New 2 stroke diesel

Submitted: Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 14:09
ThreadID: 85400 Views:5013 Replies:6 FollowUps:14
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This maybe of interest to you all, the motor is still in the infant stages so have a look at the video.

Looks like the Commer Knocker and 2 stroke Detroits may make a comeback,

Ha Ha.


New 2 stroke video

Have a good one
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Reply By: dbish - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 14:54

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 14:54
In 2nd WWW Junkers had a 2stroke diesel with a 2 cranks with pistons meeting in the middle, the 2 cranks were conected by idler gears. These diesels were used in a flying boat. Just a variaton of an old theme, not new.
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Follow Up By: kiwicol - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 15:18

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 15:18
I think you will find they had 3 cranks, with the 2 pistons in 1 cylinder, working in a triangular pattern.

They were later used in the first diesel locomotives to run on the english rail system.

Col
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Follow Up By: fisho64 - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 15:24

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 15:24
so what was the 3rd crank for?
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Follow Up By: dbish - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 16:53

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 16:53
Sorry cant post pics on this forum, but the Junkers "Jumo IV" was a 6 cylinder 2stroke diesel having 2 oposed pistons per cyl. The upper set of pistons conect to a crankshaft & a lower set to a crank beneath. The 2 shafts being geared together at the front of the engine. Combustion takes place betwean the pistons. Lower pistons uncover inlet ports & upper pistons uncover exhaust ports. By means of un equal strokes for the 2 pistons a slight lead can be given to the exhaust openings. It uses a gear driven centrifugal blower to supply air for scavenging & for charging the cylinders. First tested Feb 1932. All aluminum construction crankcase with steel sleeves & liquid cooled.
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Follow Up By: t303 - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 17:53

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 17:53
Those ain't 2 stroke diesel engines!
THIS is a 2 stroke diesel engine ;-)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Deltic
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Follow Up By: Ray - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 10:15

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 10:15
That engine is a Napier Deltic
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Reply By: Axle - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 15:53

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 15:53
Hi RockApe, .....Commer Knockers!!,, Great design ,A lot of ks were run up on some of them, and MAN!!, they could rev, as i found out heading down hill with no brakes....LOL.



Cheers Axle.
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Follow Up By: Rockape - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 17:57

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 17:57
Axle,
we had a knocker on the property I worked on, burnt out mufflers and lots of noise.

Have a good one.

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Reply By: Member - Paul B (WA) - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 20:48

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 20:48
Hope they're a bit quieter than either Gemmies or Knocker Commers.
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Reply By: Member - Ed C (QLD) - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 21:29

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 21:29
Speaking of Commer Knockers,
I clocked up quite a few miles in them things waaay back when I was a fair bit younger than I am now.... (never forget that sound ;-))

Here's a bit of info for those who may not be familiar with the way these things work >.

Rootes TS3 two-stroke diesels

There was also a 4 cylinder (8 piston) version under development, which Chrysler scrapped when they took over the Rootes Group..

Here's a link to one of 4 remaining TS4 prototypes and the only one running >>
(click the "play" button on the bottom pic.. turn up the sound ;-))

TS4 Prototype


:)


Confucius say.....
"He who lie underneath automobile with tool in hand,
....Not necessarily mechanic!!"

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AnswerID: 450248

Follow Up By: Member - Jayco_Mauler (Vic) - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 22:12

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 22:12
Hi Ed C

Thanks for the link, what an incredible sound.... i reckon there was a fair bit more in it if he wasn't mothering it ;O)

Cheers

Brendon
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Follow Up By: dbish - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 23:17

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 23:17
Thanks for the links with the sound, brings back memorys when Commer Knockers were on the road & working, i was just a teenager then.
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Reply By: Ron N - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 22:43

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 22:43
The only promising thing about this engine is the ability of the directors of the company to keep raising money on promises. The opposed piston idea is not new, neither is the 2-stroke combustion principle. No 2-stroke has ever met current emission control levels, let alone future, harsher emission control levels.

As soon as you see "Defence Projects", you know these blokes are on a money trail like a busted money truck with $100 notes falling out of it. What amazes me is that they have even managed to con Navistar and Bill Gates into pouring money into their bottomless pit.

