Which Lights?!

Gday Mob,
I'm looking to throw some spotties on the Triton and I've got a conundrum - $330 for a set of Lightforce Genesis 210's or $660 for a set of Genesis 210 HID's?
Are the HID's twice as good as the straight up Genesis lights or is it just hype?
I am doing a deal of night driving but in hill/mountain country so sheer distance of light is not generally an issue but I don't want to end up thinking I should have paid the extra to get the "better" light. Has anybody got any feedback on either lights? Appreciate the feedback.
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Reply By: Kris and Kev - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 08:17

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 08:17
Sorry, cannot help with the HID aspect, but.
I know Lightforce are Australian made and make very good lights, but just watch their warranty provisions. (Could be the same with all makes, but just my experience with them.)
We had problems with our Genesis lights when we did the Kimberley last year. The lights were only a few months old and the screws on the face came loose and a few fell out! I had to use tape to hold the face on, on both lights.
I was not impressed and even less impressed when I was able to phone Lightforce and with their reply. I had to end up going to the first hardware we could find and buying standard screws to put in. (Silly me, I thought I could just drive to a dealer and have them look at the lights and replace the screws!)
A long story, but Lightforce will not allow you just to go a dealer and gets parts under warranty. You have to send the lights back to them, which is a bit hard when travelling in the Kimberley for 3 months, but their care factor was zip. I am happy with the lights performance, but just check those screws when travelling. And don't expect to get help under warranty when travelling.
AnswerID: 485613

Follow Up By: Muntoo - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 18:14

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 18:14
I have the oppsosite opinion.

Lightforce fully replaced a 240 Blitz light for me that had water entry and went black, my own fault. Even gave me a new HID globe.

I did have to send it to them, but thats fine.

Have a look how many Hella 4000s you see with missing lenses, or missing altogether with just the base still there. I know, as i sold these lights for years. And they are still my choice of light. But if you dont threadlock the bolts, they will eventually come loose and you will lose either the lense or the whole light assembly.

Hella, will not replace the parts no matter what. No matter how loud you can bark.

I recommend that all nuts and bolts on lights be thread locked. And security nuts added too to prevent theft.

Back to halogen and HID, if you are doing alot of night driving go HID.

The Genesis arent really the pick of the crop but. If you are doing mainly hilly driving then i would go with some spread beam lights. The Genesis spreads are poor though, so might not do a very good job.

I have had a few LED lightbars now, 3w and 10w and have sold them all.

Not my cup of tea, until they get better distance i wont be getting them again.

Although Hella have just released a LED light in the same housing as there 4000X. I reckon they would be worth owning. But would cost the earth.

Nothing beats LED for worklights and stuff, but for me i need some distance too. For you LED may be all you need though.

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Follow Up By: Kris and Kev - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 18:48

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 18:48
Yes, I agree as I have heard how good they are at after sales service. But, we were half way through our 3 month Kimberley trip and there was no way we could post the lights and get them back while on the go. Which surely is not an unheard of happening.
Lightforce would not allow us to go to a dealer and get replacement screws. We also did try 2 dealers and they also confirmed that Lightforce does not allow them to fix lights under warranty, even just to replace some screws. The person I spoke to at Lightforce could not understand my dilemma and had no concept of four wheel driving and being away from home for an extended period of time. She even said one of their reps might be near where we are and he could help and gave me his phone number. After a number of phone calls I eventually spoke to him and he laughed as he is in Perth, a long way from the Kimberley and never travels that far. He also could not help, but did send some screws to our home address. As I said, I did go to a hardware and buy different screws but it was the principle of their warranty provisions and the screws should never have come out in the first place. Remembering these lights are not cheap.
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Follow Up By: david m5 - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 19:58

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 19:58
Lightforce Never again . plastic rubbish and the lightforce people dont give a crap
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Reply By: AlbyNSW - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 08:31

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 08:31
I upgraded my halogen Narvas to HID and distance aside I think the quality of light is better.
The Roos on the side of the road are highlighted and much easier to spot, the only negative comment would be that you get a bit of reflection back from road signs but I can live with that.
If you are more interested in spread than distance the LED light bars work very well too
AnswerID: 485617

Reply By: RodH, Sydney - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 09:13

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 09:13
I am glad AlbyNSW raised the option of LED's. Is it time to seriously consider them rather than HID's? For example, ther have been some positive stories about Great White LED bars and round lights. See http://www.greatwhites.com.au/
Rod, Perth

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AnswerID: 485621

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 10:36

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 10:36
Rod we have been doing some testing of the Great Whites and comparing them against HID, Halogen with HID conversion and Halogen lights.

