Hand positioning

Submitted: Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 19:25
ThreadID: 86387 Views:2873 Replies:13 FollowUps:19
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A Current Affair just had a story about older drivers, which i'm sur a few others saw.
During this story it mentioned that the older drivers were taught to have their hands on the steering wheel at the 10 and 2 position. As far as I knew this was normal. BUT, apparently with the newer cars we should be driving at the 9 and 3 position. Any ideas why the change? I missed what was said about why. (kids talking)

Anybody know when this changed, and what is classified as a newer car.
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Reply By: Member - Bruce T (SA) - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 19:40

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 19:40
Hi SDG,

While I was going through the road rules etc for training for driving a small bus we were told about that 'rule'. Apparently it has to do with airbags in the steering wheel and that if they explode they can remove your thumbs!! Not pleasant I would think. None of us knew about this. I was one of the older 'learners', but we also had 2-3 who were under 30 and they knew nothing about it. I now always try to drive at a quarter to three.

I've noticed that our 150 Prado has thumb rest set up in the quarter to three position.

Just goes to show.

Cheers,
Di
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Follow Up By: SDG - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:10

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:10
Been researching this since I posted it.

Mainly American sites, but they all talk about the airbags. Apparently there is a chance your arms in the 10 and 2 position can get wedged between the head/chest and airbag. At the 9 and 3 position the arms get thrown out.

Emergency vehicle drivers are being taught to drive at 8 and 4, as this is safer again.



Thanks everone for all the replies.


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Follow Up By: Busy Bee - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:26

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:26
Well seeing as I don't have airbags I can stick with 10 to 2 and wave as I go through the windscreen. At least my thumbs will be intact.
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Follow Up By: ob - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 10:54

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 10:54
Well me personally, by quarter to four I am looking for somewhere to camp for the night.



ob
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Reply By: MAVERICK(WA) - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 19:41

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 19:41
I would guess that it is to do with airbags fitted inside the centre of the wheel.
Just a hint though - stop watching and believing what is said on the infotainment shows at 6.30. They don't provide any value to life at all. rgds
Slow down and relax......

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Follow Up By: Bigfish - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 16:50

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 16:50
You mean that everything they say isnt true? Oh my god, I,ve been duped!!! LOL
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Reply By: Gone Bush (WA) - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 19:45

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 19:45
Gen Y can't understand it because they've all got digital watches.


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Follow Up By: silkwood - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 21:52

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 21:52
There's such a thing as being so behind you don't realise it's passed you by...

Digital watches went out in the nineties (in general), Gen Y don't usually use watches, they have phones for that :-).

Cheers,

Mark
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Follow Up By: Gone Bush (WA) - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:02

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:02
This is my latest watch:

Image Could Not Be Found

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Follow Up By: SDG - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:03

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:03
Just as well i'm Gen X, although I do wear a digital, I annoy others by keeping it in 24H format.

And I don't own a mobile.
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Follow Up By: Bigfish - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 16:52

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 16:52
Half of GenY wouldnt have the nounce to be able to put a watch on!!
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Reply By: Member - JohnBee (VIC) - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 20:06

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 20:06
Gday...

I am not sure airbags in the centre of the steering wheel is the reason .... whether at 10 to 2 or quarter to 3 ... I would have thought if it went off it would get ya anyhow.
However, I have been led to believe it is because wiper/washer and lights/blinker contrrols are at the quarter to three and it means your hands are properly placed to operate them without moving your hands on the wheel.

.... add disagreement here :-)

Cheers
John
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Follow Up By: Member - Robert R1 (SA) - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 20:11

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 20:11
JohnBee,

I like your explanation better. i don't much like the bit about having my thumbs blown off.

Regards,
Bob
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Follow Up By: vk1dx - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 04:42

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 04:42
Thats what I heard as well.

Pity the cops in those TV documentaries/live report shows dont do it also. I have seen them driving with just one finger on the wheel at the bottom.

