100 series landcruiser and Tvan tyre size questions

Submitted: Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 10:28
ThreadID: 100218 Views:5563 Replies:8 FollowUps:15
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Hello,

I have a 2006 TD cruiser. It has 285/70/17 BFG KM2 fitted. i have a 2002 Tvan with 275/65/17 Dunlop Grandtrek at22 fitted. Both Tvan and cruiser have genuine alloy rims fitted.

I have enquired with Tvan manafacture about fitting 285 tyrs to suit tow vehicle. About $450 plus fitting for larger bump stops to stop damage to gaurds. Also not sure if there is any benifit of mud terrains to a camper trailer.

I would like to have all tyres interchangable. But, is it possiable to fit a 275/65/17 to the cruiser if l have exhausted all my spares of 285/70/17. What or any damage would be caused to drive line?

I know this all sounds a litle confusing. But, l have geolander a/t that came with the car. Same size as the Tvan wheels. Just not sure the geloanders and loosing 17mm in under vehicle clearance is a good move.

Any advice or past experances would be great.

Thank you
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Reply By: Member - Tony (ACT) - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 10:41

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 10:41
Go back to the 275's, and drive to the conditions. ie pick your line to cope with 275 tyres.
AnswerID: 503499

Reply By: olcoolone - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 10:46

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 10:46
If you can't get a 20mm higher (from top of tyre to guard) and 40mm across (front to back) tyre in the guard of a Tvan there is big problems in their design...... no body would design something with so little variance and be such short sighted.

I would say Tvan are dribbling and are trying to get more money from you...... properly designed suspension should very rarely hit the bump stops.

If you were looking at going to a 305/75x16 they yes there may be a problem.

The idea thing is to run all the tyres and rims the same so you can interchange.
AnswerID: 503500

Follow Up By: Ross M - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 13:05

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 13:05
The Tvan is designed with 15" or16' tyres in mind.
Now things are going to 17" it just starts to get complicated.
The problem isn't one of it hitting the bump stops at all, it is a problem of the ever bigger wheel hitting the guards before the bump stops have limited the axles upward movement, hence the larger ( read bigger/longer) bump stops mentioned.

Their prices are always $ x3 on anything they have as extras.
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FollowupID: 780209

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 15:11

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 15:11
Ross I understand what he means and the excuse of "The Tvan is designed with 15" or16' tyres in mind" is a pretty lame excuse for lack of foresight.

My way of thinking is the bump stops should be the same for any size tyre you fit as the suspension movement should not change.

A common tyre size is 265/75x16 and if it's compared to a 285/70x17 your talking 13mm difference between the top of the tyre and guard..... if you can not get that inside the guard and have it not touch with out different bump stops....... there is a big design flaw.

Any one with an engineering brain would not design something to be so limited and not suitable to most applications....... 17 inch rims have be popular for a number of years now....... it's a design flaw if you can not fit that size tyre on.

It's simple make all the bump stops the same and have it suit 17 inch rims....... or are they a company not moving with the times?

I find it hard to believe they would not of rectified this problem.
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FollowupID: 780221

Follow Up By: Ross M - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 19:00

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 19:00
olcoolone
I see your point but no manufacturer normally keeps redesigning to keep up with what some vehicles might have.
The Tvan already allows for a fair range of axle/stud and offset variations as it is.
It will take 265/75/16 and with that tyre it has 180mm of upward wheel travel, from normal position, before the wheel touches the guard.

It also has 100 mm axle to bump clearance and 150 mm if you take it right to full compression of the bump, this equates to the 200 at the wheel.
It possibly will take the 285/70/17" but you are pushing it.

Many people when buying vehicles don't think to check this sort of thing and then have to compromise as all designs do.

The owner hasn't mentioned if he has put a cruiser tyred rim on the Tvan to see what clearances there are and calculated if the tyre will or will not touch.
Most people going out where tyres would be required will check a few things first.
On a Tvan all you have to do is remove the shocker when chassis is on a stand and remove the spring and jack up the axle with the big tyre on it. Then you will instantly know what is possible.

If you have to use two different aspect ratio/sized tyres it isn't the end of the world and most people can carry a spare case/s of the most essential tyre anyway. If really needed the smaller one could be used in an emergency if you ran out of stock of the mains ones.

Advice is great, but believe no one, and check where possible.
It minimizes mistakes and unforeseen events/surprises.

Mick78 may not have a problem at all.

