailty (from what I have read) tyre...)
Drew

FollowupID: 715304

Follow Up By: Member - Matt L (WA) - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:59

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 21:59

If the 750x16 are working for you stick to that size,if you put on any bigger it will change you ratio and power , and your fuel use will go through the roof.

FollowupID: 715308

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:03

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:03

Hi Drew,

You could well be right..I had put a turbo on the mighty 1hz as well as the 285's..not a problem and I guess a feeling of comfort too.

I had also run the n/a 1hz on skinny tyres and Cooper STT 285's, prior to the turbo.

Must admit the wider tyres on a Troopy just make you feel better!!!

Comes down to personal choice I guess.

Having said that, the Toyo took a real bashing on our last trip and came up trumps.

Cheers
MJ

FollowupID: 715310

Follow Up By: Member - Michael J (SA) - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:10

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:10

"it will change you ratio and power , and your fuel use will go through the roof."

Yes it does change you ratio Matt, but your fuel usage does not go through the roof. How you drive determines just how much your fuel usage changes.

MJ

FollowupID: 715313

Follow Up By: Drew - Karratha - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:19

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:19

Hi Mj
Yep - I always wanted 285's because they look great under the guards - then i thought about the practicalities of towing a 5m boat and not being able to accelerate (at all) to overtake carrivan's / roadtrains etc - (the 1HZ even had gas injection and it still didnt have the power (not towing) to accelerate from 100 on a slight slope with the wider tyres).
Drew
Ps I would go 10.5 R15 On Black ROH Track Master rims (because they look good)with BFG At's or Bridgestone Dueller LT AT's for the driving that you do

FollowupID: 715317

Reply By: The Rambler( W.A.) - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:04

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:04

primitivist 37
I might be able to give you something to think about as I have vertually the same setup as yourself.Firstly I can tell you that I am A retired surveyor and have driven at least 7 different Troopys over the years with the company I worked for and now own a 2001 model Troopy.All the many thousand killometers I have
done in all sorts of terrain have been on split rims and I would not change them
for the wider tyres as the ease of repair in the bush is a big plus and also they have a much better chance of less sidewall damage on the tyres.The so called skinny tyres will go amywhere the fatties go if let down to the right pressures.I also have different ideas(from experience) on tyre pressures with skinny tyres.Keep the pressures up on the gravel or else you will stuff the tubes.I run(fully laden) 45lb.on the back and 40lb on the front ob rough gravel roads with no problem.Igo down to 18lb or less on really boggy sand.The Roadgripper tyres that come standard with the Troopy are not the best and you shoud upgrade ton 235/85/16 tyres which are the widest you can put on the splits.Ipersonally stick to Hankooks which have given me the best run after trying different brands.Iknow you will get different advice but it sure has worked for me and there isn't many offrad tracks that Ihave had a problem with.

AnswerID: 443257

Follow Up By: Member - Captain (WA) - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:12

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:12

Good sensible choice of size and type for the conditions :)

Cheers

Captain

FollowupID: 715327

Reply By: Rod W - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:12

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 22:12

Does it appear to you that the engine maybe screaming a bit when you're in 4th gear?
If you don't have one see if you can borrow a GPS that gives a speed reading and go for a drive with it operating in the Troopy. If the Troopy's speedo and the GPS give the same speed reading then everything is hunkydorry. But I wouldn't mind betting the GPS gives a lower speed reading compared to the Troopy's speedo thus indicating that the speedo is out. From my own experience (twice) I've replaced the 7.50x16's with 285x75x16's, in doing this both the GPS and the Troopy's speedo gave the same reading.

AnswerID: 443258

Follow Up By: Primitivist37- Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:08

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:08

The speedo and GPS give the same reading at the moment.

FollowupID: 715326

Reply By: Primitivist37- Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:07

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:07

Thanks everyone for the already very helpful replies.

I should have mentioned that the engine is non turbo.

I may be wrong but my gut feeling is that the manufacturer designed the vehicle to work with those rims so changing to a larger diameter or going to a really wide tyre (greater than 7" I'd say is too wide) is going to upset the power balance in the troopy. I understand they are lacking in the power so sticking to the same rolling diameter is probably a must.

The Rambler
235/85/16 seems to have roughly the same dimensions. How does that affect your vehicle height/ handling and speedo reading? Which particular Hankooks? I run 45psi all around and found it tolerable on dirt roads but then with stock suspension it's likely to be. I'll do tyres first and then suspension soon after.

AnswerID: 443266

Follow Up By: Bonz (Vic) - Saturday, Jan 29, 2011 at 13:24

Saturday, Jan 29, 2011 at 13:24

I would back the 253/85/16 choice also. I had these on a Maverick and they were perfect, and around the same size you wuill get the best of both worlds with just a little extra width without going overboard.Mine were on 6.5" rims but if I was buying new, I would go 7".

Also, sounds like you need an all terrain tread pattern, the BFG are a great tyre.

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FollowupID: 715488

Reply By: splits - Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:46

Thursday, Jan 27, 2011 at 23:46

There is a bit more information on these two sites.

http://comparticle.com/index.php/4wd/the-truth-about-4wd-tyres
http://www.beadelltours.com.au/tyre_information.html

I stumbled on the first one yesterday. The section on skinny and wide tyres is interesting. It would appear you can go a bit too far with width.

