Any Fish farmers/experts out there??????

Submitted: Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 13:35
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Since 5am this morning I have been rescueing large perch beaching themselves and dying on the edge of our dam and relocating into another where they are well and happy, although it is weed free and I hope they don't starve. This has occured following the rain storm we had a few days back. I am just hoping the barra that are in there survive. Has anyone any clues?
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Reply By: Andrew - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 13:52

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 13:52
Mrs Nurse - I would guess hypoxia - have you checked their O2 sats or blood gases.
AnswerID: 38799

Follow Up By: Andrew - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 14:43

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 14:43
My guess is that the water has become cloudy, nutrients have been washed into the water, algae are growing, and that the oxygen levels in the water are dropping. Try filling a barrel or wheelbarrow with water from the affected dam, aerate it either by tipping it in and making bubbles or better still use some sort of aerator. Then put one of the distressed fish in it and see if they are happy.
Andrew
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:01

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:01
Andrew,you sound as though you have hit the nail on the head. I rang Geoff before I sent in the question and we wondered if we should put a fountain or similar, as the drought has made all sorts of problems with dust blowing into the dam therefore creating an algae. We have no fertilizers or chemicals on the hill from where the water runs. There is a driveway up further, maybe oil or something drifted down, not that it is noticable in the water. As for my nursing experience, tails and scales are out of my area, thank goodness, there is enough problems with the tailess smoothskinned humans. I am not a fisherman either I had to catch these with a clothes basket:>) Glad we haven't got neighbours, what a sight, I was in the dam more than the fish. Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:14

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:14
Andrew, I have put the dead ones in the outside freezer for research and maybe bait for a fishing day. Just hope no one steals them like someone did to a neighbour. He had a beast which was killed by dingoes, instead of waste, baited it in pieces and stuck it in the freezer in the shed. The meat was stolen a few days later. Jen
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Follow Up By: Andrew - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:55

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:55
.....the other bit of research you could do would be to cook one up for Geoff tonight and see what.......LOL...... no on second thoughts maybe NOT. "Dingoes and beasts" - clearly you are not my neighbour in Melbourne.
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 18:44

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 18:44
No, very clear Andrew, I couldn't live in the city let alone Melbourne, born and bred in the bush, went to the city found the man of my life, took him back to the bush and the rest is mystery.I think I have done enough research on him with my cooking and I think he would survive most experiments:>))) Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 23:45

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 23:45
Andrew, after you mentioning that I serve Geoff the fish for dinner, he took me out to Subway for a spendid healthy meal. You'll have to say things like that more often. LOL Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 08:45

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 08:45
Subway arent bad are they - nice to have a pretty healthy take away - though I reckon that it sounds like fish tonight for Geoff. LOL. (Wonder where he'll take you tonight!!)
Andrew
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 08:48

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 08:48
PS - I would love to see a photo of you out in grubby water with algae hanging off you and hair wet and grubby while catching fish with a clothes basket. LOL LOL LOL LOL. You sound gorgeous. LOL LOL LOL LOL.
Andrew
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 16:08

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 16:08
I will let you know where we dine tonight, maybe the beach for some junk food, for a change. We are being happily frugal and doing well at the moment and appreciate a meal out in a relaxed atmosphere. Next time I look like a bush bashing mermaid with no tail I will arrange a photographer, for you. LOL!LOL!
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 22:06

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 22:06
Well, Andrew, we stayed home and Geoff cooked worms for dinner, (Spaghetti +) and it was just right. By the way Geoff says I am gorgeous, even at my worst, and I tell him to get his eyes checked, you might have to get your ears or whatever tested:>))))) Yesterdays look may have made a good comic strip for some yuppy magazine,( haha) like I said, glad we haven't got close neighbours and plenty of hills and trees to hide us and what goes on here. Satellites these days, may be a worry though, I didn't think of them. Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew & Jen - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 23:53

