Overtaking Issues!

Submitted: Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 13:32
ThreadID: 106286 Views:3337 Replies:18 FollowUps:79
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Gday,
I'm starting this thread to point out a couple of things I see on the road regularly which may avoid a serious accident if people are aware of them.

I'm sure some of you will be dying to tell me my word selection is wrong , technically I shouldn't do it , its not in the road users handbook etc......, etc.........but the fact of the matter is, people do and others need to be aware of it to keep it safe.

I quite often drive heavy, slow and over width vehicles down the highway and need to move over to let vehicles past. Ok.....maybe not need to but its the courteous and safe thing to do if everyone does it right.

What has happened quite often in the past is I move over (half on the dirt) to let a truck or something past and the line of caravans and other vehicles behind decide its their chance too ,so they bunch up and all keep coming.........the problem lies when a vehicle comes the other way or there is a culvert in my path we all run out of room pretty quick. My intension is to give you better visibility not right of way.....If people would wait there turn we could all get past safely. UHF is a god send , but if you haven't got one, wait for a signal and go through when its clear......its not all, but a hell of a lot of people assume that because I've moved over for the person in front it must be alright for them too.....its not always the case!

The other one is indicating to turn right, and people assume your telling them its clear to go around.....even over double lines and around corners. You hear horror stories of people getting a bad call from truck drivers....deliberate or not, but to just assume they are waving you past is suicidal!!!

I think people just get into this passing manoeuvre mind set ,get all excited and throw common sense out of the window.
Personal I very rarely flash anyone past these days.....If a cant talk to them on the radio I just move over a bit so they can see and let them make there own decision. If someone does wave you past.....remember they have no idea on the power of your vehicle......its just a good chance to stick your nose out had have a look for yourself.

I know all this is common sense to a lot of people , but you would be amazed how many it isn't?????

That's my rant...

Cheers
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Reply By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 13:52

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 13:52
I can sympathise with that hairy, as should any of us who tow, because a similar thing happens if we pull over to let a car (or two) through. Probably a bit more annoying for those with extra wide vehicles though.

One thing does puzzle me though; why people use the right indicator instead of the left to signal the car behind to overtake. It makes more sense to me to indicate left (or nearside) as they do in most other countries. Still not perfect but consequences of misunderstandings are less critical.
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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:07

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:07
The left hand indicator to overtake is slowly taking on...........quite a few people do it these days. A lot safer I reckon.

Cheers
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Follow Up By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:14

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:14
yep, definito. Can't say I've noticed it taking on so much but you probably do more outback/country driving than I do. Glad to hear it anyway.

Slightly different, but buses who have pulled over often have their right blinker going and it's confusing to know whether they are indicating they are pulled over and for you to pass, or that they are about to swing right out in front of you. You just have to be alert.
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Follow Up By: Dave(NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:27

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:27
Steve,

When I first started doing Interstate on the old Hi way the truck out front would call "All dark up here" If there wasn't any one coming and put there right hand blinker on and leave it there to give the quicker trucks a chance to get around the slower ones, If they saw a vehicle coming they would call "One in the Shute" And the left blinker would go on to tell anyone be hind him the get back on the left hand side of the road. So that's where it all started.

Cheers Dave
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Follow Up By: Allan B (Member, SunCoast) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:16

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:16
It's a dodgy business this use of indicators to beckon a following vehicle past, which is why it is an offence to use turn indicators for any reason other than to indicate intention to turn. It is an easily misunderstood signal.

Following a truck on the Gibb River Road, the truck gave 3 right flashes. It was all clear ahead so I proceeded to overtake and got up as far the cab when he suddenly turned right. I took to the scrub and still don't know how I kept the Troopy on its wheels!

I can only presume that he put his indicator on to turn and it then dropped out after 3 flashes without him noticing. I doubt that he even saw me overtaking, even with my headlights on. Either that or the man was a sadist!

Even using the left signal has its perils. He could well be turning left and there is an oncoming vehicle. (I know, I know, you have to look anyway.



Cheers
Allan

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Follow Up By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:53

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:53
well Dave, at least that has some logic to it but as Allan has said below, you wouldn't want to rely on it. Although indicating left is probably the lesser of the two evils, it still has it's perils.

In Italy, France and Switzerland etc, particularly on alpine roads, they normally sound their horn to let the car in front know they are about to overtake. It gives the impression of mad, chaotic driving especially in built up areas but it has it's merits too. There's a tendency to think continental drivers are all madmen abusing each other but although I've no idea how they tell one hoot from another when they're all at it, they seem to think it works. Having said that, 50% of Parisian cars have a great dent in the side or back so God knows what their system is. I doubt if they know either.

lol
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Follow Up By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:02

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:02
...talking of French drivers, I can't believe "priorite a droite" is still customary, where you can be driving along a main route at 100 kph and a tractor or old Citroen cv will just amble out at leisure, right in front of you, seemingly oblivious to your position and the mental thing about that is that it is actually legal.

I'm sure they do it to annoy "foreigners" ;)
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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:08

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:08
I don't think that custom is just for the French!!! LOL
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Follow Up By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:18

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:18
well, yeah..... the worst are these buggers who sit there dithering until you are just about to pass the side road and they dawdle out in front of you and potter along without a care in the world......the difference in France is that they don't even sit and dawdle but just pull out as if there isn't another car for miles......... and it's legal
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:27

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:27
Agree Allan. It might be rare but there have been serious accidents in the past put down to misunderstandings relating to truck blinker use - similar to your experience. Before the Hume became dual carriageway (and seat belts were compulsory) I was a passenger in a car given the infamous indicator wave-on by a truckie. It was common practice at the time as many would know. Vehicle suddenly appeared coming the other way and both it and the truck had to take to the dirt to allow us to squeeze in between. We all thought we were gonners.

The fact that there are different ideas about what various signals might mean should be enough (eg left blinker overseas - don't know if that's a fact but it would be fairly obvious why). It also puts a huge responsibilty on the truckie where a vehicle might appear quickly or come out of a side road just after he's given the thumbs up to proceed. Frankly I think it's a stupid action, one which thankfully has largely disappeared over time.