The second involves driving in extreme desert conditions of a type you may never get into on tyres very few would ever consider. It is amazing where two different types of 7.50s in highway tread patterns can take you. They are not your ordinary everyday 7.50s though.

The whole tyre information section is well worth reading.

From my own experience after many years of outback driving, just about every local person is using skinnies and many of them are crossplies.

Regarding wheels: If you are prepared to have a go at removing a tyre from a rim to repair it properly, then try both split rims and a one piece first before you make any wheel decisions. Split rims make the removal and replacement of heavily constructed tyres fairly easy. I have seen the bloke who travels around the 4b shows demonstrating R & R Beadbreakers make it look ridiculously easy getting a tyre on and off a one piece rim but I have also seen fit strong young men end up exhausted wrecks trying to do the same thing.

Fixing tyres is a bit like fitting snow chains. You learn at home first. You don't try it for the first time in knee deep snow.

Do a bit more research and have a bit of a practice first. When looking at tyre sizes remember you don't want things that look like road rollers. Geez they make great targets for sharp rocks and stakes. Stakes that will rip the sidewall out of a 285 or larger will miss a 7.50 or 235 by at least an inch.

Another tip is if you don't want to get stuck in the bush trying to repair a couple of huge stake holes ( that you got in a front and rear tyre at the same time) with a packet of externally applied temporary plugs then have a look at the Rema Tip Top tyre repair equipment catalogue on their web site. You will not believe what is available.

AnswerID: 443269

Reply By: get outmore - Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 02:06

Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 02:06

theres nothing totally wrong with splitties

but

the only reason I have a set is for running hard core 16 ply rag tyres and even then you ideally need to spend extra on quality tubes rather than the crap ones they will fit if you get a puncture (youcant even stick a patch on them easily)

for your described use a set of 7 inch rims running 265x16x75 all terrain tyres would be ideal

and are the same diametre as yourorigina ltyres

this gives you a massive choice, form your intended use flats shouldnt be an issue but a tubeless repair kit worms are quick and easy and cheap if required

somthing like goodyear silent armour wold be ideal for your use

AnswerID: 443276

Reply By: Member - Phil G (SA) - Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 17:19

Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 17:19

When the split rims are 18 years old, its pretty hard to keep them reliable. The tubes would have been replaced a few times - usually with the thin Korean rubbish, and you'll find that you'll get flat tyres for no good reason.

I know a lot of people with older Landcruisers who give up on the splits because of tube problems. I did this after running splits for 10 years. I nearly rolled my old troopie twice by tube failures.

If you go with tubeless, you will have difficulties getting skinny rims with the correct offset for your 1992 troopie. I know of only one 16x6 size rim and that was a chrome rim on the 60series (note there were two types of chrome rims on the 60series - the other one was a split rim with the split on the inside).

If you're willing to go to 16x7 aftermarket rims, you can either fit 235/85R16 or 265/75R16 tyres. My preferences for the running you're doing is the Federal Couragia AT, or Bridgestone D694LT in the 265/75R16.

You can also go with the 15x7 rims and 31x10.5R15 tyres - both are pretty cheap. But they don't have the load index required for your vehicle, so beware.

AnswerID: 443342

Reply By: Primitivist37- Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 19:43

Friday, Jan 28, 2011 at 19:43

Thanks everyone for the replies.

Some really great info here and I think I've made a decision until I get buyers remorse.

The only reasons to keep the splits I can see is that they really are the more sustainable option in terms of long distance remote travel and that I already own 7 of them.

Since I'm not poor and I have yet to get interested in long distance remote travel, I think I will go over to 16X7 rims (infinity wheel $115 at my local Bridgestone) and go for a set of Bridgestone LT D694s. The other tyres recommended to me at the dealer were the Toyo Open Country.

I asked about Mickey Thompson's as well in both the 4 and 5 ribs. These also seem to have a pretty good name. As I said before I'm not trying to get the cheapest way out here so I'm willing to pay for the MTs if they are good and worth the extra $50.

One more question to quell my fears about changing tyres and rims from what's currently on there.

If I go with 16X7 with either the 235/85 or 265/75 I will have roughly the same tyre diameter and rolling diameter. Does this infer that the gearing won't be affected and therefore fuel consumption/ speedo reading, etc. won't be affected? As I said before I don't want to affect the power/ weight balance in the old girl. In terms of weight will the new tyre/ wheel combination be lighter overall (therefore easier for the engine to turn)?

AnswerID: 443363

Reply By: JohnnyC - Saturday, Jan 29, 2011 at 15:46

Saturday, Jan 29, 2011 at 15:46

I have BFG AT on split rims on my troopy, I like the split rims as it's easy to fix a puncture in the bush, and these tyres have a flange which protects the rim.
Only problem is that the recomended size is 235/85/16 which is an odd size and I have had difficulty finding them.
Interesting comment above about tube problems, on my last trip, mostly on gravel, I had 2 flats for no reason, both on the same wheel,when I took the tubes out it looked like they had melted on the sidewall, maybe they are both just dodgy tubes, I bought them from a reputable dealer.I run them at 45 psi all round.
The speedo is spot on with new tyres and I get between 10 and 12 L/100 travelling about 80/90 klm on dirt roads.

AnswerID: 443436