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 23:53
What a sensitive new age guy that Geoff is. First he takes you out and then the next night he cooks for you. I will have to make sure my Jen doesn't read about this. (Though fourteen of us - neighbors in the same street did go out for dinner - what a great thing community is) Satellite guys would get a fright. A bedraggled creature coming out of a slimy dam with a washing basket and a couple of sick fish.... Think is my typing fingers that need testing...
Andrew2001 Landcruiser 100S T/ Diesel
"Less plannin' an' more trippin'"
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 11:13

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 11:13
Andrew, you must live in a good area for a city, with neighbours like that. We have excellent neighbours here, although very distant, without living in other's pocket. I am hoping to get them all here for some neighbourhood fling early in the new year. EH! tell your Jen about Geoff's treats to me, or better still, you might like to surprise her with the same treats, it does wonderful things to a girl and you get then end result. Nothing like pleasing your other half. Try it. Let me know how you go or if you want more councilling :>) Geoff is definently not a SNAG just a sensitive bonza bloke. Yes the satellite thing is a worry if they can zoom into peoples back yards now, Thank God for large trees. Maybe your fingernails are too long which affect your typing?? LOL. One thing about this forum it has given us some communication laughs, which we all need more often these days. Although my fish are still dying :>(
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew & Jen - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 16:33

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 16:33
Thanks for the counselling - it really helps and reminded me that it was our wedding anniversary tomorrow. So I am off to Bunnings to find something rooly beautaful.
Fish still dying! Have you tried swimming around in water with a snorkel and blowing bubbles out of your mouth to aerate the water?
Our neighbors are great - one of them has just bought a four wheel drive and wants to come out 4wding - now for the other ten.
Andrew2001 Landcruiser 100S T/ Diesel
"Less plannin' an' more trippin'"
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 20:56

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 20:56
Andrew, full marks for remembering your wedding anniversary,Good boy and Very best wishes for you and Jen for many happy years together, Congratulations!!! I bet you haven't been married as long as us,( and sweet Geoff never forgets) cos your rig looks as though you have beautiful children hanging out every window and on the top. Goodness, Did you run out of room?:>) We have 2 girls 2 boys (3 married) and now the offspring have sprung x2 with 2 more early next year. Yes, the fish are still dying and I had a thought this morning of throwing the ball into the dam and getting the dog to fetch it back, just to give the old dam some movement. The dog enjoyed herself anyway, we will find out if the fish did tomorrow. Did you reply to our plight in wanting to save in one of the threads, as we have now bought a computer CD from Simply Budgets which is excellent to help plan and construct a financial outlook into many years ahead. I just noticed that you were saving for a camper trailer, and we are finding with following this controlled budgeting we will be debt free by end of next year, and that is good going for us. At the moment we are doing really well and can see our money growing. If you look up www.simplybudgets.com it is well explained and helpful. Just food for thought. Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Andrew & Jen - Monday, Dec 01, 2003 at 06:56

Monday, Dec 01, 2003 at 06:56
I was just saying to Jenelle on the weekend that maybe we need to budget. It would be great to have a camper and also spend some money around the house but I think that it might be time to batton down the hatches a bit and pay some more off the mortgage with interest rates on the up. With all those kids squashed (almost) into the car it aint cheap. Will have a look at the website. Was me regarding the saving advice few weeks back - all in the same boat really!! Oh well - off to work now!!
Andrew2001 Landcruiser 100S T/ Diesel
"Less plannin' an' more trippin'"
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FollowupID: 82839

Follow Up By: Member - Andrew & Jen - Monday, Dec 01, 2003 at 06:56

Monday, Dec 01, 2003 at 06:56
I was just saying to Jenelle on the weekend that maybe we need to budget. It would be great to have a camper and also spend some money around the house but I think that it might be time to batton down the hatches a bit and pay some more off the mortgage with interest rates on the up. With all those kids squashed (almost) into the car it aint cheap. Will have a look at the website. Was me regarding the saving advice few weeks back - all in the same boat really!! Oh well - off to work now!!
Andrew2001 Landcruiser 100S T/ Diesel
"Less plannin' an' more trippin'"
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FollowupID: 82840

Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Monday, Dec 01, 2003 at 15:10

Monday, Dec 01, 2003 at 15:10
HAPPY ANNIVERSARY ANDREW AND JEN all the best for you and your plans for the future. We know what it is like to rear a family and give them a good education and do the right thing to keep them on the straight and narrow, it is hard and expensive. We had private home education for our 4 ( as we live in the sticks) and copped a lot of opposition while doing it by many people, but I am glad we stuck to what we believed was right for us, at the time. We have strong kids with good well paid jobs yet not into the grotty peers of the earth. I think that is one thing that has left us financially drained, but we have not got other worries with the kids. We have found this "simply budgets" have made us focus and think when we are about to spend, as it is all graphed and balanced out. As we have our own business we have calculated our budgeting on a minimum monthly wage, so any extra is saving. It is amazing how much grocery product you can get for $50 per week, although in Melbourne things may be more expensive, and another thing is we have only one 19 year boy left at home. If you and Jen want to ever get in touch with Geoff or myself, instead of using the forum concerning your budgeting etc. feel free to contact us at gocruise@bigpond.com Jen
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Reply By: Moose - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 14:27

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 14:27
I'm no fish expert but it sounds like the storm has washed something into the dam that is affecting the water quality. Could it have washed in something that is somehow lowering the level of oxygen in the water - chemicals perhaps? You may want to contact the State Fisheries mob for some advice.
AnswerID: 38802

Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:07

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 16:07
Thanks Moose, I think we may work on creating a flow in the water of some sort, to raise the O2 levels as we have not had the rain to give it a good flush out for a couple of years. As I said in the top followup , the dust has been a problem, and we do have a high acid soil with a high mineral salt content. So might be worth giving the fisheries blokes a ring and see if they can think of a bright idea. Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 18:54

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 18:54
Moose, I rang a fish hatchery this afternoon and they said a lot of people are having the same problem, but losing thousands, since the storm. This is what he told me, "the storm a low pressure system which reduced the oxygen in the dams" so we have had to put a pressure pump on the dam and force the water to break to release oxygen through the water. We have never heard of this before, must be a modern break through. We have set it up now, so we should see better results tomorrow morning when all is still, if this theory is correct. I hope it is, after all the fuss and bother. jen
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Reply By: Member - Eskimo - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 19:11

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 19:11
had an large aquarium once (some 15 yrs) that didnt have a air pump. Used a circulating pump to remove waste and other stuff but no air bubbles through those aerator stones.

all i had was plants and fed them (the palnts) with a special fertilser)

the plants gave oxygen back to the water. Plant life also helps with absorbing other nasties

Unless the surface area is large and fish populations are sized correctly you do need plant life in the dam. No plant life also means no food. Yabbies( fresh water crayfish you might no them by) require food, as do nymphs, scudds etc.

all this makes for a healthy pond/dam
Being a trout fisherman and a club member we will not stock new dams because of no food etc and low oxygen levels caused by no plants and higher temps......a virgin dam can take up to 5-6 yrs before it becomes suitable for stocking with fryWow! am I cute
If yer ain't fishing, Yer ain't livin
Richard
AnswerID: 38834

Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 23:40

Friday, Nov 28, 2003 at 23:40
Eskimo, the dam they were having trouble in was deep and full of water weed, lilys, plants and moss, and yet it did not seem to help. I thought the same as you, that the plants should be doing their job, but apparently not, as there was a serious ploblem. As soon as I saw one dead fish I ran for it, grabbed a plastic laundry basket, and ran all morning back and forwards 200mtres each time with a couple of fish, hopefully to a safer enviroment. This was to our household dam from which we pump for the septic system, and gardens. We try and keep this one weedfree mainly because of the continual pumping. They seem to be very happy there, as they all really revived immediately, except one which obviously was left too long. I am wondering how I will catch them to put them back if this method( as told above) works, we will see the outcome on the problem dam in the morning before the breeze starts. I do not know much about these golden perch, but, when I was a kid I know we used to catch some sort of perch in the paddocks waterholes ( thats when it used to rain regularly) and it was tea tree country where the water was grey and there was no plantlife with just tree roots overhanging in the water. I was told the perch are a vegetation and moss eating fish, so if the worst comes to the worst and I miss catching them all I will have to build them a garden in the corner of the household dam. Thanks for replying, Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Eskimo - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 09:35