The Great Whites are the pick of current LED driving lights and a great for driving in tight hilly terrain but no match on the HID lights for general driving.

What we found was the LED lights generate a very intense bright white light over a distance of 15 to 150m but will illuminate up to about 350m maximum.... the down side of this intense light output at 15 to 150m is your eyes start shutting down not enabling you to see distance reducing reaction time..... remember at 100Kph you traveling nearly 30m per second.

The same applies to LED light bars and some resellers will try and tell you the are better then HID driving lights, WRONG..... again they offer intense short distance light our put but not much else..... think of a work light on steroids.

There is no other light source that has the performance at close range as LED's do but your paying a premium.

The down fall of LED lighting is the light is very directional and has a small scatter spectrum meaning the light will not bend and illuminate around an object like a tree causing a huge black spot....... Halogen and HID don't suffer as much.

Bang for bucks you can not beat HID.
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Follow Up By: RodH, Sydney - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 15:04

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 15:04
Thanks olcoolone. That is just the information I was after. Regards

Rod, Perth

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FollowupID: 760881

Follow Up By: J&V - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 23:39

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 23:39
To add my 2-bobs worth, I have a set of 7inch Roadvison Cobra HID spotties on my 100 series. Only recently fitted these and as yet have not done any serious night driving other than to adjust the spotties. The mounting system for these lights are that fiddley that i almost un-bolted them and threw them in the bush there and then!!! (normally i am a very patient person)
Prior to my 100 series, I had an 80 series that I fitted with Cibie Super Oscars and I can say that in the 14 years I had these lights on the cruiser, I never once broke a lens, blew a globe or had them come loose. The mounting system was simple, sturdy and very easy to adjust the lights. Although the Cibies are not HID, I am regretting buying the Roadvision at nearly twice the cost of what I could of got Cibies for. Will be driving Perth - Brisbane soon so will be some sort of test for the Roadvisions.
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Reply By: Erad - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 10:13

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 10:13
I have fitted a LED light bar to my Pajero. I was expecting wonders and mostly I am satisfied. The light I bought (from ebay) was listed as a spot/flood light. It is a 18 x 3W Cree LEDs (72W total) and is awesome in its light output. However - it doesn't seem to have a great distance penetration.

It turns out that the LED I bought was a flood light only. Now, for my application, this doesn't really matter because the spread of the light is about 60 Degree included angle, meaning that the shoulders of the road are drowned in light. The effective side spread is at least60 m across, meaning that the roadsides are well lit up. For my night driving - mountainous country, winding road, hills etc, that is perfect. I now have a central yellowish area of light (the high beams) surrounded by a whitish (almost daylight) side penetration. For the price (about $200), i really don't think you could go wrong, but I would look much closer if you want to light up something 400 m down the road - mine won't do it.

Incidentally, the LED claims respect. Lots of oncoming drivers are slow in dipping their lights. I always dip early - I don't want anyone dazzled by my lights and them hitting me. But if they are too slow to dip, one brief flash is all that is required. You never have to ask tiwce.

AnswerID: 485628

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 10:44

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 10:44
Erad, your spot on as per my post above.

make a very good short distance flood light.

We here a lot of stories from people who had spent over $1200 on a light bar thinking it's the best you can get for vehicle lighting only to be disappointed.

We find our LED light bar is fantastic up to a range on 70m in hilly off road terrain.
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Reply By: Member - Mark (Tamworth NSW) - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 19:02

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 19:02

For 30 years I used 100W Cibie Super Oscars, they were great, unbreakable (apart from when a roo hit them)
But they just don't compare to HIDs.
I got a pair of Chinese ones, I had them for 3 years, but haven't tested their mounting integrity on severe corrugations of any distance yet though.

The reflection you get from road signs is annoying, but of you ate in country which has plenty of signs to throw back the light, you probably don't need HIDs either.

