The Legal issues at the scene of a accident?

As a remote first aider I can tell you that in some States and Territories, you can not be sued for rendering first aid, in fact in the Northern Territory it is a criminal offence to do nothing.

I firmly believe that it should be part of your license to obtain a first aid certificate.

Phil

Not in Victoria.
Volunteers have protection under the Wrongs Act 1958, the so called "Good Samaritan Laws"

Have a quick read Wrongs Act 1958

I am understanding that all states have similar acts.

In my opinion... everybody should be taught basic first aid in high school, epsecially since St John's Cadets are being disbanded!

Or as suggested it should be a mandatory part of getting your drivers licence.


First Aid: D.R.A.B.C
D = Danger - to yourself, bystanders and the victim
Therefore, do not 'rush in' to help and put yourself in danger of being hit by another vehicle etc


Under WA laws passed in 2003, good Samaritans are protected from civil law suits when they come to the aid of another person in good faith and without recklessness
Src: http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/9861935/call-for-good-samaritan-laws/

'Civil Liability Act 2002' and 'Civil Liability Amendment Bill 2003'
Src: http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/wa/consol_act/

My understanding is what has been said prior, I ask this question at each & every renewal of my Senior First Aid certificate and the answer typically comes back as " there has never been a successful suit.

When I first did the course a long time ago there was a set scale of compressions and breaths now you just pump that heart for them as they reckon that that will get enough air into them to survive - but if you can manage a breath every now & then, great.

it is now DRS ABC

Danger
Response
Send for help
Airway
Breathing
Circulation

I make sure that there are always 2 first aiders in any trip and I would encorouage every 4 x 4 owner to do the course - it is good fun and you learn something new each & every time.

Stay Safe

cheers

Whether to give or not give first aid is a big can of worms........ nobody is obliged to give first aid and you can not be prosecuted for not giving it BUT if you start CPR on a person your are obliged to continue giving CPR until professional help arrives.

In other words you can give CPR but you are not qualified to decide when to stop CPR and determined when someone has become deceased. When you start giving CPR it becomes a duty of care situation for the person giving it and you could be prosecuted if you do stop but unlikely.

Nobody has been prosecuted for giving incorrect first aid and as said above there are laws protecting the first aider.

A first aider is not allowed to administer any form of drug....... even aspirin but can aid the sick or injured person.

You can advise someone to seek first aid and it is up to them on what they want to do.

Conscious and unconscious people have different rights to receiving first aid, if someone is conscious you have to ask them if they want you to help them and they can refuse help and there is nothing you can do....... is a person is unconscious then they have waived all their rights to receiving first aid.

Ambulance crews face this problem all the time whereby someone refuses help and all they can do is leave or wait for them to become unconscious before they can treat them.

End of the day it does come down to "duty of care" and becomes very very complicated.

Many years ago we lived in a small town not that far from a capital city but far enough away that an ambulance, if available would have been some 20-30 minutes away. We had a fully equipped ambulance supplied in part by fund raising in the community and part by a government grant. All staffing was done by volunteers, of which I was one, and our training was conducted by the professional ambulance service in our state. Apart from the practical life support training we were given a good grounding in the legal responsibilities of what we were taking on. Being vollies we were protected by the so called "Good Samaritan Act". AFAIK that is still in effect.
One extra facet that came into being during my term was the protection of ambulance crews from blood or saliva born diseases such as AIDS and the various strains of hepatitis. We were advised to carry and use a small plastic device to use if we did not have access to the ambulance equipment and there was any open wound that might allow the patients blood to enter our bodies if we were to attempt to apply breathing assistance during CPR. I would certainly not recommend anyone not rendering whatever aid they are capable of but maybe something to keep in mind. Maybe another reason why chest compressions alone are now deemed to be the recommendation.

Cheers
Pop

Hey axle

Just one point. It's not the legal system that has gone mad. The "system" provides protection to those who do right, and compensation to those who have been wronged.