Interesting observation and clarification about your reasons for pulling over with a wide load Hairy. My guess is that 90% of drivers would indeed think it was an invitation to pass, as I would, although you always have to be aware of narrowing roads etc before proceeding. I ALWAYS make sure I give wide loads a wide berth when overtaking for that very reason.
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:21

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:21
I should add that motorcyclists are advised to ride in the middle of the lane for the very reason that if you ride to the left many motorists will take that as an invitation to pass/overtake you irrespective of the circumstances.
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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:32

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:32
That's exactly right.......those same idiots who assume because your not using ALL the road it must be theres for the taking without any consideration of safety probably would assume that!

Good point!
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Follow Up By: landseka - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:49

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:49
"Allan B (Member, SunCoast) posted:
Following a truck on the Gibb River Road, the truck gave 3 right flashes. It was all clear ahead so I proceeded to overtake and got up as far the cab when he suddenly turned right. I took to the scrub and still don't know how I kept the Troopy on its wheels! "

Surely if he "suddenly turned right" he could only have been doing less than 25kmh, maybe that was an indication he was turning when he slowed to that speed? Also, at that speed it wouldn't take much to stop the Troopy without running off the road.
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Follow Up By: landseka - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:53

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:53
"Steve M1 (NSW) replied:
One thing does puzzle me though; why people use the right indicator instead of the left to signal the car behind to overtake. It makes more sense to me to indicate left (or nearside) as they do in most other countries. Still not perfect but consequences of misunderstandings are less critical."

Surely most other countries are Left Hand Drive so a Left signal still indicates a turn across oncoming traffic as a Right signal does here.
You do say "nearside" though so I guess you are talking of other RHD countries.
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Follow Up By: Nomadic Navara - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 01:12

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 01:12
From FolowUp 5 - "In Italy, France and Switzerland etc, particularly on alpine roads, they normally sound their horn to let the car in front know they are about to overtake."

Up until they change the motor traffic regulations in the 70s, the law in NSW was that you had to blow your horn before overtaking.
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Follow Up By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 08:56

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 08:56
landseka; that's why I used the term "nearside" because it makes no difference whether they drive on L or R. It is still nearside.

didn't know that, Peter. You'd probably get the finger if you did that now.

;)
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Follow Up By: Member - PJR (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:22

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:22
I just found this and no doubt this confusion has been flogged to death but I would like to say it again.

I have for the last 50+ years used the right indicator to show that I consider it safe to overtake. The right has been used in Australia for more years than I have been driving here. It would make sense to use the left where you drive on the right hand side of the road.

But I see a dangerous situation now with both being used. Brought on by some more habits being imported from overseas. Why can't people leave Australia as it is. Stop trying to change us into Europeans or worse still Yanks.

I know - The tide can't be stopped. I don't like it, so to be safe I won't indicate to assist anyone to overtake either way any more because there are people out there who would get the wrong idea.

What happens when you signal that you are going to turn left up the road and the vehicle starts to overtake. Bugger a car coming and you are not turning left yet.

I wonder if alternately flashing the indicators left, right and so on, is now swearing and not waving. Maybe I should stop that also. It may not be politically correct. Same as it used to be quite acceptable to flash the headlights a few times when overtaking. I would bet that is a bad thing to do now also.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Allan B (Member, SunCoast) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:32

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:32
Hello Landseka,

Thank you for your critique, very helpful.

Perhaps I can add some more factual information to enable you to assess my driving skills.

The "quarry" truck was only doing about 50-60kph as I approached at 80k. Following him for a while at 50-60 he was well over to the left and when he "signalled me to overtake" I figured that he intended stopping. There was no dust ahead so I proceeded to do as he "signalled".
The track he turned into was a single lane sweeping exit bend, probably into a quarry, so he had no need to slow from his 50-60k, but as soon as he began the turn I had no road left to "stop" on from my now 70-80k.

Now, is there anything else I can supply to help you form a judgement and assist me to keep my 65 year unblemished driving record intact?

Cheers
Allan

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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:22

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:22
I agree Phil - you should stop. We'll all be better off if indicators are left to do the job they were intended for. Then we'll only have to contend with the rare problem of indicators being accidently left on.
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Follow Up By: Dave(NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 12:31

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 12:31
The thing with the blinkers was started by truck drivers years ago, Before CB/UHF radios and it worked perfectly, But somewhere down the line a few car drivers started doing it then eventually car drivers started making up there on different version's and caused it to become a dangerous practise because of the misinterpretations involved,
The same with the CB/UHFs the trucks were the only ones using them, Now everyone has them and complain about what they here on them from the truck drivers.
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 15:38

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 15:38
To put it bluntly Dave, your claim that it worked perfectly is bunkum, as more than one person on this thread has already indicated. I also recall a fatality years ago being attributed to someone either missing the truck's right indicator or possibly mistaking its meaning. If you'd been in the car with us all those years ago I'd doubt you'd have the same overly optimistic view.
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Follow Up By: Member - PJR (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:01

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:01
Spot on Dave.

To put it bluntly Baz. Too bloody right it did.

I was there, and maybe those few above weren't actually there and are only going on heresay. I remember asking Dad about it way before I was allowed to drive and thinking how good it was. We lived in Holbrook then and I was still in primary school (the convent in the main street of Holbrook opposite the Bakery). Let's say about 1955. We drove to Albury once a week to get good for his chemist shop and that's where I noticed it. Going up that hill just out of Holbrook. So I got the fuill lesson. Right to overtake, left to bloody get back and l-r-l-r to wave and say thanks. Simple isn't it. Even a 10 year old thought so.

Maybe you are one of the ones who started to change it. Only maybe Baz. Not sure though. If I am wrong then sorry.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Dave(NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:13

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:13
Baz,
I'm talking about years ago when it was only trucks doing it, In them days after about 10pm you wouldn't hardly see a car on the Hi- way . The problem started when every one started to do it and it has become an unsafe practice because to many drivers just wheel out instead of staying back a bit and having a look first.
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:15

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:15
I accept your apology Phil. Was I not clear about my own experience? The tip of the iceberg I suspect, although you obviously think otherwise. The concept was and still is fraught with unnecessary danger. Keep doing it if it gives you a warm fuzzy feeling but don't do it in the vacuum of knowledge of the harm it has already done and that which it may do in the future. As Bantam said I don't do it and won't ever take any notice of anyone who does. As far as I'm aware the practice is illegal. If not, it's certainly not condoned, and for the many good reasons already put forward on this thread.