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 09:35
rain water run-off after a hottish period will also deplete the oxygen levels.

we have lost countless fish during the summer months when we get heavy summer storm. The deeper pools in a river can harbour a few fish but the shallow water is disastrous Wow! am I cute
If yer ain't fishing, Yer ain't livin
Richard
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 15:57

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 15:57
You could be right Eskimo, actually the ground is like concrete and harbours the heat. We had a couple of fish come to the edge this morning, but they seemed to pick up after a while. They may be feeding toward the edge amongst the weeds when they develop complications, as it is quite deep in the middle. I think we may have to think of another way of stirring up the water to break it up, therefore bringing in more oxygen.
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Follow Up By: Member - Eskimo - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 18:01

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 18:01
adelaide city council just use a fountain to help aerate our canal albeit the river torrens. seems to work a treat!...

Must be based on water flow to get right aeration rate thoughWow! am I cute
If yer ain't fishing, Yer ain't livin
Richard
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 21:49

Saturday, Nov 29, 2003 at 21:49
Richard, thanks for your input, much appreciated. We were just talking about putting a hose on the end of the compressor and forcing the air under the water, which would create a rough turbulance in the depths. So we will give that a little thought tomorrow. Do you think this should be consistant over a long period, or say just a few hours per day for a period would be enough to regenerate the oxygen. If only we would get some decent rains, life would be much easier and profitable. Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Eskimo - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 10:22

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 10:22
dunno ....how long is a piece of string?
it all depneds on how big the dam is i reckon.
one can buy oxygen level meters ...price?
contact a good aquarium placeWow! am I cute
If yer ain't fishing, Yer ain't livin
Richard
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 11:21

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 11:21
Richard, I think we might give up until the weather patterns change, if ever. We had some more die overnight, although it rained a little and I thought that may help. Might look into putting in redclaw or yellow belly instead, they tend to be hardy. I will have to do some research. The water levels are dropping severely so the dam is not as big as when they were first in there. Jen
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Follow Up By: bruce.h (WA) - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 15:56

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 15:56
gday guys
all the above sujestion may be correct fish osaul wiil only come to the surface or edge of a body of water if they are sick or the water body lack oxygen.
btw eric its not the air bubbles from an air stone that place oxygen in the water its the movement of the water surface that cause interaction with the air that oxygenates the tank so your pump sucking water out & pumping it back in would have been craeting movement of the water thus oxgenating it the same can be done with the pond create movement of the surface to help create oxygen the other posiblity is that the protien levels hav increased to dangerous levels due to fertilisers if you fit a fountain & a dirty brown faom forms on the surface near the fuontain this will indicate that the protien levels of the pond are high
hope this helps
regards Bruce
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Reply By: Member - Eric- Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 08:51

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 08:51
keeping salt water fish in a dam ? if you can email me exact info . ill attempt to give you ideas to keem them alive , I have have kept Snapper and whitting alive in tanks for over 2 years Venus Bay
AnswerID: 38937

Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 10:54

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 10:54
No Eric, these are fresh water fish. We are still having trouble losing them. Poor things. I would love to have some ideas in keeping these fish alive or any others, as I love the outdoors and all the creatures that are meant for our joy and entertainment. You can email us at gocurise@bigpond.com Thanks Jen
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Follow Up By: Member - Geoff & Jen - Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 11:27

Sunday, Nov 30, 2003 at 11:27
Sorry Eric, our address is gocruise@bigpond.com Slip of the fingers. Jen
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