AnswerID: 485649

Follow Up By: Member - TLC 001 - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 21:09

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 21:09
Hello Mark,

Like you, I was and still are a Super Oscar fan. I have 55w 4300k HID in mine, the ballasts and sundries fit behind the reflector. Best lights I've ever used, only problem is seeing others coming toward me on hilly roads. I throw out so much light, I don't see the glare of the OP high beam until I see their lights. :(



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Follow Up By: Member - Mark (Tamworth NSW) - Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 21:58

Saturday, May 12, 2012 at 21:58
Marcus, unfortunately the Super Oscars no longer fit in the bull bar (Smart Bar) on the Paj, so I had to go for a smaller diamater set of lights.
Where did you get the HID kits for the super oscars?

FollowupID: 760917

Follow Up By: Member - TLC 001 - Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 09:38

Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 09:38
Hi Mark,
I purchased from this seller on ebay.


I have seen cheaper, but these have lasted over two years now. and about 5000klm of night time driving, and still going strong. They take about 5 seconds to get to full power output when they havent been used for a few minutes, like all HID's. The globe is designated as a H1.

Good luck and regards

FollowupID: 760930

Reply By: gbc - Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 09:32

Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 09:32
I got some nitestalker 170 HID's on the strength of a 4wd mag comparo. They boot my old IPF's out of the park. No reason to spend extra $$ if there isn't a need. Oh, and noone has nicked them yet like the flash ones.
AnswerID: 485683

Reply By: blown4by - Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 15:10

Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 15:10
I have been using driving lights of various type for over 40 years for rallying, professional and private use and have tried SEV Marchal, Bosch SL5 (SL200), Rallye 4000, Lightforce Blitz 240 100W QH and Lightforce Blitz 240 35W HID.
For my money the Rallye 4000's win hands down overall for longevity, ease of adjustment, globe life, STAYING CORRECTLY ADJUSTED, availability of parts, availability of Hella suppliers, price and overall performance.
To me HID are a reasonable light but not twice as good as good quality QH lamps and one problem with them is the light performance in the mid range. Long range and close range is good but there is a 'dark section' in the mid range. I have tried the Lightforce combo filters and rotating the reflector but find that both are just a gimmick really. There is also a disadvantage in the reflection back to the driver when passing reflective road signs that are in good condition. As you say you are doing hilly/mountain driving so I would think one Rallye 4000 each pencil and spread would be the way to go.
If you want to know which lights are 'the go' have a look at what the majority of professional long distance truckies are using.
AnswerID: 485703

Reply By: Bobba - Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 15:43

Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 15:43
Hi Benno,

In response to your original question, I reckon if you can get HID Genesis for that price then go for it. Even the halogen at that price is a bargain.

I have an old set of LightForce Blitz 240 and they have been a great light, one day I'll put a HID upgrade in them. I'd consider putting the combo lenses/diffusers on both lights too. The spots throw no light to the sides so I put one combo cover on and this helped so I tried another and I think it's a pretty perfect set-up. The throw down the road is still heaps but my side light is now great.

AnswerID: 485706

Follow Up By: Member - Benno - Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 23:46

Sunday, May 13, 2012 at 23:46
Gday Mob,
Thanks for your feedback.
Particularly the HID Vs "standard" lights info, and also the LED bar-strips.
A good point raised was the spread of the Genesis lights but maybe the right lense could help this (?) and the other options for me to consider, some I hadn't thought of.
Either way, after nearly smacking a wombat, I've got to get them on (or stop driving in the bush at night!).
Thanks for the info. Will let you know how it goes.
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Follow Up By: AlbyNSW - Monday, May 14, 2012 at 08:03

Monday, May 14, 2012 at 08:03
Any of the light comparo tests that I have seen have the Lightforce being one of the best for distance but at the lower end of the pack with spread. If spread is what you are after maybe one of the other brands will suit you better?
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Reply By: coonick - Monday, May 14, 2012 at 22:36

Monday, May 14, 2012 at 22:36
Lightfoce seem to be great lights but are by no means the best, there are other brands now as good if not better. Lightforce seem to have been the toss toss brand. I had hella 4000`s on my GU for 7 years and ella DID replace one light twice due to a fault when I first moutned them. NO QUESTIONS.
The hellas are great lights and I reckon I will buy them for my ranger when I eventually get it. I honestly dont see the need for spotlights that have so called 1km range. I would say 4 - 500 mtrs at most. I prefer more of a spread than distance.
I also dont mind the ability of the fyrlights either.
Which ever light you buy none of them are worth the ridiculous prices they ask. The price factor is a joke.
AnswerID: 485840

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