Am I wound up about this issue? Too bloody right, but then again a brush with death will sometimes do that and I don't wish that on anyone.
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:20

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:20
It was a semi in the 70s on the 2 lane Hume Highway between Gundagai and Yass which almost did 5 of us - plus possibly the driver and the passengers in the oncoming car - in Dave.
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Follow Up By: Dave(NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 17:10

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 17:10
Like I say I've never blinked a car around me only trucks mainly because most car drivers wouldn't know what I was on about. It was an old way of signalling before radios between truck drivers and it worked alright then but not since car drivers became involved.
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Follow Up By: Slow one - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 18:17

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 18:17
Yes it worked very very well between trucks.

As Dave said it was only when others started to use and bastardise it, that problems started to appear.

Communication, patience and tolerance go a long way to solving problems and keeping all safe. Also not trying to second guess what others are going to do.

Skill levels are another area of concern. Some will be over cautious and won't pass the vehicle in front that is travelling a little slowly, then another like minded person will do the same, all bunched up and now becoming road train length and longer.

That is when we should all take a chill pill cause in the end the result sometimes is not pretty.

Then you get the ones that follow you for ages along straights that you could pass the vehicle in front 5 times. After 15 mins or so they then decide to pass near the end of a long straight. Beats me why, but I don't try to work out what is going on in their heads.

Some seem to think the vehicle passing them should stay out there as long as possible by speeding up. Again that beats me as to why.

Maybe we should ALL go back for reprogramming road rules wise every so often. Cause all of us tend to pick up bad habits and live in the past. When I got my licence we didn't have to do that, or I have been driving for 40 years and didn't need or do that.

Most and I mean most heavy vehicle drivers and owners have to keep up with changes in rules because it is their living. The amount of info that is available to drivers every year is considerable.

Average Mr and Missus Joe and Joanne blow haven't got a clue, as they have never kept up with the times.

Ok everyone, truthfully when have you last read the road rules, watched a vid on vehicle safety or had a good think about your driving manners.

One thing I do notice on the highway is women are normally very cautious when overtaking, in fact over cautious. Some of the blokes either leave their brains in neutral or their balls on the bonnet.

AND yes I make mistakes, but at least I try to keep up and not repeat mistakes.










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Follow Up By: Member - PJR (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 18:45

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 18:45
We all know or hopefully we do, that it is the overtaking persons responsibility to do it safely. No matter what.

Even if it was a cop I wouldn't over take unless I could see. So why Baz, did you overtake when you couldn't see ahead and if it was that dangerous, and with an oncoming car. Something tells me that you didn't apply a basic safety rule.

I may overtake if I can't see enough, if using the radio. But that is a very BIG maybe.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Member - PJR (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 21:33

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 21:33
Again Baz you misunderstood me again. You wont read what people say. I stopped because it was dangerous when some think left and some think right.

This thread has gone to the dogs. Stupid, time wasting arguments. I have had enough and with stop monitoring the thread.

Now for some peace and no more senseless emails from this thread.

Have a good night all

Phil
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Follow Up By: Bazooka - Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 12:15

Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 12:15
Where do I start. The practice may have well started between trucks but it very quickly spread to trucks giving "the wave" to cars as anyone who travelled in the 60s and 70s knows very well. I've provided just one experience, there were undoubtedly in my mind plenty more although a couple seem to believe that if it didn't happen to them then everything must have been hunky dory. As I've already said - bunkum. Pure unadulterated bunkum.

Which brings me to your comments Phil. I see you've thrown the towell in so you won't see my apology but for others, and the record, I apologise unreservedly. I forgot that after you'd said you'd be doing it for 50 years that you don't do it any more. Heat of the moment reply following your response to Dave's comment which suggested to me that you thought it a pity that it was still not in widespread use.

Now to address your conclusions regarding my experience. Seems I'm not alone in overlooking some key words.

As I said, I was a PASSENGER in the car - I was too young to drive. The driver was only just old enough (18-19), obviously relatively inexperienced, we were 5 young blokes in an FJ Holden. Following a semi in a line of cars (common experience on the old Hume as many will know) up a fairly long hill as I recall. Semi driver had blinked to a number of cars earlier and they safely overtook. Unfortunately for us he made a mistake this time.

The FJ got about half-way alongside the semi when the car coming in the opposite direction appeared. Truckie immediately drove off the road onto the narrow verge (wasn't going fast obviously), bloke in the oncoming vehicle did the same, we followed the truck across as much as we could and squeezed down the guts. To be frank I didn't have time to be scared, although we all - including the truckie and everyone following in the conga line - knew just how lucky both car drivers were.

Seems odd now as an adult but as I recall the near miss didn't dominate our chatter for the rest of the trip. The invincibility of youth syndrome I guess.

Something which I'll never forget although it had completely slipped off the cerebral radar until this thread arose.
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Reply By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:17

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:17
Impatience is the single biggest issues...ya just cant help those.

As for pushing their luck....well so many do.

As for pulling off the road.......appart from keeping as far as practical to the left and all wheels on the black top.......the only time I would do that is where it is possible to pull right off or to stop......single lane roads are another story of course.

The heavy transports and the loong wides don't do it....because it can be argued that it produces more risk than it saves.

I have made my views on "non regulation signals" elsewhere.

The simple fact is that there IS NO universal or reliable understanding about what these various non regulation signals mean.....and you can not trust someone elses judgement about what is safe.

I will not indicate for someone else to overtake, and I will not rely on anybody elses signals.

Even when I have a radio.
I may talk about conditions ahead of me, and positivly call oncomming hazards. but I will not call on another driver.....nor will I take a call from another driver.
I will satisfy myself.

cheers
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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:39

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:39
I dont know what your experience is, so not sure what your issue is with dropping a wheel off on the dirt in some vehicles, but I can tell you from my experience it can be the safest thing to do even if its not written in a handbook? What is your experience?

Cheers
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Follow Up By: SDG - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:38

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:38
My old man use to say that many rollovers use to occur from trucks dropping a wheel in the dirt to let others pass. Personally I only saw it once.
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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:52

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:52
There are a lot of cases you wouldn't do it, true.......In a truck or at speed would be one of them.
That's where common sense plays a part in it............if the vehicle, road or conditions aren't right you wait until they are.
By me putting one wheel off the road gives the overtaking vehicle more road so he doesn't have to.........
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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:21

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:21
Its not just the putting a wheel in the dirt.