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FollowupID: 780252

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 18:39

Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 18:39
QUOTE-"I see your point but no manufacturer normally keeps redesigning to keep up with what some vehicles might have."

You would be pretty stupid if you didn't...... for the last 3-5 years most Nissan, Toyota and Mitsubishi; plus the Ranger and BT-50 4x4's all come with 17 inch rims...... and 18 inch rims are becoming popular.

Looks like the Tvan is going to die through lack of future planing.

Or do you have to buy something with 16 inch or smaller rims.

15 and 16 inch rims are going the same way as 13 and 14 inch rims did 10 plus years ago.
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FollowupID: 780310

Follow Up By: Member - Andrew L (WA) - Wednesday, Jan 30, 2013 at 00:40

Wednesday, Jan 30, 2013 at 00:40
The wheel size is irrelevant. 15/16/17/18" it doesn't matter. It the is the size of the tyre that causes the issue. Tvans are designed to accommodate up to 32" tyres, which for a long time, and still is, the largest OEM tyre size on main stream 4wds in Australia.
Suggesting that Track Trailer are stupid, lack good engineering, that MC2 suspension is poorly designed and the company is going to die really does show a lack of understanding of the product and its reputation / position in the market place.
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FollowupID: 780337

Follow Up By: mick78 - Wednesday, Jan 30, 2013 at 23:15

Wednesday, Jan 30, 2013 at 23:15
Hello Andrew, I am with you on this one. The rim size is not my problem. I feel some people do not understand Tvans suspension. Everything about the tvan is excellent. We love it. The Australian army have trailers with the same suspension. That is saying something about track. Know 32 inch tyres are standard. Some have 33 and not worry. This post was to see what people run. I have 33 inch and 31 inch tyres for cruiser. From what I read people run larger there's on tvan and not worry about bump stops. Will a 33 bfg mud make any differance to a trailer as wheel just rolls? Or use 31 Dunlop grandtrek and use it as a spare on cruiser if I exhaust my two spars. Love the feed back.
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FollowupID: 780424

Follow Up By: Member - Andrew L (WA) - Thursday, Jan 31, 2013 at 12:58

Thursday, Jan 31, 2013 at 12:58
Mick,

if your Tvan tyres require replacing I'd probably go with 33" to match the cruiser but if the existing tyres are good, then I wouldn't bother changing them. The Tvan clearance is very good and really doesn't need the extra clearance 33" afford. The only situation where i think the KM2 would be an advantage would on technical, muddy tracks such as in the high country, to stop the Tvan sliding sideways.
Even with a mix of tyre sizes, you still effectively have three spares that could be fitted to either the Cruiser or Tvan in a emergency situation.
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FollowupID: 780446

Reply By: Thinkin - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 11:20

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 11:20
hello mick,
"But,is it possible to fit a 275/65/17 to the cruiser if I exhausted all my spares of 285/70/17".

I don't think it would be a good idea, because the abs systemn would sense the different rotational speed of all wheels and apply brakes to correct the problem.

alpero
AnswerID: 503502

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 15:14

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 15:14
ABS only limits the wheel from locking up under brakes and has no impact on tyre speed or size....... traction control does.
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FollowupID: 780223

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 16:01

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 16:01
The first question you need to answer is.

What is the tyre size specified on the tyre plackard on the particular cruser.

From there you can figure out what is acceptable.

The problem with a 65 series tyre, is that it will be a useless off road tyre, becasue of the low profile.

I am sure you have plenty of tyre choices.

As for the T van......what sort of suspension is under it

AND have you measured the remaining travel too the existing bump stop..allowing for some compression

and then measured the exsitng clearance from the top of the tyre to the inside of the guard.
Iff it looks like it will go you can fit the desired tyre and do the measurements again

A bit of good information and carefull use of a tape measure should have it sorted.


If its is an old style leaf spring system and it is not alreay "sprung over"
changing it from axle over spring to spring over axle will give you an extra 2 or 3 inches.

cheers
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FollowupID: 780234

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 16:13

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 16:13
All Tvans use the MC2 independent coil sprung suspension.
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FollowupID: 780236

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 16:51

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 16:51
Ok strike the references to leaf springs.

the rest should be pretty straight forward.

cheers
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FollowupID: 780241

Reply By: Andrew & Jen - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 20:27

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 20:27
mick78
Have you checked into the Trak Trailer forum?
If not, I would suggest it would be useful as this issue must have been dealt with many times and is sure to be the subject of a thread.
Membership is free and you will be interacting with many people who own Tvans and know what they are talking about based on actual experience
Cheers
Andrew
AnswerID: 503528

Reply By: mick78 - Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 21:23

Monday, Jan 28, 2013 at 21:23
Hello all, thank you for your messages.