Phil
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Reply By: Member - nick b - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 20:50

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 20:50
Hi all : when at the wheel I find I will have my hand in different positions as i'm not a robot . I do like to keep my hands well down 20 to 4 ,to keep arms rested on long runs .
when 4wding I like to keep my thumbs etc out of centre of the wheel .

cheers nick

Cheers Nick b

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Reply By: snoopyone - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 21:03

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 21:03
Never mind getting your thumbs blown off.

Its the airheads that insist on travelling with their feet on the dash that get me.

Are they closer to the monkeys or something.

They will be if an airbag goes off and stuff their knees just past their ears.

I read an article once by a trauma doctor who said this is quite common in accidents and in some cases has shoved the ankles up past their knees and crushed the chest on the way.

Not a partcularly nice thought..

Was always taught to drive with thumbs outside the wheel especially on tractors and off road vehicles

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Follow Up By: ob - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 11:02

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 11:02
Ain't Darwin's Theory of Evolution wonderful. Slows the dumbing down of the species.

ob
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Reply By: Holiday Maker - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 21:39

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 21:39
Hi All,

As a professional driving instructor I believe I may be able to to give a little insight to this question.

JohnBee is partially correct, it does assist in the operation of the indicators correctly. However, not all wiper systems are up/down.

I have never heard of "blowing he thumbs off" however, it is due to the correct operation of the air bags.

If you wear any jewellry, or a wrist watch, chances are if you are involved in an accident that the air bags go off, you will be wearing the said items on your face.

For the record, another common falicy I get told every day is that "You are not allowed to cross your arms!"

The problem with this instruction is that MOST people giving this advice do not know the difference between, :Crossing Arms" and "Overarming."

Consequently we have a lot of drivers incorrectly using the push/pull steering method in a dangerous manner.

Dusty
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Reply By: SDG - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:15

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:15
Never thought about the airbag answer. Never owned a vehicle that has one.


Thanks for all the replies.

Truth is...

How many of us drive with two hands at ALL times anyway?
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Reply By: Member - Tony V (NSW) - Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:36

Wednesday, May 18, 2011 at 22:36
Hmmm,

Back in 1970 when I took my test in the UK it was 9 and 3 on the steering wheel, I was also taught to push pull, a habit I still have. I was told back then it was for indicators and wipers, (remember when they had the horn at the end of the light stalk)... This was to put your hands where the controls were.

Hand position can cause tiredness, if the hands are higher than the heart, your body spends time pumping to the hands not the brain.

You quite often see the results of this with a P plater laying back in the seat hardly seeing over the steering wheel, the first thing is its one hand at the top of the wheel, and either leaning into the door or centre console, usually late at night when tired, the next thing you see, is it wrapped around a telegraph post...

Airbags are a minor cause of concern, depending where the front wheels are pointing your hands could be in the way of the airbag.
I did see a hand and wrist smash into the windscreen when an airbag went off in a Magna, I have the photos as the Magna hit my 100 (wife driving).

My 2 cents worth.
AnswerID: 454775

Follow Up By: AlanTH - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 11:26

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 11:26
"Back in 1970 when I took my test in the UK it was 9 and 3 on the steering wheel, I was also taught to push pull, a habit I still have."

You and me both Tony, but I was told by a sergeant traffic cop who partially taught me that it was for control of the vehicle.
Whatever, I still drive like that unlike many on the roads who steer with finger tips or a wrist draped over the wheel while they lounge in the corner of the seat.
Seems as if that is a favourite driving position of WAs finest as well!
I often wonder if the bad steering position is the reason so many drivers can't control their vehicle in emergency situations and run off the road, especially in the country.
AlanH.
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Follow Up By: Roachie.kadina.sa.au - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 17:10

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 17:10
Gee, last time I saw a telegraph post was when I drove to Cape York in 2004.

Telegraph posts have not been used in this country for many decades.

I think you might find that all those whiz-bang WRX Subarus that get themselves 're-arranged' are generally wrapped around an ELECTRICITY pole.... ;-)

Roachie
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Follow Up By: Member - Bruce Y (Vic) - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 20:14

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 20:14
Roachie, I see your from SA so wouldn't it be a stobie pole???
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Follow Up By: Roachie.kadina.sa.au - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 21:04

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 21:04
Bruce, I'm an expat of NSW....only been over here since 2002....so I still refer to them as "electricity poles".