The problem when you pull partly off the road propper, is that, as you have found, some of the impatient muppets behind think ...this will be the only oportunity they will ever have to pass and they will push their luck and yours.

SO you have 4 wheels in the dirt and 4 wheels on the black top and there is a culvet comming up....are you driving into the culvet or are passing muppets #5 & 6 taking their chances with the oncomming traffic.

As for putting a wheel in the dirt.....that is a bit of a lottery too.

On some roads the transition from bitumen to a hard dirt shoulder is pretty damn fair, as is the unsealed surface of the shoulder.

But in some areas it can be a drop of 4, more inches and a sharp drop at that, soft egdes as celebrated in song and story or a shoulder that is neither fit nor intended for wheel traffic

lots of roads as you have found, there is a fair shoulder.....but there are culvets, drains and various other hidden surprises that can come up pretty fast even at 60 or 80Kmh.

If you, in general keep all wheels on the sealed part of the road you will generally avoid all those hazards.

I may not have the hundreds of hours on outback roads that some on here have and I certainly don't have the number of hours behind the wheel of heavy vehices as others may.......but I have been arround enough, keep my eyes open and can bear witness to the misfortunes of others.

I have not made a trip to North QLD, where I have not seen some one somewhere stuck in a culvet in the cane fields.....a couple of them not pretty....these cane areas mostly have beautifull wide grassy verges....but the grass hides culvets, riser pipes a big hard lumpy things.

Up in the north west wher my brother works a lot, nobody takes putting a wheel in the dirt lightly....there are a lot of areas with nasty drop offs...getting off may not bee so bad...getting back on..ahh well.
There have been fatalities and people not too far removed from his circle of friends.

Only last week, I saw a bloke in a medium rigid..he had a fairly big work platform tied on...high centre of gravity....for some reason he pulled off onto the sholder on the Ipswich motorway..well he pulled off a little further than he should, the weight shifted and he had no traction....and looked like he was in real risk of falling over.

Another case on the way up to Warrick..following rain after a long dry...there was a truck and dog.
the shoulder looked good and hard...and the truck had passed along well but the dog had caught the soft edge a slid into the ditch the edge colapsing as it went.

yeh.... unless I could be pulling right off in certain safety, I'd be keeping all my wheels on the made portion of the road...and doing the bset I could for those behind that way.


cheers
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Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:01

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:01
Gday Bantam,
As I thought I clearly stated in the original post (well I tried too)
I started this thread just to try and point out something that happens to me quite regularly that is very dangerous and could be avoided if some people were aware of the situation. Its not about what Im driving, weather its lega,l or what I got for spelling at school. Is just a comment that I thought might make people think when they come across this situation as its quite common around here............

You are now talking about 4 wheels of the road and 4 wheels on?
shoulders of roads?
4 inch steps?
what part of the road I should avoid?
assuming Im doing between 60-80kmh?
Told me about where you haven't been and what you haven't seen??????
high centre of gravity in a MR on the Ipswich motorway?
A rainy day on the way to Warrick, a dog and soft edges?........................................................................................................................................

I wouldn't never move off the road in any of those conditions if not safe in the vehicle I was operating??? You've lost me?????

AS for "yeh.... unless I could be pulling right off in certain safety, I'd be keeping all my wheels on the made portion of the road...and doing the bset I could for those behind that way."
Mmmmm .......I agree what .....I just cant work out if your trying to agree, disagree or have a shot????

Life shouldn't be that hard. LOL
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Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:42

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:42
My point is that for most of us and in most situations, the safest option is to keep all wheels on the part of the road that is intended for them and that is the made part of the road.

This is in fact what a lot of heavy transport companies now instruct.

Pulling off to let people pass may be a nice idea.....but it may well introduce more risk to the situation.

Waiting till there is a clearly safe opportunity to pull right off the road, will be safer for you and for those that want to pass.

Better for people to be slightly inconvienienced for a while longer than be slightly dead, because they have no patience and will push their luck when the opportunity to pass is not properly adequate.


Oh and there is a great deal of difference depending on what vehicle you are driving and how fast it goes.

cheers
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FollowupID: 809011

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:57

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:57
"Better for people to be slightly inconvienienced for a while longer than be slightly dead, because they have no patience and will push their luck when the opportunity to pass is not properly adequate."
???????
Thanks for that wealth of knowledge but Ill continue to judge my own situation and act accordingly..........holding up a heap of traffic in my eyes are putting the impatient people at a lot more risk than me putting a wheel on the dirt ,but thanks anyway???? I think.....
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FollowupID: 809012

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:13

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:13
Hell Harry lighten up.....its a public discussion board....not the spanish inquasition.

Didn't you start this thread so people can discuss these matters, maybe generate some awareness, understand the risks and look at the different views.
Then make up their mind for themselves.

Of course you will judge the situation for yourself..so it should be.

You putting the wheels of your grader in the dirt at 45Kmh is a hell of a lot less of an issue than someone running on 14 inch pasenger tyres doing the same at higher speeds.

cheers
0
FollowupID: 809015

Reply By: Member - Bruce C (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:49

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:49
What is clear here Hairy is the need for nearly all vehicles travelling country roads to have a UHF radio and use it all the time.

Mine is a permanent fixture in the vehicle and when out towing the van I am in contact all the time with the surrounding truckies. The best place for a truck, as far as I am concerned is out in front of me, not behind me.

A lot of van drivers should be given a turn in a truck so they know how the other half have to live. Most already know about momentum but somehow seem to forget the truckie has a bigger issue with momentum.

When indicating that it is OK to overtake me, I always give one flash only on the right blinker and keep looking back to see if they have recognised it and are starting their overtake manoeuvre. Three times I will give them a signal, if it is safe, after that they have lost the chance. Too dangerous other wise. Probably asleep at the wheel if they did not see the flash anyway so are better behind me than in front.

Trucks, on the other hand, I talk to on the UHF when arranging an overtake, either their overtake or mine.

This is for my safety, not anybody else's. If we all stay safe we will all be safe.

Cheers, Bruce.
At home and at ease on a track that I know not and
restless and lost on a track that I know. HL.

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AnswerID: 526666

Follow Up By: Member - Bruce C (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:54

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 14:54
OK from now on I will indicate left only for a safe pass to vehicles behind although you are right there Hairy, probably better off not to indicate as the consequences could be significant.

