Extra fuel filter

Submitted: Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 07:58
ThreadID: 99861 Views:3062 Replies:8 FollowUps:24
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We are heading on our trip soon and i am concerned about picking up bad fuel and was wandering if any advice on installing an extra fuel filter. Some say place at tank end or last. Hints on where and what filter. 2012 GX 200 cruiser diesel.
Regards
Richard
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Reply By: Member - Tony (ACT) - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 08:06

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 08:06
I think it would be a great idea, but not down at the tank, up in the engine bay, a lot easier to see/replace.

There is a mob in Canberra that do extra/replacement filter systems, worth a yarn them.
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Reply By: Kris and Kev - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 08:08

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 08:08
Richard heaps of good info on fuel filters on the Land Cruiser's owners web site. Some people also use one of these- 'Mr Funnel Fuel Filter Funnel'.
Also, make sure your vehicle insurance will cover for contaminated fuel, not all companies do.
Also, carry a spare fuel filter as they are very easy to change yourself.
Kevin
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Follow Up By: 410 - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 08:30

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 08:30
Hi Kev
Thanks, where do you get the funnel from?
Richard
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Follow Up By: Kris and Kev - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:09

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:09
BCF use to sell them. Or try on line. You can get different sizes, different flow rates. Kevin
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Follow Up By: 410 - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:19

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:19
Thankyou
Do they keep out water?
Richard
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Follow Up By: Member - bbuzz (NSW) - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:43

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:43
They look good but the flow rate seems to be a little slow.

How do they behave when you are juggling holding the funnel and the bowser hose? I can see some spillage occurring.

bill
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 11:52

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 11:52
Now that's something worth investing in. Anyone know what the filters cost, google isn't much help?
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 12:05

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 12:05
Scratch that. Just read the FAQs on the website, it's a disposable system so you buy a new one every so often.
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Follow Up By: Member - eighty matey - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 22:11

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 22:11
My mate took a 'Mr Funnel Fuel Filter Funnel' when we went away last year.

It ran the fuel through as quick as the pumps put the fuel in.

He bought it from BCF for about $100 from memory and it filters out everything, according to the blurb that came with it,

Steve
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Reply By: bluefella - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:58

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 09:58
The biggest killer of motors is water in the fuel, so i have fitted a waterwatch system from responsive engineering, have a search on your browser check it out,
Imho the best insurance.
no affilliation with em'
AnswerID: 501982

Follow Up By: Member - John G - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:13

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:13
G'day Blue

A question asked out of ignorance - my 2000 Hilux has a fuel filter with an electronic warning if water is detected. Does the waterwatch system add any value to that system?

The system has activated a couple of times, and I either drain the filter, change the filter, or drain any water out of the tank - or all three.

Cheers
John
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Follow Up By: Ozhumvee - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:23

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:23
The problem is John that these modern common rail engines cannot handle any contamination, your hilux would possibly pass a little bit and be ok which would stop a common rail engine completely.
Toyota's diesels have always had a water trap and warning light right from the early 80's but as time goes on the engines themselves are less and less tolerant.
The Mr Funnel funnels work well and while it may slow the filling process it is far cheaper than engine damage.
Peter
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Follow Up By: Member - Serendipity(WA) - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 11:52

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 11:52
I also have a water watch fitted. I ended up putting mine down where the fuel tank change over solenoids are located. Besides not being a lot of room under the bonnet I also thought I would like the water alarm to be as far from the engine as possible to stop a sudden flood of water getting through to the injectors before I can shut the motor down.

Serendipity


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Follow Up By: Member - John G - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:23

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:23
Thanks Peter
John
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Reply By: Joker - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:24

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:24
I have heard that depending on the flow rate of these aftermarket add on fuel filters the extra strain on the fuel pump can cause it to fail. In my case around $6000.00 worth to fix. Also warranty would probably be void. I would do my research before deciding. Removing water with Mr Funnel into a Jerry can and transferring into vehicle seems to me to be a safer option.

Cheers.
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Follow Up By: garrycol - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 12:36

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 12:36
If indeed an issue (which it is not) you are confusing the lift pump with the injector pump. The lift pump will only be a few hundred $$$ where the injector pump may be thousands - the injector pump does not suck - it only blows and is provided fuel from a lift pump (or something similar).

Garry
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Follow Up By: Ross M - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 13:10

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 13:10
Good on you Garry to correct that belief.
Many people automatically talk about inj pumps and fuel pump as being the same.
On a Dmax/Colorado, for example, there is an electric pressure delivery pump in the tank.
There is a lift/supply, engine driven pump to positively deliver fuel to the high pressure injection system and CRD rail.