My old man (RIP) used to get the chits with TV announcers when they called power poles "telegraph poles"....he had been a linesman for the Murrumbidgee County Council (Narrandera) for many years....he taught us kids to NOT refer to them as telegraph poles.

Roachie
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Follow Up By: Member - Bruce Y (Vic) - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 21:29

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 21:29
Roachie I was only joking with you, Yes the only places as a kid we would see telegraph poles were alongside railway lines but you only see the odd disused ones now, the references we use are power poles or light poles (depending on wether there is a light attached) but in SA they have their poles with concrete between two steel beams called stobie poles. When an item was printed about an accident involving a stobie pole you could pick the people from other states by their head scratching and questions along the lines of "What the hell is a stobie pole". Hence when I seen SA beside your name I thought I'd ask...
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Follow Up By: Roachie.kadina.sa.au - Friday, May 20, 2011 at 20:00

Friday, May 20, 2011 at 20:00
Yeh mate....I knew you were having a joke with me...

I actually knew what a stobie pole was before I came to live in SA....had been here a few times on holidays over the years and picked up the unusual name.

I tell you what....a late model vehicle is no match for a stobie pole.....they aren't any softer than the timber poles used in other states that's for sure!!! hahaha
Cheers mate
Roachie
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Reply By: LineB - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 00:34

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 00:34
Gee. Lots of different ideas posted about how you rest your hands on the wheel. To my mind, none of it has whit to do with air bags, more to do with not having any power steering at all.

When I was enjoying myself driving a Blitzwagon carting 17-tons across the French Line in 1963, my mechanics advised, to avoid the kick-back and lose a thumb on the next big jolt, I should keep my fingers only inside the ring of the steering wheel. Very much so, thumbs outside.

For those drivers low on basics, keeping your thumbs outside the rim must look curious around the suburbs, but that is the way I get around these days, too. 10 to 2 for me, SDG.


www.simpsondesert.fl.net.au
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Follow Up By: Ianw - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 20:51

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 20:51
Used to drive the ol mans tractor as a 12 year old. You learned very quickly to keep the thumbs outside of the wheel if you drove a Massey Ferguson 65. Steering wheel was very close to the throttle lever; hit a stump or stone the steering wheel would rotate violently and jamb said thumb between the two. Very painful !

Ian
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Reply By: Member - Trev A (SA) - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 08:58

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 08:58
No.1 son happened to have this discussion with his driving instructor the other day.
Her suggestion was 10 and 2 when driving around town with lots of corners and 9 and 3 when on the open road with more bends. Mainly for ease and comfort of driving.
Just another view on it.
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Reply By: Danger Mouse - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 12:16

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 12:16
I'd question the airbag reason for 2 reasons:

1. Australian Airbags do not deploy at anywhere near the force or velocity of US airbags, as in the US Airbags are required as a primary restraint because seat belts are not mandatory in many states. In Oz, however, where seat belts are required by law, airbags are a supplementary restraint (hence the moniker 'SRS Airbags' which means Supplementary Restraint System). Thus any injury caused by the airbag deployment in Australia will be less than that in the US.

2. I recall Mythbusters doing a show on this subject and they busted the myth that airbags could "rip your thumbs off". Not sure how much I believe Mythbusters, but an interesting tidbit.

FWIW, even at 10 to 2, the force of the airbag is more likely to fling your arms up and away, rather than directly back into your face.
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Follow Up By: snoopyone - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 17:33

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 17:33
They will however stuff your knees into your face if feet are on the dash in front of them.

It was an Australian doctor I was referring to.
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Reply By: Ianw - Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 20:31

Thursday, May 19, 2011 at 20:31
This question was posed on Eddies Millionaire Hot Seat program just last week !!
I got it wrong cos I said 10 to 2. It wasnt even an option in the answers.

Correct answer was given as "quarter to three" as that is where the indicator and wiper controls are.

Recommended by some road saftey mob, apparently.

Must be correct as Eddie said so !!

Ian
AnswerID: 454869

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