It's the members of the general public who seek to abuse and manipulate a good system for their own selfish and personal financial gain that make the "system" appear to be mad.


Just my thoughts!

Graeme.

Stefandsal...never forget to look outside the square when it comes to "how long can you keep it up". My dad's an ex-St Johns teacher. He tells of a true story where a couple were on a remote beach, late in the day. He collapses. She cannot carry him, nor do CPR throughout the night.
BUT she did not do CPR constantly! She did it for a while, then rested for a short period (not enough for oxygen deprivation to start!) and then started up again...she was able to maintain this for a few hours until someone came looking for them!
To all of you...
PLEASE...if you are doing a first aid course, make sure BOTH of you do it! How do you know it's not the trained first aider who's going to be unconscious?!
Never dismiss a patient by their looks, either. My parents both did their senior first aid exam in preparation to work for St Johns and they were given a scenario of a bus crash where they were the first on the scene...how to work out who to treat etc...
They were taught that the nice looking lady may have had terminal cancer and only months to live anyway, and the scruffy bloke that was overlooked may have been a poor uni student who may well one day find a miracle medical cure...
Don't think that something is out of your league...a tiny paramedic on the Sunshine Coast used to do CPR on big blokes with her heel on their chest! She got the required depth of compressions!!
I'd be a widow or married to a brain-damaged man if my husband's mates didn't do CPR on him when he had an accident 16 years ago. As it was, the ambo's needed to put the "paddles" on him 3 times to get him going again.
Do a course. Do your best. Do consider "if that was my mum/dad/brother etc would I want someone to walk away from them?" You are protected by law if you do what you can, for you are just a passer-by with a simple certificate and the will to help.
It may not be nice. My neighbour was the first on the scene when a bikie nearly beat the train...
But I have Irish blood in me and believe in Murphy's Law - I have a certificate so I hopefully never have to use it (so far, so good!!)
:)

20 or so years ago, I drove past a scene of an horrendous car crash on a semi-remote rural road. I was the first on the scene then a plumber drove past with his van after 5 minutes. We were isolated and none of us had mobile phones at that time. The passenger of one car was dead while in the other car a family of three with a toddler were all still alive but I didn't know how serious their injuries were. The toddler was crying. My legs were shaking and I was getting a big nauseating feeling I guess because the amount of blood around and the dead body in the other car. None of us had any knowledge of first aid. We decided to cut the car open with some of the plumber tools to free the toddler and we took ages, maybe 20 or 30 minutes. In the meantime another car arrived and we told him to drive to the nearest town to call an ambulance. When the family was finally free to exit the wreck, the plumber took care of the toddler and he seemed ok and I stayed with the parents. They were in shock and full of blood and not sure if they were injured seriously. In that entire time spent at the accident scene until the ambulance arrived I never thought, even for a split second about being sued. I don't know if we did the right things or acted appropriately by the law but I guess in such situation everything was dictated by instinct. PS: the family fully recovered from the accident with minor scars.

It is possible many will have a different view on this, but the best way to approach it is to ask yourself, "what would I want someone to do if it was me lying there".

At that point you'll know the answer on how to approach the situation...

My two bob's worth...!

IMO a lot of these thoughts of legal ramifications come from urban myths.

One such myth I recall is the one where a person is trapped in a car which then caught fire.
The person first on scene successfully dragged the driver from the car but in the process further damaged a minor spinal injury resulting in paraplegia.
While this was happening another bystander arrived and with an extinguisher, put the fire out.
The injured person then sued the rescuer saying he wouldn't have burned but now couldn't walk.
The (supposedly) moral of the story?....walk away for your own good.

A little o/t, a friend a long while ago visited Saudi Arabia and while there discovered that if, while driving anywhere, you were to witness an accident, get the hell out of there. Under their laws, if anyone or anything (camel etc) is injured then everyone goes to jail, witnesses included, until any guilt is determined.

Cheers Neil