So three pumps in all and unless posters know exactly what they are referring to they can be giving a vague or untrue comment which doesn't necessarily apply to the original posters problem.

Red herrings and Bum steers come to mind. Must be confusing for those trying to sort the wheat from the chaff.

Ross M
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Reply By: Member Andys Adventures - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:54

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 10:54
Whatever you put on, put it between the tank and original filter or you will void the warranty.
AnswerID: 501986

Reply By: Ross M - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 11:35

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 11:35
410
Just a small shot gun eh?

The issue of additional filters. My views.
Firstly, yours is a CRD engine and will have a cooler or system to keep the fuel cool which is being delivered to the engine. DON'T fit a fuel filter in the engine bay because it will be heated by the underbonnet temp and begin to negate the essential cooling already being provided..
Some WATER watch systems do watch quite well but don't remove any water from the fuel, you then have to act.
Yes, You can fit a filter and it is best between the tank and the OE filter of you vehicle.
This leaves the OE filter as the main filter the extra one as a pre filter/dewaterer if you choose one of those.
Water funnels, while good for obvious water which you can see, don't in any way filter out emulsified water which is usually the problem. The large lumps, if present, will generally sit in the bottom of the filter housing and aren't a problem until it gets to the 'too much' level. Emulsified water is worse cos it is highly mobile with the fuel flow.
Otherwise nearly every diesel with a drop of visible H2O in the bottom of it's filter would be stopped on the side of the road. NOT SO.

You should fit a filter which dewaters and also filters out the crap and generally the finer the micron size ie 5 or less is good to have. A finer filter will block or restrict more frequently so extra filters have to be carried. Sometimes for an engine which can drink faster, the flow rate of the additional filter is also and issue as is, it's designed ability to provide the necessary flow with little or no restriction.
Sometimes, two filters side by side ie plumbed in parallel, is required so flow rate and restriction in the event of partial contamination doesn't cause cavitation and starvation of your high pressure pump. If it does experience starvation it will damage it.

Mine is a Donaldson P902976 low flow filter kit on 3litre with a flow rate of around 120litre/hr, the vehicle requires 30-40lph flow rate so is ok. Your system will possibly flow greater than that and the twin or a larger capacity filter will be required.
Mine is as a pre filter and still retains the OE as the maker wants it with restriction warning device/sensor still active.

If the filter, mine doesn't, have an electronic warning of "presence of water" you have to be the checking/deciding component in the performance of your filter.
If mounted underneath, you check it along with other items each day before you move off.

If you have one fitted, contaminate it with water prior to fuelling it, so you know the system warns you.
Don't just trust it to do so. You might just drive to mechanical oblivion totally unaware of the disaster happening under your bonnet.
Evaluate this, my views will be regarded as rubbish by many, but I see and hear of so many who have had trouble. Contact Donaldson or other filter people and ask for their recommendation for your vehicle.

Cheers
Ross M
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Follow Up By: 410 - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 13:12

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 13:12
Hi Ross
Thankyou and everyone else for the advice. The 200 does have a alarm where if the light flashes you drain water from fuel bowl if light stays on " head to a a Toyota dealership immediatley " all good if your are near one ? I have heard of the Donaldson filter.
Regards

Richard
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Follow Up By: Kris and Kev - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 15:26

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 15:26
Richard, unless they have changed in the newer models, the warning light will not go out unless you do the reset procedure. I learnt the hard way about carrying a spare filter. Got some dirty fuel in the Kimberley, light came on, pumped several times, reset the warning light and all Ok until about 120 kilometres, light came back on, pumped and reset, again light came back after about 120 k's. Did not have a spare, had to keep going to Kununurra, weekend so we had to set up until the Monday so I could buy another filter. The bottom of the bowl had heaps of dirt and the filter was as black as. Now, carry a spare and clean the bowl and change the filter after/before a big trip. Cheap maintenance compared to the cost of a damaged engine.
Kevin
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Follow Up By: 410 - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 15:35

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 15:35
Hi Kris and Kev
Thankyou for the info, i will have a spare filter.
Richard
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Follow Up By: bluefella - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 15:57

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 15:57
waterwatch picks up the water BEFORE the original filter, so no water gets to your main filter, this eliminates any possibility of water running around your filter before being sent to the bottom of the filter, waterwatch is as easy to drain as the tojo filter,the alarm tests when you turn the ignition on, if water was detected (even the smallest amount) when driving it'll let you know,it's BL###Y loud.
thats the system i use in my 100s td.
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Follow Up By: Member - Boobook - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:38

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:38
410, I have a 200 and the fuel filter warning light has come on twice in 100,000km. Both times about 30 mins after filling at remote service stations.