Cheers, Bruce.
At home and at ease on a track that I know not and
restless and lost on a track that I know. HL.

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Reply By: disco driver - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 15:28

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 15:28
The idea of using either left or right flashing lights to indicate that it's safe to pass, more correctly that you think it's safe to pass, is definitely a no no for me.

I won't do it and I ignore any one who flashes for me.

I'd rather make sure for myself before I make the passing manouver.

In todays litigious society an ambulance chasing law firm, and there are a number of high profile ones around, could mount a case against you based on the fact that you indicated that that it was safe to pass/overtake, and probably would win too.

Disco.
AnswerID: 526669

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:05

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:05
I agree....I rarely do it, and if someone does it to me, with or without radio contact I stick my nose out and make my own call. Youd be stupid to take the advice of someone who has no idea about the power of your vehicle or load etc........In saying that its nice to get the nod too........Its lets you know they are aware of your intentions and they are keeping an eye out for you.

It all helps make the roads safer.........
1
FollowupID: 808938

Follow Up By: kiwicol - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 20:52

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 20:52
Hi, Its always been my understanding, giving one flash is its safe to poke your nose out, check to see if its safe for you to overtake.
Col
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FollowupID: 808991

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:06

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:06
Sounds like its not quite that simple Col!
Maybe I should just drive along in my own little world and bugger everyone else?
It might cause a few accident....but at least it would be legal!!!!

LOL
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FollowupID: 808995

Follow Up By: Member - Bruce C (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 13:07

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 13:07
Hi Disco,
I would think it is a given that we take responsibility for our own overtake manoeuvre.

The flash is merely signalling that it is potentially safe to check out the possibility of an overtake. Ultimately the responsibility rests with the overtaker, not the overtaken.

There is no way of knowing if a person is about to pull out of an obscured driveway or side road immediately after the driver in front has flashed. Had it happen to me once.

I will never overtake, even when flashed, without checking whether it is safe to do so first, it would be suicidal otherwise.

After all, if an accident happens it is the person overtaking that will wear the responsibility for the accident, not the person who flashed.
Driving in a Manner Dangerous is the first infringement that comes to mind, then there is Neg Driving and I dare say there are several more which could be applied. So it is wise advice, as you say, not to take someone else's word for it.

You're right Hairy, we should all be keeping an eye out for each other, if only in the interests of our own safety.

Cheers, Bruce.

At home and at ease on a track that I know not and
restless and lost on a track that I know. HL.

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Reply By: Con_Qld - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 15:44

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 15:44
When I was up in the North of Western Australia, I had a number of close calls - it happens when I am signalling that I am turning right into a camp spot beside the road and give about 300 metres of notice. On two occasions foreign drivers with hired motorhomes try to overtake me at the last moment as I am turning. They see me turning right and decide to overtake on the right ! That leaves me to take evasive action to avoid a collision.

I don't know what to do as I am doing what we always do when we turn right, that is to signal with the right indicator turning right. Those drivers do not have UHF so its makes it difficult to contact them. Trucks & other with UHF are fine as they understand.

AnswerID: 526671

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 15:54

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 15:54
Theres nothing you can do.......if your turning right you have to indicate right.

The signal is/was a quick flash with whatever indicator not continuous flashing. That way people knew your intentions..........because of this confusion I very rarely do it.

Cheers
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FollowupID: 808936

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:30

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:30
Ya see what I mean about non mandated light signals.

Actually if you get into the road rules...you will probably find them all illegal.

Because they are not signals in the prescibed form for the prescribed purposes.

"Missleading indication" perhaps.

cheers
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FollowupID: 808978

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:31

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:31
Anybody remember the bongo van on Mad Max.

"We're in trouble now, he had his blinker on"
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FollowupID: 808979

Follow Up By: Member - Andrew & Jen - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:55

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:55
Con-Qld

Having experienced the same thing (being passed while indicating my intention to turn right while on the open road), I shift to the middle of the road (or further if necessary) once I know that no one is in the process of overtaking me (and clearly no one is coming towards me). That way there is no room for overtaking - even for idiots - and they slow up and then go through on the LHS as I swing to the right into the side road.

BTW, I never indicate or advise another driver to overtake. If it is a truck, I will have already been speaking to the driver about what I will do to facilitate them overtaking when they decide to do it.

Cheers
Andrew
1
FollowupID: 808985

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:05

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 23:05
Its not just on contry roads.
2 years ago last november, I got cleaned up by a woman in a turbo subaru who tried to pass me while I was doing a perfectly legal, text book, U turn, in a 60 Kmh zone in the only place on the road it was safe and legal to do so.

I had been slowing and indicating for sometime...she crossed double white lines and drove over a painted island, at speed to get the job done.....then had the timerity to acuse me of doing something dangerous.

her insurance company held out paying till my side slaped photographs of the accident scene, that I supplied on the table.

Some people realy have no idea of what is going on and what is acceptable, what is legal and what is correct practice.

The only thing on her mind was getting past the slower car in front.

If she had not accelerated hard out of the previous intersection, she would have passed by unimpeeded as I was going the other way

Impatience....it would have to be one of the biggest killers on the road.


cheers
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FollowupID: 809014

Reply By: Member - Howard (ACT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:08

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:08
one of the issues is the quick flash is a thing of the past on some newer vehicles as
the blinkers will automaticly flash 3 or 4 times when the indicator is hit.
regards
Howard
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AnswerID: 526672

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:13

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:13
True?..........haven't heard of that. I certainly wouldn't be doing it if that's the case?
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FollowupID: 808940

Follow Up By: Member - Chris_K - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:16

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:16
Yep, Howard is right - lots of the Euro cars have that as standard now...in fact I think the new Commodore has it as well?
1
FollowupID: 808953

Follow Up By: gbc - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 05:59

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 05:59
Yep, the ranger is the same. Quick flick for three flashes. If you hold the stalk down a bit longer it'll cancel after one flash if you want though. Bit technological for some.
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FollowupID: 809022

Reply By: Member - Ian F (WA) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:45

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 16:45
Hi Hairy,
Apart from my military service I only have the basic civy licence.
what amazes me is the number of drivers who stick within a few meters behind heavy vehicles then pull out to look if the road is clear! It scares the crap out of anyone come the opposite way. They don't realise if they can't see your mirrors you can't see them.
A friend of mine stopped driving triples because he was nearly involved in quite a few nasty incidents.
Ian
AnswerID: 526674

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:08

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:08
Im usually in a grader so if I stay on the road, the truck has to come up behind and slow to 47kmh, and then start to pass, it takes too long to get around. the less time they spend on the other side of the road the better I reckon. If I can move over and give him a clear look up the road and plenty of room it just makes things easier for both of us. (these days graders don't have steering wheels and can be a bit twitchy so that extra bit of room is good)
I can estimate how long hes going to take to get past and pick a spot where I can get off the road completely if needed.......its just when everyone else decides they are going to follow like a pack of sheep!
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FollowupID: 808952

Follow Up By: The Bantam - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:37

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:37
Um ..Yeh..a grader is a bit different to most other vehicles.