I understand everyone's view on track trailers wanting more coin on bump stop mods. Track trailer has independent coils with koni shockers. The distance between bump stops is 11cm. Top of wheel to gaurd is 17cm. So there is more room. But the bump stops are about 18cm in from rim so I guess that has something to do with the wheel rubbing on gaurd. I feel the tyre only just kisses guards. Track say larger bump stops retired to cover there butt.

I have joined the track trailer form. Mixed answers.

My question is about the mixed tyre size on cruiser if I went to 275/65/17 on tvan to eliminate tyre rubbing. The tvan has genuine alloy rims with the correct stub axle to suit. All set up buy track.

I have the original geolander a/t in the shed. And Dunlop grandtrek in shed which came with tvan. My past cars have had bfg MUDs. My trips have changed to more touring.
I guess l was also after input on fellow travellers on there set up. I feel the km2 are over kill on touring and a waste for tvan.

But is a reduction in 15mm diff clearance and running original sized tyres on cruiser going to make a differance?

Just after info on what size people run to achieve tvan and cruiser same and check to see what or if any damage thee is running a mix size in emergency. I have plugs and a second casing.

Thanks

AnswerID: 503530

Follow Up By: Andrew & Jen - Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 12:18

Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 12:18
OK mick78, I am with you now
Our 2nd hand Tvan came with 15" wheels and M&S tyres, as the tow veh was a Prado. I have had a good run from these and they help on very slippery tracks, especially going downhill when the trailer brakes are used independently to ensure we are all going straight ahead! ;-)
We tow with a Series 80 with 16" rims, which normally have D694LT ATs but there is a second set with Toyo MTs. Both LC and Tvan are 6 stud.
If going to remote areas, I carry 2 spares for the LC, one on a rim and one case. I only carry the one spare for the Tvan.
My approach is that, if push came to shove, I would fit a 16" tyre to the Tvan (on the LHS) to get me to safety. And while it would work for a short (?) distance, I would be reluctant to fit a 15" to the LC (hence the spare 16" case).
Cheers
Andrew
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FollowupID: 780286

Reply By: Member - Andrew L (WA) - Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 14:08

Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 14:08
The only issue with running 285/70/17 (33") on the Tvan is that the tyres will contact the guards at full articulation. Full articulation will only usually occur during slow off road situations during which some slight rubbing is not an issue. Plenty of people have run 33" on Tvans without dramas. If you absolutely want to stop any chance of rubbing, fit the extended bump stops. Agree $450 is expensive for what is involved, but cheaper than changing all the tyres on the Cruiser - or just to it yourself.
AnswerID: 503552

Reply By: CSeaJay - Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 17:07

Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 17:07
Mick
I have 285/70/17 on my TVan. Yes at full articulation it rubs.
Rubs but with no damage to the wheel arch
I considered extending the bump stops, but after a few trips with a heavy TVan and nothing but a few rubs I decided against it in favour of full articulation. But thats just me
For a few $$'s you can modify the bump stops yourself just to be sure
CJ
AnswerID: 503566

Follow Up By: mick78 - Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 17:11

Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 17:11
I do not think I will worry about it now hearing a few out there have not worried about it. Out of curiosity what ideas do you have to modify the stops? I do like the idea of keeping full travel. Best to spend the cash on updating the hitch. Thank uou
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FollowupID: 780298

Follow Up By: CSeaJay - Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 20:27

Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 20:27
Sorry Mick I do not know, and because I decided against it I did not research it. But surely a home made solution, with the kelp of Clarke Rubber will work. It is not a critical component, so there is not much risk. I am sure you will be $hundreds ahead of the Track quote
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FollowupID: 780321

Follow Up By: olcoolone - Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 21:30

Tuesday, Jan 29, 2013 at 21:30
Instead of extending the bump stop can you place a aluminium square block 20mm thick to where the bump stop hits the chassis.
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FollowupID: 780329

Reply By: Member - Boobook - Wednesday, Jan 30, 2013 at 06:33

Wednesday, Jan 30, 2013 at 06:33
Make sure all your spares are the same as the vehicle, that way you won't do any harm to it. Running the larger spare on the TVan is pefectly acceptable as per the last few relplies. That is how I run mine when I have the 285/70 17 muddies on the vehicle.
AnswerID: 503599

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