These crowds are like $2 mining companies who keep showing pictures of fantastic gold-laden rocks, just to get another $2M to keep the directors in new Beemers and flash offices with gorgeous creatures shuffling their paperwork. Scammers, pure and simple.

This Eco-Power company has been around for more than 10 yrs and produced nothing worthwhile.
Meantimes, back at the ranch, Australians such as Brad Howell-Smith, with his crankless REVETEC engine, HAVE a working engine, with a NEW design, that IS vastly more fuel efficient, has more torque at lower RPM, and which has no major inherent design problems, unlike the other pretenders.

Add a Coates Rotary Valve Head to a Revetec engine, and you will have NEW engine technology that will leave the current range of engines for dead.
Why isn't this type of new technology being lapped up and put into immediate large-scale production?

Because manufacturers have a VESTED INTEREST in keeping the status quo, avoiding discarding all their current engine investment - and because the engine manufacturers share COMMON DIRECTORS with OIL COMPANIES!

http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=276674

http://www.revetec.com/companyinfo1.htm

http://www.coatesengine.com/csrv.html
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Follow Up By: Rockape - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 23:04

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 23:04
Ron,
you maybe right but boy they are scamming some pretty big names there, Bill Gates and Cummins.
Maybe they only want to develop the engine for military use, then they don't have to worry about emissions.

Have a good one.
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Follow Up By: fisho64 - Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 23:55

Sunday, Apr 03, 2011 at 23:55
"No 2-stroke has ever met current emission control levels, let alone future, harsher emission control levels. "

Im guessing you are referring to diesel 2S rather than all 2Strokes?
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 01:11

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 01:11
Fisho - Yes, the GM/Detroit Diesel and the UD Nissan 2-stroke were both forced out of the diesel market in the late 1990's when they couldn't meet emission targets of the early 2000's.
The only reason you can still find Detroits and parts for them, is because the US Military still runs about 300,000 of them - and of course, the military doesn't have to meet emission laws!
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Follow Up By: Dion - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 09:24

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 09:24
BS. "No 2-stroke has ever met current emission control levels, let alone future, harsher emission control levels. BS!

The 710 series GM two stroke diesel which is still going into new locomotives here, yes here in Australia meets the current emmission control levels.
Additionally there are tens of thousands of GM two stroke diesels world wide in locomotives, with Australia not being the only customer for these magnificant pieces of fine engineering design.

regards,
Dion.
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Follow Up By: Ron N - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 10:34

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 10:34
Ooh! - It looks like I've rubbed a 2-stroke-lover up the wrong way! LOL
So - if 2-stroke Detroit Diesels are so great, why was the last Detroit Diesel for automotive use produced in 1998, with the engine maker stating that there was no foreseeable way they could make the Detroit 2-stroke diesel meet future emission levels?

Let me re-phrase my statement. There is no 2-stroke that can ever meet emission control requirements - WITHOUT expensive catalytic reduction, urea treatments, efficiency-destroying EGR's, and a 100 other desperate methods to get the exhaust emissions down!

We are being sucked into paying for inefficiency with all these new engines. Why do all the newest models engines have a reduction of up to 5% in fuel efficiency? Because all the emission-control device are reducing engine efficiency! A four stroke engine gives adequate time for complete combustion to take place at speed, a 2-stroke doesn't.

2-strokes have been around for over 100 years, if they were the ants pants, they'd be the primary power source. Instead, 2-strokes have been banned in nearly every country of the world, including marine (outboard) use in many areas, because of their massive pollution output.
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Follow Up By: Dion - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 10:58

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 10:58
Ron,
" Instead, 2-strokes have been banned in nearly every country of the world, including marine (outboard) use in many areas, because of their massive pollution output."
Uhhhh, this is referring to SIE, not CIE outboards.
The efficiency between a 2 stroke CIE and 2 stroke SIE are like chalk and cheese.

regards,
Dion.
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Reply By: Dion - Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 09:45

Monday, Apr 04, 2011 at 09:45
The RAN aquired six Ton class mine sweepers from the RN in the '60's. Only two made it into the mid '80's, and HMAS Curlew was still in service in 1991 when I joined.
The diesels in them was the 18 cyl Napeir Deltic, which in turn had replaced the original fitted Mirlees Blackstone Engines.

regards,
Dion.
AnswerID: 450287

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