Not like hitting a guide post, or a couple of pissy pot holes is going to present a problem.

Whole differet story if you are towing a recovered 4wd on a trailer, a caravan or an OD boat.

cheers
0
FollowupID: 808981

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:03

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:03
Yeah? I would have thought it was the same story?
Move over at an appropriate speed, in an appropriate area in appropriate conditions giving the appropriate vehicle the appropriate room..........and just hope everyone else on the road doesn't think its their god given right to move out without looking, without thinking and without using common-sense.........quite similar I would have thought.????
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FollowupID: 809007

Reply By: pop2jocem - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:14

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:14
Not sure what is the rule, custom, excepted behavior or whatever in other countries but as I am driving in Australia and to the best of my knowledge all states thereof, turn indicators are for just that, an indication to other road users your intent to turn either left or right. AFAIK there is no signal to anyone intending to overtake that involves the use of indicator lights.
I will decide when it is safe for me to overtake a slower vehicle and not take a chance that the driver in front is intending to turn left, turn right, signalling me or accidently hit the indicator control while taking a bite out of his lunch.
Personally I use a UHF particularly when I have a truck wanting to get past to let him know I am aware he is there and will assist him as much as I can. Whether his response is positive or otherwise is up to him.
I also find it very useful to get info from wide load escorts coming the other way. Gives me a good warning to find a safe place to pull off and let them by.

Cheers
Pop
AnswerID: 526676

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:14

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:14
Its completely up to the individual weather they take any advice from other road users or not. As I said I always look for myself, but a truck has a lot better vision than a car so when Im driving a car I appreciate the flash....But don't rely on it.

Cheers
1
FollowupID: 808969

Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:49

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:49
You've made a lot of commonsense comments on here Hairy but take it from one who might have been an innocent victim in my teens - the indicator "courtesy" is a crock. A total, utter, complete crock of manure - to make a point of it. Might work in the bush - sometimes, or even most times - but the consequences of error or misunderstanding are simply not worth the risk.

In your discussion with Bantam you've talked about people being patient and using their noggins to determine when its safe to pass. Spot on in my opinion - leave it entirely to the followers to determine if it's safe to pass. You and many others are probably smart and experienced enough to make sure there is virtually no chance of a mishap when you "flash", but many aren't. So next time the same bloke comes up behind a truck or any slow moving vehicle he might easily misinterpret the sign.

In my opinion everyone involved in keeping the "tradition" going is actually contributing - albeit in a very small way - to future near misses and accidents.
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FollowupID: 809052

Reply By: Member - Chris_K - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:15

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 17:15
The other issue that really gets my goat, are people that travel at 80kph towing on a single lane road. Then - when the overtaking lane appears they speed up to 100kph. So you then have to crank it up to 110kph to overtake.... :(

I reckon that's just rude & inconsiderate to other travellers...
AnswerID: 526677

Follow Up By: pop2jocem - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:00

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:00
As a "wobbly" tow er I agree 100%. Just plain ignorant. I ALWAYS pull into the left lane and slow down to give as many as possible a chance to overtake. Especially trucks.

I usually sit between 85 and 90 myself when weather, road conditions and traffic allow. Not going to travel at a speed that I am not comfortable with just to please someone else but doing whatever is possible to let faster traffic past is just plain good road manners.

Cheers
Pop
4
FollowupID: 808966

Follow Up By: Member - Frank P (NSW) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:45

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:45
Ditto that, Pop. And I always have UHF to talk to the truckies, either to ask them about overtaking or to let them know that I know they're waiting to overtake me.

They appreciate that.
FrankP

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Follow Up By: Member - Bruce C (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 13:46

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 13:46
You're dead right there Frank, I do likewise and have never missed getting a thank you from any of the truckies.

Pop and Chris,
I have made a bit of a study of that "speeding up" problem and I think it is because when the road opens up, as it does in dual lanes, you appear to be going slower and some adjust their speed accordingly, when it narrows down again they feel like you are going faster so slow down. That is my take on it.

Then there are the dead ignorant who don't give "a ----".

My rule is, any more than three behind, find somewhere to let them past. That takes the pressure off me then.

I actually drive mainly by the tacho when towing and speedo occasionally for checking the speed relative to the posted limits.

That slowing down and speeding up can also be a passive form of road rage in my opinion if it is done to inconvenience others. It certainly instills rage in other drivers, that's for sure.

Cheers, Bruce
At home and at ease on a track that I know not and
restless and lost on a track that I know. HL.

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Reply By: Member - Outback Gazz - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:35

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:35
G'day Hairy

I hope some politician doesn't read this thread - because it wouldn't be long before they propose a 20 million dollar inquiry into how we Australians conduct our overtaking procedures on country roads. That would then be followed by setting up some sort of "Overtaking Commission" that requires 65 full time public servants looking into how it should be done "safely" - and of course, 15 of them would need to travel overseas for 6 months to see how they do it there.

Then they would in turn liaise with the mob from OH&S who would demand that all people travelling on country roads attend a safety induction meeting prior to departing on there journey and only given the green light to travel after they have completed their risk management assessment form and submitted it to the new Overtaking Commission along with the appropriate fees !

You mentioned that some people get all excited and throw common sense out the window - mate that's exactly where the problem lies - the problem with common sense is that it's not very common !

There only things required when overtaking another vehicle whether it be a road train, a semi, a car/caravan combo or even a motorbike is patience and common sense !