You should always carry a spare fuel filter, spanners and a 5mm allen key.

First crack the 3 hex bolts for the lid of the filter assy,
Undo the 2 connectors to the unit
then undo the 2 nuts holding it to the body.
Make sure area is clean of dust etc
Remove the top / lid with hoses attached
Pull out filter and discard, clean bowl with a clean rag
Insert the new filter and o ring
Put lid on with allen bolts tigntened gently
put whole assy on 2 mounting bolts and tighten the 2 nuts
tighten the 3 allen key bolts
Phump the primer for about 2 - 3 minutes until it is HARD to push
Start vehicle, if you primed it properly it will start straight away, if not keep priming

Now you must reset the warning light
Reconnect both plugs while ignition is on
turn off vehicle
wait 10 seconds
turn it on
Hey presto.
This whole procedure will take you about 30 minutes first time and 15 after that.

Print this out and put it in the filter box with a 5mm allen key.
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Follow Up By: 410 - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:48

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:48
Thankyou all
I really appreciate the advice and Boobook well done for the how to change. I bet more than i will print this.
Richard
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Follow Up By: Member - Boobook - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 17:13

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 17:13
Actually a member of Lcool posted it originally and it has saved me twice.
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Follow Up By: Member - Old Girl - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 21:42

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 21:42
Read and done the same thing Boobook.
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Reply By: Member - Alan John C (WA) - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:16

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 16:16
Richard I had a v8 cruiser for several years now and thought exactly what you are thinking, I have had my warning light come on now a few times mainly when heavy on the foot so I started changing Toyota filter every 10k no more problems for sake of $40 and ten minutes to change just carry a couple of spare filters don't spend a fortune the problem is Toyota leaves fuel filters too long between changes regards Alan.

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Follow Up By: Ross M - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 20:25

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 20:25
G'day Alan Joihn C
I think very often Toyota don't actually change the filters at all. Therefore, it seems they block/restrict more regularly than would normally be the case.
If you fit two filter units plumbed in parallel so 50% of flow goes through each filter before the OE filter, then they have twice the water catching capacity and twice the contamination catching also.
This should leave the OE filter there to do it's job and it will last the normal specified time/duration.
Having the two filters means negligible flow restriction and it dirty fuel is experienced then just the change of one will keep you going until a more thorough examination and replacement of the filters is possible.

After this the OE filter should still be working as designed giving additional back up along with it's sensors and it won't have to be replaced at all..

Ross M
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Reply By: Rick and Kerrie - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 17:51

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 17:51
I fitted a Stanadyne FM100 filter/water separator to my VDJ78 before the factory filter.
You can buy a complete kit from Diesel Care including the filter, bracket,hoses etc.
There is plenty of information on this unit on LCool including a good video showing how to do it, not a hard job.

Cheers,
Rick
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Follow Up By: Member - Keith P (NSW) - Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 20:47

Tuesday, Jan 08, 2013 at 20:47
Another heads up on the Mr Funnel filter funnels...They DO work.
I have the one which is the largest you can get ...and is supposed to have a flow rate of 40 litres/minute.
Well I dont really know if that flow rate is right...nor do I care. All I know is it sorted approximately a litre of water and other crud out of 85 litres of diesel at a fuel pump in northern SA.
The person who was personing the counter inside came out to ask wot I was doing using a funnel with nozzle in it when the nozzle will fit straight in the hole fer crissakes (her words...not mine). I just said I will show you later if possible. Well ...the look on her face when I showed her was priceless.
So I reckon it was about a 100 bux well spent as this happened twice in the last few years. Only downside is storing it in truck or camper boot after using coz of the smell. I usually wrap it in rag and then in a large zip top bag ....but the smell still gets out a little. I also run an extra water/crud filter trap as well ...along with a high volume low pressure lift pump.

Cheers Keith
Nothin is ever the same once I own it ...........

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Follow Up By: 410 - Wednesday, Jan 09, 2013 at 09:06

Wednesday, Jan 09, 2013 at 09:06
Hi
Thankyou to everyone again, no doubt, what ever you would like to ask at the Explore Oz site, you will get answers.
Regards
Richard
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