Happy and safe travelling

Gazz
AnswerID: 526680

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:39

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 18:39
Hahahahhahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Too true

Cheers
0
FollowupID: 808972

Follow Up By: Member - Leigh (Vic) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:14

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 19:14
Still trying to work out if you are in the Commonwealth or State system LOL!
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FollowupID: 808975

Follow Up By: Member - Timnivo - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:18

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:18
My family and I were almost killed by a roadtrain 3 years ago in the Pilbara near Nanutarra by this stupid practice of "indicating to go round". I was looking for a track off to the right, slowed down and indicator on. Truck behind didn't slow down and t-boned us as we turned to the right. If it was a dead centre hit we all would have died. Luckily he hit our rear corner, flipped us and spun us off the road. We all walked away but our vehicle was a write off, and the truck undrivable too.

The trouble with this practice is that people start second guessing what the other driver is up to. One day you might get it wrong like the bloke behind us that day. Be careful out there everyone. Timnivo.
2
FollowupID: 808997

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:28

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:28
That's it!.....its all about being careful.....
The place I was talking about in my original thread is so bad I quite often pull over to the left and wait for them to go past If I think they are going to do something stupid.
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FollowupID: 809002

Follow Up By: Lyn W3 - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:51

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:51
Ummm.....I agree with Hairy,

I was looking for a track off to the right, slowed down and indicator on. Truck behind didn't slow down and t-boned us as we turned to the right

You should have known there was a truck behind you but were distracted looking for a track and slowed down in the middle of the road. Pull over to the left and check behind you.
0
FollowupID: 809004

Follow Up By: Bazooka - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 15:16

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 15:16
Without knowing the complete details of Timnivo's situation I seriously doubt the law agrees and I certainly don't, although I would agree you need particular awareness whenever you do slow down on any major road. You never know whether the driver behind is paying attention as he/she should be. You'll (almost) always be legally in the right but that won't matter if you're 6 foot under.
0
FollowupID: 809065

Reply By: Slow one - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:08

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:08
Hairy,
I have no troubles overtaking most things. BUT a grader is another thing.

I have found undertaking a grader is much better than overtaking. That is until he sees you coming and uses his side shift. Then I was taken to the undertaker. Bugger, some grader drivers are just not fun at all.

Tongue in cheek. Don't be tempted to side shift on old pedantic mate.

AnswerID: 526689

Follow Up By: Hairy (NT) - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:24

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 21:24
Bwahahahaha......only if I see ya coming! LOL
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FollowupID: 809000

Reply By: Bob Y. - Qld - Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:23

Monday, Feb 17, 2014 at 22:23
Good thread Hairy. Know where you're coming re grader, though have rarely ever been on public roads with one.

As for indicating to allow others to pass, Guilty as charged, do it all the time, but only in the truck. Give a maximum of 3 flashes, and repeat this a bit further down the road, if they don't react, then they're on their own. Have even flashed a few police vehicles, and got a thanks as they overtook me.

BUT I usually do some thinking about it beforehand. What type of vehicle, where we are, any crests/dips in the distance, whether they're towing etc etc. If it's another truck coming up fast, and I know there's nowhere to pass.......oops, overtake for next 20km or so, then I'll call him through, and back right off myself.

Some people come up behind you, then sit right behind the trailers where you can't see them, so then you have to watch the mirrors, not just scope them, as well as watching the road ahead. Try and flash them when it's safe, so one can relax......a little.

Some members will know the junction of the Flinders & Landsborough H'ways, just east of Cloncurry? On at least 2 occasions, know of road trains indicating to turn off the Flinders onto the L'borough, and have had cars come past them, over the double whites, and on a blind left-hand bend, that is also on a crest. The 'trains have been backed right off, to 20-30 clicks, to make the turn.

Another time a bloke in a Korean SUV towing an ugly grey Coromal pop-top, followed me for 40 km to Winton, then as I entered the town I backed off to make a right hand turn, to do a "blocky", to pick up my sangers and thermos from home. Right indicator on, and just about to execute the turn, when here's Ol' mate, out in the right lane and just about to get his bonnet crushed, and his wife badly injured. Of course, no UHF in his rig, so couldn't abuse him or update his breeding.

Think while ever we've still got fossil fuels we'll still have these problems, Hairy.

Bob.

Seen it all, Done it all.
Can't remember most of it.

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AnswerID: 526694

Reply By: Iza B - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 07:58

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 07:58
I remain amazed that some think the random flashing of indicator lights will accurately transmit some message about the state of the road ahead.

Iza
AnswerID: 526703

Follow Up By: Les PK Ranger - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:58

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:58
I suppose many do it as a good old Aussie courtesy, right or wrong.
Like a flash headlights when passing, which could mean a mob of roos around a bend, an accident ahead, bad bit of road, even the traditional speed trap warning.
(I suppose that little flash of headlights could have the same effect, slowing the other party, or at least making them more cautious, for the next few ks.)

Steve M1 (NSW) posted: In Italy, France and Switzerland etc, particularly on alpine roads, they normally sound their horn to let the car in front know they are about to overtake.

Steve, the roads of Nepal, Bhutan, and surrounding countries have a very big habit if this, believe me !! :D

Yes, using indicators can be fraught with danger, especially as there are no set ways and means for the signals, it's a hotpotch of methods, and so many things can be misconstrued (as seen in the above posts).

Another example . . . how many on a dark night, with a vehicle say a km behind (and staying there), use a one / two flash indicate left / right as applicable, and a light touch on the brake pedal to light those up for a second, when they see a roo L/R close to the road verge ?
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FollowupID: 809039

Reply By: Member - PJR (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:41

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:41
Confusing. Leave the signals as is and butt out with your new ideas from overseas. Forget what the signals of the past were. And don't use the new ones either. How anyone would think that a couple of flashes on the LEFT indicator means that I can move RIGHT and overtake is beyond me. A few, yes just a FEW, on the right indicator made sense.

Better still!!!
After browsing this thread it is blatantly clear to me that we need to change our ways.

We need to get out of the "other" persons car and just drive our own car. Be responsible, courteous (that means friendly) and let them worry about their car. Don't pull off the road and throw rocks at the car behind. No more indicating for anything other than I want to change lanes, turn left or turn right. No "waving" the blinkers any more to say thanks to the bloke who helped you over take.

Just drive our own car, be considerate and mindfull of others and don't be selfish.

Phil

(I miss the old ways, the wave to the bloke going other way or the farmer in the paddock, or the the you can overtake now signal)
AnswerID: 526710

Follow Up By: Allan B (Member, SunCoast) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:47

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 09:47
Yep, I know where your'e coming from Phil. It's a changing world I'm afraid. But I'm happy to receive the wave from the Old Bugger in the chair near your signature.
Cheers
Allan

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Follow Up By: Member - PJR (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 10:14

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 10:14
Mate!! And I would even consider waving back. "Now don't you worry about that!!!". Joe someone said that I think.

I don't mind sharing the road. Not at all. But it was nice of the RTA to make the road for little old me in the first place. Butttt I will be a nice old bugger and share.

It is so easy to be friendly, sharing and courteous. What is it with some people. Will the blokes down the pub or the girls in the gym think you as a softie or what!! We worry about image sometimes more that what is important. And then fold in a good measure of attitude and ego and out comes a good old serving of road rage. Hmmmm. No matter what indicators you use you could get pushed off the road.

Just go back to your own car and enjoy the company. You know I feel lonely without Sue in the car. Funny isn't it.

Take care Allan and Hi to Roz.

Phil
1
FollowupID: 809040

Follow Up By: Gnomey - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 10:22

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 10:22
Ah yes the good old days. Back in the 70s I was given the sacred knowledge of the indicator flash by a guy who had driven semis. One flash right to say pass if you want to. One flash left and right to say thanks after passing. (I would interpret a single flash left to mean, "I know you're keen but don't even think about it".)

Driving, especially the Troopy, I signal as above but.... I have become more hesitant to give the go ahead, even to single vehicles. Though if I think they are good to go I'll often move over as far left as is sensible to let them see better. A wave or a beep is sometimes given but a lot just take it as entitlement. Have to say that burns.

In more recent years I noticed trucks flashing the headlights as another truck passed and I took this to mean it's safe to pull back in. For a while I did the same, especially for doubles but again the frequent lack of thanks suggested to me it wasn't worth the bother.

Of course without a radio who really knows what's going on but it seems like common knowledge and courtesy aren't that common any more.

Cheers
Mark
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FollowupID: 809042

Follow Up By: Member - PJR (NSW) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:04

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:04
I was thinking of the 60's mate. You younguns!!!

I will use the radio though, then you can tell them that you will pull back, if needed, and give let them in earlier.

But I am flamboozled to undertsand how a blink LEFT means it's okey to go to the RIGHT. Buggers me.

Have a good one Mark.

Phil
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Follow Up By: Gnomey - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 12:30

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 12:30
Cripes. Getting old seems to be happening fast enough for me. :)

"Have a good one Mark."

And you mate.

Cheers
Mark
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FollowupID: 809056

Follow Up By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 13:52

Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 13:52
well PJ, we wouldn't want to do what nasty foreigners do eh? They have their system which works pretty well on the whole (obviously some exceptions) We can't even negotiate roundabouts without having an endless debate/nervous breakdown, never mind a uniform code that everyone understands. It is actually possible to stick to a consistent system but some dinosaurs will never change. Y'now, the idiots who plod along the middle lane of a motorway at 80 kph. Familiar? Try to have a debate without frothing at the mouth mate, it isn't good for you.
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FollowupID: 809150

Reply By: Aussi Traveller - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 10:36

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 10:36
The way I see it is, if you are following a truck, road train, caravan etc, you will almost always see that sign, ( If you can't see my mirrors I can't see you ) keeping that in mind, if you are in that position so as the driver in front can see you there is more than a good chance you have a reasonable chance of seeing the road ahead and its conditions.

so if the vehicle in front flashes you should have a reasonable idea of those conditions and then make a educated decision as to over take or not.

If you are following a large vehicle at for argument sake 100 kph, on an open highway, given that they can see you there ( not tucked in right behind them) then the vehicle in front flashes their lights either left or right, you then nudge over to have a better look, you can see the road ahead and see it is clear, but hang on is he going to turn, your not sure, well there a few indicators that he is or isn't and they are very easy to foresee, 1: you have had time to see in front and notice no cars coming the other way, and you are still doing 100 kph, 2: You don't see any brake lights, and 3 : you don't see any obvious side roads etc, one should in sound mind be able to make a educated risk assessment as to over take or not.

There just my thoughts anyway.

Phil.
AnswerID: 526714

Follow Up By: Aussi Traveller - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:09

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:09
I forgot to mention that I give a quick flash of the high beam to say I am coming around as well.
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Reply By: Lyn W3 - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 13:46

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 13:46
Think I'll just run with the Hazard lights on, headlights on, fog lights on and touch the brake peddle every now and then and I'll have all the bases covered.

Just get out of the way!!!
AnswerID: 526725

Follow Up By: Allan B (Member, SunCoast) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 14:08

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 14:08
And maybe fly a Hell's Angels flag??
Cheers
Allan

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FollowupID: 809061

Reply By: Kumunara (NT) - Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:30

Tuesday, Feb 18, 2014 at 16:30
Good rant Hairy - Well said.
Life's great and it just keeps getting better

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AnswerID: 526736

Follow Up By: MactrolPod - Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 16:41

Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 16:41
x2,

If I'm out on the road I want to share it with you and people like you.

Some of these responses astound me.
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Reply By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 14:01

Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 14:01
Maybe if the RTA or whoever had a national publicity campaign with ads on tv and newspapers, laying down a code of conduct regarding this, we'd all be reading from the same page. Trouble is despite spending millions on "safety cameras" they just don't really care about our safety.
AnswerID: 526796

Follow Up By: Dave(NSW) - Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 15:45

Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 15:45
Safety cameras make them money, Publicity campaigns cost money.

Cheers Dave
GU RULES!!

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FollowupID: 809162

Follow Up By: Steve M1 (NSW) - Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 17:10

Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 17:10
bingo...........in a nutshell

;)
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Follow Up By: Dingojim - Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 19:10

Wednesday, Feb 19, 2014 at 19:10
MactrolPod you and me both mate. With the amount of conflicting ideas aired on this thread I will believe nothing that I see and treat anything I hear with suspicion.
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FollowupID: 809184

Follow Up By: Member - Munji - Saturday, Feb 22, 2014 at 15:40

Saturday, Feb 22, 2014 at 15:40
It never ceases to amaze me that people will rely on the judgement of the driver of the vehicle in front of them to overtake based on a flashing light.
Next they will be suing the driver if he/her gets it wrong and there is a tragic outcome.
If people refused to overtake when given the signal, this unsafe practice may slowly fade away.
Let's hope.
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FollowupID: 809381

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